And then...depression set in

[jwlussow]

That, my friend, is a true musician

[snoggin]

"t this point in my life, I realize that I have had more success than tons of other guys have had, and that's good enough for me. Now, well into my 50s, I play as much as I want, ride my motorcycle not as much as I want, spend time with my wife and grown kids, and live my life the way I want. I have no regrets about my decisions in music. If I have any regrets at all, it's not getting my degree and establishing a career where I could earn better money, good benefits, and be able to retire. Currently, I'll never be able to retire, because I put all my eggs in the musician basket for far too long. But it was my choice and I'll live with it."

 

 

 

I dont know pat,, I put the guitar down when i was 22 because my lifestyle and being a msuician didnt jibe.. Ihad substance issues.. I was a carpenter then and continued.. I got sober at 30 and started a business which was pretty much wildly succesful.. I had fifteen guys and doing millions in the design build realm in san francisco.

 

Nothing is guaranteed, though.. Now i still have a nice house , cars and etc but my retirement is no longer assured anyway. I am most likely going to have to downsize big time.

 

I picked the guitar back up about three years ago and I dont know. I'd have to consider giving music a go if I had the choice.. Obviously I couldnt desert the family but I would try and figure out how to make it work. I'm putting out a cd so thats step one.. I never figured I'd even get there. I am 51 now but my motto is " you only live once" so I want to do my best at it and try not to have a lot of regret abouut if only I'd tried this or that.

 

Life is short

[TrickyBoy]

BlueStat,

Your story was a really great read. It's funny how at age 18, I had the option to go for it, but I went to college instead. Stupid me even had the option to go to some pretty good music schools, but I decided for a variety of reasons not to go that route. Now at 38, I have a great professional career, great wife and and I'm pretty secure with my retirement.

Still going through my head is "what if I had tried to make a go of it". I think in a way, the grass is always greener on the other side.

The thing that idiots such as GuitarFlyer fail to realize/understand, is that for every person who actually makes it to the point that they spend their entire career as a musician, there are thousands who never get there. It's a huge gamble. Not wanting to take that risk doesn't make you a wimp, in a lot of ways it means you were responsible in your decision making.

As an aside, that is related to GuitarFlyer but not to the rest of my post, what kind of immature ****** "cuts heads" anymore. Music isn't competition. It's about following your muse. People who don't get that are just wallowing in {censored} IMO.

[musicmanmu]

Great story, BlueStrat:thu: Although I'm younger (just turned 32), a lot of it rings true for me as it does TrickyBoy.

 

I played music locally all throughout college. I had the chance to get a full ride to graduate school, but turned it down to go on tour with the band I was in at the time. We had a good regional following and the guitarist had some connections. After a good 9 months of living on the road, arguing, not seeing friends, eating like a bum, etc, etc...I decided that this wasn't the life for me. After a big blowout with the guitarist, I quit, went back to graduate school and started a new band that would write tunes, do covers, play when we wanted and just have fun. That band is still going along today, although we don't play nearly as much.

 

I now have a wife, a great job, I'm going to get my Ph.D. next year and I'm pretty secure. I, like you, can sleep at night knowing that I really got to experience some of that life, and turned my back to it without any qualms or "what if's." It's a good feeling:thu:

[musicmanmu]

 

As an aside, that is related to GuitarFlyer but not to the rest of my post, what kind of immature ****** "cuts heads" anymore. Music isn't competition. It's about following your muse. People who don't get that are just wallowing in {censored} IMO.

 

 

It's been my experience that guys who think like this are the {censored}tiest of players (and people) anyway:rolleyes:

[jwlussow]

It's been my experience that guys who think like this are the {censored}tiest of players (and people) anyway:rolleyes:

 

 

True. I

[Flogger59]

It's been my experience that guys who think like this are the {censored}tiest of players (and people) anyway:rolleyes:

 

 

I worked in music stores either in retail or wholesale for nearly 30 years, I was always "out of step" for thinking that music is a cooperative venture.

[3shiftgtr]

But it was my choice and I'll live with it. Sorry it's so long winded, but I hope this clears it up for you.

One thing fly boy doesn't get in his music/flying analogy is that a life in art has many, forms. And that particular form has nothing to do the quality of the art produced.

Also, is it more heroic to be a 'silent hero' and be around to raise the kids you made, or go on the road, work your ass off to achieve fame?

My time on the road showed me a bunch of guys who have massive distances between them and their families. They missed all the big "kid events" and that created a divide that couldn't be bridged. I would come home and my kid would look different. Suddenly the baby is talking, and someone taught the 3rd grader to field a ground ball. The first time you come home it's "YAY!! Daddy's home! We missed you so much!!!!" Then it was "Hey Dad, how was your trip?" Then it was "Oh, hi Dad." as they look up for a sec from Nintendo. You miss a birthday or two and the feeling in your stomach is of a yearning that speaks the truth. {censored} THIS! I'll find another way. And I did.

So my hat is off to Blue, and any other muso who happens to make great art in the midst of making a great family. That is where the real heroes in music lie, IMHO.

