Members Bucksstudent Posted November 14, 2014 Members Share Posted November 14, 2014 By the way, let me say that Ratae has done a great job. If anyone is qualified to be an Admin around here, it's him. He actually sympathizes with problems, appears to have human emotions other than contempt or anger, and makes good contributions as a member/poster. And I know my behavior could be erratic at times. Nine years of depression gave me ups and downs on the internet, but I think I'm just being honest here. I don't hear any complaints about Ratae like I do with other Mods/Admins either. Just go to the openjam.net if you want a more renegade opinion on the moderation of this forum. I don't think it's all terrible, but it definitely drove a lot of people away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Chordite Posted November 14, 2014 Members Share Posted November 14, 2014 An admin can scare an entire forum away if they mess up. One mod dictat that nearly drove me off a while back was " Electric guitar posts only here please! " Which I thought was over the top, by making the fora here too 'compartmentalized' you eliminate a lot of band context stuff or inspirational music (like my unplugged thread today) . As musicians we function in a context. But we never get input from keyboard players, drummers or singers because there are too many cupboards in this kitchen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members billybilly Posted November 14, 2014 Members Share Posted November 14, 2014 lol... I guess he did do a lot of good things, never thought of it that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members knotty Posted November 14, 2014 Members Share Posted November 14, 2014 agree. good point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MaceWindu57 Posted November 14, 2014 Members Share Posted November 14, 2014 If you cannot get your point across eloquently without resorting to profanity, then perhaps it's time to expand your vocabulary. I'm no prude, but why be crude all the time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Steve2112 Posted November 14, 2014 Members Share Posted November 14, 2014 One mod dictat that nearly drove me off a while back was " Electric guitar posts only here please! " Which I thought was over the top, by making the fora here too 'compartmentalized' you eliminate a lot of band context stuff or inspirational music (like my unplugged thread today) . As musicians we function in a context. But we never get input from keyboard players ( Korg DSS-1 was why I initially joined HC btw) drummers or singers because there are too many cupboards in this kitchen. Yes..the software fluckups certainly were aggravating. People didn't like BLUE borders or "grrray" fake guitar players plastered all over the place. But ti was also the shift in suggested or even censored content. Yes...the traffic was a TON more back then. And we all had a jolly great time. SPicy chicken sandwiches and ex-girlfriend antics. It really was more facebook and IM than a musician's resource. And like I said all well and good until the new owners don't want it. So OP...if you are still reading input in your newest thread...I suggest making a better. bigger contribution. As was said, there are plenty of other places to chit chat and socialize. You even have GAB which a few of the old fellas made after HC imploded. But if you want to talk guitars amps and music...this is still a good place. I've been posting more myself and there's some good peeps still here. It is only what you make it. Since you;ve been here so long, you;d know that HC wasn;t always so big. And they also endured at least one other implosion. It was built up by the forum members...and maybe it will be again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ancient Mariner Posted November 14, 2014 Members Share Posted November 14, 2014 I've pondered this long and, well, not especially hard, but a little. The nature of the typical internet user has changed, and as much as anything, that's really altered the way forums are(n't) populated these days. I've been around HC since 2000 or 2001, had a change of username at some stage. In the earliest days most of the guys using the internet were technically able, computers were out of reach of many households and certainly of children and until the mid 2000s it was like a technically elite club of musicians, almost all smart (there were exceptions) interesting and interested. It was also a wild frontier, since the forum had been a hobby for a couple of guys in the beginning & grown out of all proportion to what they'd exected, so it was largely self-policing too (at least from a user's perception). By the end of the 2000s the nature of the internet had changed. Computers had become commonplace, easy to use and quite boring, access through broadband was fast & cheap and the world & his wife (and offspring) were now online. No more forums as places of geeky exclusivity, and no more 1337 59e4k jokes. There's another factor too - those of us who discovered this place through OLGA were 10 years older than when it had been new & fun, and despite all the comments about musicians not growing up, a lot of us had. By this time the forum was getting significant moderation, having been bought by GC, and many of the key players had either already gone or were going. Even though numbers at this point were high, possibly still peaking, HC as it was had already begun to die and the rest was the momentum left over from the pioneer era with a few stalwarts who carried on anyway. It wasn't the wild frontier anymore, but seemed to have become a place for 15YOs to come on and try trolling the regulars. Moderation became intrusive, people got frustrated, the forum began to be an ugly place. My heart went out to Fretsie at that time, because he was trying to to an impossible job, and do it with love & integrity. Then came the screw-ups with the forum software. Really stupid stuff. People apparently got paid money (we're talking about web designers here) to put together things that badly didn't work for ridiculous reasons, embarrassingly stupid reasons that 30sec of thought should have spotted (like nested comments getting narrower until they were too narrow to be useful). That and the moderation killed the momentum left in the corpse, the result being the quiet backwater that's HC Mk V or however many versions there have been. So why isn't everyone coming back now the stoopid stuff is fixed? The internet isn't the same place it was 15 years ago, and it's flooded with ordinary people accessing through mobile devices all the time. No-one cares that you're a geek on a computer, living on the wild frontier of technology. Forums are now old hat, and the mountain biking forum I used to be part of - where my name came from - once a major force in British cycling, is now a sleepy backwater too. There were a dozen spin-off forums from HC, most of which are a little less controlled, all specialising in particular areas, all similarly quiet. Facebook never really had an impact on HC, though a few of the old regulars still meet in a post-HC group there. But the internet has changed, defamation laws apply online, and it's now 21st century consumer suburbia. All those who was to live on the wild frontier will have gone to Disapsora, Redmatrix, Friendica, Libertree etc, where people talk about conspiracy theories and how oppressive western governments are. All the rest... Well many of the musicians will have got a life, probably making music somewhere. Or maybe found love, got married, settled down happy with a job, 2.5 kids and a bunch of happy memories & their rig in a cupboard. The loonies and sef-publicists have gone elsewhere to have their breakdowns or feed their egos. And that leaves the few of us who remember how things were and come back to talk about stuff now & again. And admire Freeman's amazing guitar builds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dendy Jarrett Posted November 14, 2014 Members Share Posted November 14, 2014 Ancient Mariner: You hit the nail quite nicely on the head. All of your thoughts said, however, many are returning to forums now as they tire of the intrusive (ala big brother) tactics of social media sites. (BTW) we don't collect data on you here, other than that which you give up in your signature of by the forum you participate in ... be it a drum forum, we figure you are a drummer ... yet I digress).I am hopeful that people will come back and participate. To your point, we had to curb language and images because as you say, people of youth (and I mean youth) now all have devices and access to stuff, that those of us in our 50's would have never imagined would be accessible. In the end, the community is "YOU GUYS" We have run for the last year on the notion that: "if we rebuild it ... they will come." Hopeful that you guys will spread the word. Thanks for your feedback and as an "ancient mariner" I am glad you didn't come in "cussing like an old sailor" !! D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Virgman Posted November 14, 2014 Members Share Posted November 14, 2014 So' date=' traffic is down, because we can't curse? Really......[/quote'] No, traffic is down because the forum is cursed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ancient Mariner Posted November 14, 2014 Members Share Posted November 14, 2014 Dendy - my natural reaction was "they ain't comin' back" but I've just been on another forum, and that made me think. The other thing I did and do again is photography, and there's a UK photography forum (almost exclusively brits) that's really busy and popular, both in terms of numbers and of the 'stars' that use it (I believe this years Landscape Photographer of the year is a member, and it's packed with pros in all fields). In terms of moderation and rule enforcement it's brutal, and the membership is frequently just as brutal so that they NEED the rules enforcing to stop verbal fisticuffs all the time. There are a few junior members, who have access carefully controlled as well. They never had a crash like HC, but (as far as I can tell) never had a golden time without moderation either. I don't know why a forum works for this particular group of people when many others really don't, but it does. Maybe there's hope for a resurgence here after all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Chordite Posted November 14, 2014 Members Share Posted November 14, 2014 The other thing I did and do again is photography, and there's a UK photography forum (almost exclusively brits) that's really busy and popular, both in terms of numbers and of the 'stars' that use it (I believe this years Landscape Photographer of the year is a member, and it's packed with pros in all fields). In terms of moderation and rule enforcement it's brutal, and the membership is frequently just as brutal so that they NEED the rules enforcing to stop verbal fisticuffs all the time. There are a few junior members, who have access carefully controlled as well. Hmm I left a photo forum If I go back the first person to say "My Biotar 2/58 has a great Bokeh" will find the censors skill tested to the limit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dendy Jarrett Posted November 14, 2014 Members Share Posted November 14, 2014 Just like all of you I too have other interest and frequent another forum. We have noticed there an increase again as people are deciding to use FB as a place to keep in touch with old classmates, family and friends, but not a constant barometer of their daily lives. Ancient Mariner, people coming back can be as simply as people informing old members, that the place is getting polished up (and I don't mean polishing a turd ... I know your minds went there ... Virgman- we at one time had the curse of the fleas of a thousand camels, but we have been burning incense and lifting prayers and I believe we may have her if she don't jump. In the end community is community. Musicians are a special group. I mentioned having other interest and I do, but I don't see near the bond in other activities that I do with Musicians. We are a one of a kind crowd. D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Floyd Rosenbomb Posted November 15, 2014 Members Share Posted November 15, 2014 At any rate, I like the way the place is going. It was a bummer to watch it get killed but I'm optimistic. There are some good posters here. Carry on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members badpenguin Posted November 15, 2014 Members Share Posted November 15, 2014 I agree with Floyd, I just hope there isn't another update, costing me more post and reviews. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Virgman Posted November 15, 2014 Members Share Posted November 15, 2014 Just the fact that I'm here should be enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members billybilly Posted November 15, 2014 Members Share Posted November 15, 2014 If you cannot get your point across eloquently without resorting to profanity' date=' then perhaps it's time to expand your vocabulary. I'm no prude, but why be crude all the time?[/quote'] Phukk You! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Idunno Posted November 15, 2014 Members Share Posted November 15, 2014 I've never been on any social media sites. I've been prompted to join by friends and acquaintances but all that did was put me off their collective characters, respectively, to lesser or greater extents. That left me with the guitar-related forums and their less than stellar representation/application of control. That cat that ended up as the mod at the acoustic guitar forum was a ghost, a name, a figment and everything else short of an actual human being in residence. Whether lacking the backbone for it or otherwise in hiding for fear of association detrimental to his other undertakings, he just didn't take the position's responsibility seriously. Even a hodaddy would have at least made an attempt. Am I getting the message across here? But... We're sure robo-mothering will assuage the tendered-eyed marms by culling out the old school foul mouthed toughs. Right. More like auto-modding to assure the mods don't have to participate. Oh, did I give an example of that already? Besides, all it fucking takes is a little use of the features of the site to defeat the auto-mommying rendering the latter and its defenders as targets of their own methods. Ah, well, progress is nice I suppose. I don't normally draw focus to the silliness of the site's claimed improvements, or its champions thereof, as maliciously as the foregoing but it does need to be in plain view from time to time. Honesty is the best policy, after all, though YMMV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members knotty Posted November 15, 2014 Members Share Posted November 15, 2014 What? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dendy Jarrett Posted November 15, 2014 Members Share Posted November 15, 2014 Guys: I appreciate the fun (or phun) as it pulls from the creative side which makes you musicians, but let's try to be sensitive to the real reason we are keeping it "cleaner" here ... which is not to suppress your adultness, but to protect those who visit with youth-ness. ThanksD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mnewb1 Posted November 15, 2014 Members Share Posted November 15, 2014 I would certainly love to see the site return to some of its former glory, and would like to see some of the old names pop up again and start participating, more new gear, more GAS, more posting clips of their music, experiments, etc... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Danhedonia Posted November 15, 2014 Members Share Posted November 15, 2014 "This is not censorship." Of course it is. See: http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/censor... definition 2. "This is privately owned." Yes; and that does give you the right to censor as you see fit. The trainwreck that was the platform shifts certainly didn't help things, but I think it's denying the truth that the 'management' of the site had a huge impact on why this forum still lacks vitality. * The communication around the software issues was disrespectful and dishonest. * The attempt to 'put the harmony back in Harmony Central' - has resulted in a whitewashed, dulled, more conservative vision for the forum overall. That's not about profanity but a reduced sense of diversity. And diversity is what makes online forums go. I have no issues whatsoever with the owner of a website saying "this is my site, I will run it as I see fit." But when they treat those with whom they disagree with disrespect, well, .... respect is a two-way street. The dishonesty around the software issues - as well as some of the language used - struck me as disrespectful of peoples' time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JTEES4 Posted November 16, 2014 Members Share Posted November 16, 2014 Cursing all the time is just a coverup for not knowing enough other words. It's also getting old, is not edgy, and makes a person look stupid. I curse, everyone curses....but there is no need to curse all the time in public. And yes, this is public. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members arcadesonfire Posted November 17, 2014 Members Share Posted November 17, 2014 "having an opinion and not being scared to express it" hehe... I think about this all the time when reading reviews of guitar gear. There aren't any reviews in magazines that say "this is a terrible pedal, don't buy it," because the magazines are sponsored by the manufacturers! So the reviewers are constrained to say nice things.... Anyway, i spend 99% of my time here in the adults-only political party, and people express their opinions there for sure. Buuut, I actually appreciate the heavier moderation there, cuz now it ain't just a free-for-all call-each-other-names fest. People have to say worthy things or be banned. Nevertheless, the corporate takeover has indeed sucked tons of traffic out of all the HC forums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mistersully Posted November 17, 2014 Members Share Posted November 17, 2014 i don't care about the censorship... other people obviously cared enough to leave over it i've been really busy with family stuff, but i intend to hang in there with this community...i feel no loyalty to the site, or the people that run it... but i do to the community i hope things improve, traffic wise... i doubt it will ever be what it was... but that doesn't mean it can't be something cool Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Ratae Corieltauvorum Posted November 17, 2014 Moderators Share Posted November 17, 2014 If you cannot get your point across eloquently without resorting to profanity' date=' then perhaps it's time to expand your vocabulary. I'm no prude, but why be crude all the time?[/quote'] Is profanity merely bad language? I think not, you should visit Ireland sometimes, there's something for everyone, we'll leave no one out in the cold, hungry or thirsty and we'll swear all day long:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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