[musicmanmu]

One thing fly boy doesn't get in his music/flying analogy is that a life in art has many, forms. And that particular form has nothing to do the quality of the art produced. Also, is it more heroic to be a 'silent hero' and be around to raise the kids you made, or go on the road, work your ass off to achieve fame? My time on the road showed me a bunch of guys who have massive distances between them and their families. They missed all the big "kid events" and that created a divide that couldn't be bridged. I would come home and my kid would look different. Suddenly the baby is talking, and someone taught the 3rd grader to field a ground ball. The first time you come home it's "YAY!! Daddy's home! We missed you so much!!!!" Then it was "Hey Dad, how was your trip?" Then it was "Oh, hi Dad." as they look up for a sec from Nintendo. You miss a birthday or two and the feeling in your stomach is of a yearning that speaks the truth. {censored} THIS! I'll find another way. And I did. So my hat is off to Blue, and any other muso who happens to make great art in the midst of making a great family. That is where the real heroes in music lie, IMHO.

 

A round of applause for you, sir.

[rhat]

Yeah, don't want to get rhat stirred up again, since flying is beyond the comprehension of everybody but the select few. :poke:

 

 

Including you there buckwheat. daddy baby sat you through a few take offs and landings. Unless he signed your medical and said ,, well son , ,go shoot me three take offs and landings solo ,, it aint {censored}. Why didnt he solo you?

[cooterbrown]

 

Including you there buckwheat. daddy baby sat you through a few take offs and landings. Unless he signed your medical and said ,, well son , ,go shoot me three take offs and landings solo ,, it aint {censored}. Why didnt he solo you?

 

 

Seriously, Tim...just stfu, already. I though you were better than that...you're showing a serious ugly streak that I've never seen from you

and I'm in too good a mood to give a rip about your chest-thumping, patronizing taunts.

 

My Dad never "babysat" me, he treated me like an equal.

He was (and still is) one of the coolest people I've ever known.

Would you solo your child when he/she had less than eight hours of flight time? How careless and reckless would that be?

 

So you can fly a plane, big deal, I can run {censored}ing rings around you on the keys, but so what?

Doesn't make me better than you, nor you better than me.

I understand your life is stressful, right now, but you need to get over it, dude...nobody wants to read your self-aggrandizing bull{censored}, anymore.

[musicmanmu]

Can we hug it out, fellas?

[flemtone]

Including you there buckwheat. daddy baby sat you through a few take offs and landings. Unless he signed your medical and said ,, well son , ,go shoot me three take offs and landings solo ,, it aint {censored}. Why didnt he solo you?

That was uncalled-for. Bad form.

[rhat]

Seriously, Tim...just stfu, already. I though you were better than that...you're showing a serious ugly streak that I've never seen from you and I'm in too good a mood to give a rip about your chest-thumping, patronizing taunts. My Dad never "babysat" me, he treated me like an equal. He was (and still is) one of the coolest people I've ever known. Would you solo your child when he/she had less than eight hours of flight time? How careless and reckless would that be? So you can fly a plane, big deal, I can run {censored}ing rings around you on the keys, but so what? Doesn't make me better than you, nor you better than me. I understand your life is stressful, right now, but you need to get over it, dude...nobody wants to read your self-aggrandizing bull{censored}, anymore.

 

 

 

Whatever cooter,,, you seem pretty proud of what you have done with music,, yet come on here and seem to think that because your dad let you saw around on the controls of an airplane that its just not a big deal that some people spend the time money and effort to get an ATP rating. daddy let me land and flying is easy . I got news for you ,,, anyone that made flying a career in the general aviation side of things ,, let any slack jaw moron with 15 or 20 bucks for an intro lesson all let them think they could fly the plane really well. Only thing they didnt tell them that they were not flying the plane ,,, The instructor had the rudders,, he would adj the trim ,, and tweek the power settings ,, and at the last second feed a little back pressure in for a nice touch down. cooter ,, you are a good guy ,, but like I said ,, you dont really know squat about flying. Just enough to think you do.,

Sorry guy but thats the cold hard truth. No big deal. Again I will ask the question ,, why didnt your dad solo you. I mean It only takes 12 or 13 hours of instruction ,,, in the old days in taildraggers they did it in 8 due to the fact that those planes did have avionics.

[modulusman]

Damn, I was hoping Rhat lost his computer during the move.

[gspointer]

General aviation must be a bit different. I have had the good fortune of working with a bunch of Vietnam era fighter, recon and helicopter pilots, none came off like the gen-av. guys here. They all still flew, I guess after being shot at, and shot down in a couple of casaes, as well as flying in weather you have no business flying in, everything else isn't that big of deal to them. The Nam era guys have now retired, and as Rhat said most of the ex-military guys do try for gigs in the airlines. Some fly freight, but I don't personally know any that fly corporate.

[BlueStrat]

Obviously I couldnt desert the family but I would try and figure out how to make it work.

 

And that's the hardest part. As musicians, we want it all- a successful career in music doing our own stuff on our own terms, a happy marriage, well-adjusted kids, steady income, decent house, dependable rigs to drive, and so on. And I just don't know how that works. I tried my ass off to find that balance and I never could. It always comes down to the fact that the guys who are successful doing what I wanted to do are gone 200-300 days a year, and most of them are divorced. What 3shiftgtr said is gospel, in my experience.

 

I thought there was a way to make my CDs, promote them, do regional stuff until I got popular enough to get the attention of a label or management team, and then I'd skip all that slugging it out at the semi and lower national level and go right to playing on big tours and making the big dollars. Even with all the experience I had at the local/regional/touring level, I was unprepared for the level of politics, backstabbing, ass-kissing, quid pro quo, etc I encountered even at the lowest levels of playing with national acts. It's a bit like coming up through the minor leagues in baseball, only in music, there is no set path- there might be 4 levels you pass through, or there might be 40, but at each one, you're starting out at the bottom, having to prove yourself all over again, with the above mentioned politics and slander etc even worse. Instead of opening a festival at noon on Friday or closing it at 6 pm on Sunday playing to nobody 100 miles from home, you're doing it halfway across the country. But you do it to get your name on the posters and shirts and other schwag, and to be able to say you did it to move up the ladder.

 

We talk a lot about 'banding together' and 'the brotherhood of musicians' here. Well, I experienced very little of it. What I saw was somewhere between indifference and hostility from national acts I opened for. A few of them were nice guys- John Mayall, Charlie Musselwhite, John Hammond, and a couple of others. But to most of them, you're an inconvenience they have to deal with before they play, as well as money out of their pockets they could be making if you weren't there getting paid. But those guys weren't the biggest pain, it was the other bands you have to compete with to get the gigs. They (or their management) will undercut you, slander you, bribe the event bookers/producers with gifts, and all sorts of things to get an advantage. I got word from my agent that one big festival I had tried to get into for years wouldn't hire me because the producer had been told by someone in another band that I was strung out on booze and meth, even though I've been clean and sober for 32 years. Another big festival guy hinted that a box of Cuban cigars would go a long way to getting us on stage.

 

I still believe it's possible to be a well-known guy and be at home most of the time, but I haven't figured out how. I gave up trying, because at my age, I'm starting to develop health issues. I'm currently undergoing testing to find out why certain things are happening with me, and they won't say much until they have results, so I won't speculate here, but suffice it to say I'm a bit worried. But it is what it is, and it makes me realize how unimportant chasing 'the dream' is to me today.

 

I know I put way too many eggs in the 'musician' basket for far too long, and I'm reaping what I've sown today. I'll never be able to retire, I'll likely never make more money than I am now, I gig today because I have to to pay bills, and it's only because I married a good woman (27 years now) with a good job with benefits and retirement that we were able to own a home and raise our kids.

 

Still, my experience is my own, and I won't ridicule anyone for chasing their dream, and won't presume to tell them when it's time to let it go, if that time ever comes. In fact, I'll cheer you on. I'd love to see one of us poor sons of bitches here do something big!

[musicmanmu]

I still believe it's possible to be a well-known guy and be at home most of the time, but I haven't figured out how.

 

Youtube.

[BlueStrat]

Youtube.

Now why didn't think of that? I could be the next Happenstance!

[Ryan.]

I can ride a unicycle.

[musicmanmu]

Happenfail! Love it.

[cooterbrown]

General aviation must be a bit different. I have had the good fortune of working with a bunch of Vietnam era fighter, recon and helicopter pilots, none came off like the gen-av. guys here.

 

Judging from the self-defensive animal-in-a-corner lashing out, it's obviously something akin to penis envy.

 

Guys like rhat have never flown at Mach 2, been on 15-minute alert in case the Commies decided to invade, or been in dogfights with enemy planes and evading SAM crews, or ground forces with rifles and rockets, who were all out to turn your plane into a burning hulk of scrap metal.

How would rhat have handled a complete hydraulic failure at 600mph, followed by a chute failure(emergency chute worked), and an undeployed raft (Dad had to pry the raft box open with his combat knife enough to get the lanyard out to inflate it), then float around in the bitterly cold Sea of Japan until an Okinawan fishing boat plucked him out?

 

I'm sure that's something rhat can totally understand...not.

[wades_keys]

I've got an uncle that made his career in the Navy as a test pilot.

What sucks is that he can't talk about what planes he flew except in the most general of terms.

Oh well.

Based on a few vague descriptions in a conversation I had with him back in the 80's, I'm pretty certain he flew the SR-71 before its existence was acknowledged.

Navy pilots tend to be relatively short too: there's a height cutoff if I recall somewhere around 5'10".

I always did want to be a pilot, but my vision sucks badly.

[BATCAT]

Hey guys... tempers seem to be a little short around here this week. I know some of you enjoy a little internet jousting, but in the interest of people not getting too riled up, lets try to keep the tone on the friendly side, or at least the civil side. Even if you feel the person in question is asking for it.

This isn't in reference to any one person, post, or thread; it's in reference to how it seems like somebody pissed in BWTB's collective Cheerios on several sequential mornings. Cool?

[ChordGirl]

This isn't in reference to any one person, post, or thread; it's in reference to how it seems like somebody pissed in BWTB's collective Cheerios on several sequential mornings.

Now that is sigworthy. I'm not gonna do it, though. :poke: