Horrible Fret Buzz on First three Frets

[discodevil]

Recently I bought a unused Aria XX Series Flying Guitar with a Floyd Rose style bridge. When I tried it out in the guitar Store there didn't seem to be any Buzz. When I first got home after a few hours I sat down and plugged the guitar into my Amp and then noticed that the high E String had broken. I figured i would change the string later on until.

I immediately noticed a horrible Buzzing sound coming from the first three Frets on the LOW E String. Because i heard the Buzz go through the Marshall Amp AND through Bias FX 2 on my PC, I knew something wasn't right.

After a lot of research I tried the following things with no success:

Lowering the Strings on the Bridge

Retuning the Guitar

Later I then attempted to adjust the Truss Rod, I then noticed that the Truss Rod was already at it's "loosest" position and I could not add any more relief to the neck. I could however tighten the truss rod, which meant to me that it wasn't broken.

I have absolutely no Idea what o do next and I'd prefer not to visit a guitar tech, because I live in a rural area, far away from the nearest Guitar Store or guitar Technician.

Any attempt to help would be greatly appreciated!

 

[Mikeo]

I'd return the guitar asap.

There's a lot of stuff that could cause this.

Might be a wrong neck set

The neck is not straight and has some kind of bow in it. You'll want to have some relief to the neck, done with the truss rod.

Poor bridge set up

Poor fret leveling

How's the nut look. Might be cut too low.

Have it check out with your local luthier., f you think you might love the guitar.

 

 

 

 

What gauge strings were on there and what did you put on there.

 

I'd check the straightness of the neck and the nut first.

 

[daddymack]

Unused? As opposed to 'new'? Please explain....this is the 'V', yes?

Are all the 'locks' on the nut locked?

Did you put all 6 strings on before you adjusted the truss rod?

Lowering the strings at the bridge would make the buzz worse, I would think...

If the strings didn't buzz before you noticed the broken string, it is possible the neck tension changed slightly with the broken E

I would first change all the strings [this should be done with any used guitar, even if the seller claims they changed them], for one to make sure the gauge is what you want......if you've never owned a Floyd, this will make you wonder why people like them...

Check the intonation.

If you are still getting the buzz, with all 6 strings tuned, stretched and locked, then I would look at the neck relief and if needed, adjust truss rod [with all 6 strings on it]

If none of this fixes the buzz, take it back where you bought it, tell them what happened, what you did, and ask them what they will do to fix it.

[DeepEnd]

A couple of possibilities occur to me. First, the nut may be too low. From pics on the web it appears the nut is separate from the locking mechanism so a new nut might not be difficult. Second, there may not be enough relief. That would make the nut too low with respect to the first couple of frets. If the truss rod is as loose as it can go relief is probably at the maximum for the strings that are on it. What does the relief measure? Third is one or more high frets. Put a capo on the first fret and see if the buzz goes away. If it does, it's one of the first two possibilities. If it doesn't it's probably a high fret.

[Grant Harding]

I think most of that doesn't make sense. Lowering the bridge to address a buzzing issue? Really?

If you revisit this thread I suggest you return the guitar.

[badpenguin]

The buzzing at the top of the neck.... Since it has a locking nut, loosen the strings, pull the screws from the nut, and add a small shim under the nut to see if the issue goes away. it's not that uncommon for the nut to be shimmed IF the guitar is going from a place with a lot less humidity then to your place. the neck moves, sometimes there isn't enough movement left in the truss rod to compensate, so you improvise.

[DeepEnd]

5 hours ago, badpenguin said:

The buzzing at the top of the neck.... Since it has a locking nut, loosen the strings, pull the screws from the nut, and add a small shim under the nut to see if the issue goes away. it's not that uncommon for the nut to be shimmed IF the guitar is going from a place with a lot less humidity then to your place. the neck moves, sometimes there isn't enough movement left in the truss rod to compensate, so you improvise.

If the guitar has a separate locking mechanism and nut, as I suspect, that won't work. It looks like there's a Strat style nut. Here's a pic of what I think the OP is dealing with:

[Cardinalcomb]

I believe it has to do with neck relief. You should start by examining how much relief your neck has by holding down the low E string at the 1st fret and 22/24th fret. While doing that look at how much space is between the string and the frets at around the 7th fret. If its very close but not touching (thickness of a credit card) the neck is generally straight and should be in the right position.

 

What you are describing (buzz on first 3 frets) to me sounds like the neck has too much back bow and needs relief. I've found that is usually caused by too much back bow while buzz on the upper frets is too much relief.

 

The loose feeling on the truss-rod could be due to it being a single action truss rod. I have a les paul with a single action and it requires to be a little loose and the tension on the strings and some time to "move" the neck to add relief.

 

Anyways, I'm no pro luthier or anything but I would try this - it won't cost you anything and best part, you won't need to remove and replace the strings. Make sure to loosen the locking nut before making any adjustments.

[6down1togo]

If you are not confident with truss rod adjustment and setting relief and string height, that guitar may not be for you. You should return it for another or have the seller spring for a pro setup to make it playable.

What you have going on is a neck that has a taken on a "back-bow". Think of the strings as being a straight reference line. In a best case scenario, the neck will be hear flat with a slight concave resulting in what is called neck relief. For a Gibson style guitar, With the strings touching the first fret and the fret closest to where the neck joins the body (capo the first fret and press the string at the high end) you should be able to tightly fit a 0.010-0.015" feeler gauge between the top of the 7th fret and the string which establishes the concave shape or relief in the neck. A flat neck will fret out in the mid frets, you have to have some relief. Too much relief and the guitar just gets difficult to fret and may fret out on the high frets if the action is low.

Your neck is in the opposite attitude,with the fretboard arched up in the center and falling away from the strings at the top and bottom. This is why the lower frets are dead. You press a string at the first fret and frets 2 & 3 kill the string through contact. This continues up the neck until you get past the high point of the arch in the fingerboard. 

Check out Dave's World of Fun Stuff on YouTube. He does so many truss rods adjustments on customer guitars he can do it in his sleep and does a great job of identifying explaining and how double and single action truss rods work too. He likes to start with no string tension and set the neck flat with a notched straightedge (notched at each fret - a cheap tool that can be had for $20 on eBay or Amazon) when a neck is way out of whack. he then strings up to tension and sets the relief from there. You can get away with a straightedge laid across the frets, but then you are dialing in errors dues to possible high frets.

[Grant Harding]

I don't think the OP is keen to get their post count to 2. 👻

[6down1togo]

7 hours ago, Grant Harding said:

I don't think the OP is keen to get their post count to 2. 👻

Yeah, a lot of one hit wonders around these parts.

[GilmourD]

Well, if he ever does show up again...

Is it a two-way truss rod? There are some guitars that come with rods that will push the neck concave.

[WRGKMC]

Many good suggestions but knowing which is going to fix the problem is being left as trial and error.

I prefer to give advice that has someone properly diagnose the cause first before applying the medicine that targets the exact issue.

Since the problem occurred after breaking a strings, the cause seems obvious to me.  Each string adds from 12~15 lbs. pull on the neck. Breaking a string on a thin neck can have dire consequences when it comes to reducing relief and causing buzz.  I've owned many guitars that will change pitch by 1/4 to 1/2 semitone when a string breaks, flattening a neck badly.

You should never attempt to make adjustments while the instrument is missing a string.  You only wind up having to adjust it back when the string is replaced.

Next.  Making adjustments blindly without first taking measurements so you have a point or reference to work from is unwise.  There is a point where a professional will use his ears to get the best tones but that should always come after getting all the basics in good order.  This site lists the tools you need and lists the basic adjustments in good order. https://support.fender.com/hc/en-us/articles/212774786-How-do-I-set-up-my-Stratocaster-guitar-properly-

If your instrument is free of worn frets/nut or any other inherent defects then the three main adjustments are string height, string length and neck relief. These three adjustments are what you call interdependent on one another so they typically need to be done in a rotating order until doing one no longer affects another. 

First thing I do when picking up a guitar is check for fret wear and uneven frets.  Pull the strings sideways to reveal the wear on the first three frets. If you see grooves in the frets you likely found one of the causes of string buzz and fret leveling will likely be needed to fix this problem using the right tools to file, crown and measure them. Even if this is a new guitar the quality of fret work can be horrific. Last Fender I bought I had to re-fret the neck to eliminate the issues with frets lifting up.  Rough fret edges can be a sign of problems there as can using a fret rocker to straddle 3 frets at a time and then seek out any frets that are high. 

If the fret work is in good order you can jump to a rough test of the relief. You must be sitting up in the playing position for this.  I know this is difficult when playing a V but you cant tilt the guitar back and adjust a guitar. Gravity will flatten the neck and cause all your adjustments to be inaccurate.   

I prefer to first check it using the guitar strings as a straight edge (another reason the strings must be new)  Hold the first and last frets of a string down then pick the string in between. The string should just clear all the frets in between. (If you pull back on the neck you should be able to get the string to lay down on the frets).  Next hold down the last fret only and pick the string at the 7th fret.  Again all the strings should clear the frets all the way down the neck.  If they don't, either the neck is back bowed or the nut is too low. 

 If you determine the neck needs more relief, check the string height first.  If the strings are set too low they may not  pull enough to create relief.  Ball park the height using ruler at the 12th fret and set the High E,   3~4/64ths above the 12th fret - Set the low E 5~6/64ths above the 12th.    3&5 6/4ths is about as low as you can get strings with perfect frets and relief set without string buzz or having strings fret out when bending.  4&6 give you a safety margin and a little meat when bending strings or digging in. 

Relief can be don as I mentioned above or you can do it using a straight edge.  I prefer to use a notched straight edge and get the fret board level first.  I typically leave a gap of .09 (width of a high E string) between the 5~6rg frets.  Next I'll use a flat straight edge on the frets.  Ideally, the relief at the frets should be the same but depending on the quality of the fret job and normal fret wear you may wind up having to level frets to make things ideal.  Last Fret job I did I had to level the fret board before attempting to install frets.  The fretboard had areas that were off by as much as 2~3mm from the factory.  Once the fretboard was level, getting the new frets installed level was a piece of cake. 

After getting the height an relief set you can go ahead and set the intonation.  Intonation can be a tricky thing on a thin necked guitar because moving the saddles can change string tension which in turn affects the relief and possibly the height as well. The guide I posted teaches you how to rough out the intonation starting with the high E string and setting it to scale length. The rest of the strings will always be longer then scale length, and the low E longer by as much as a couple of millimeters.  You can use an electronic tuner here too just be sure to bring all strings to concert pitch before you tweak. 

You can find many articles and videos on these adjustments and I did suggest you buy yourself one of those guitar rulers.  It takes all the guesswork out and that saves huge amounts of time and restores an instruments tone and playability quickly.  Chances are you'll use them the rest of your life as long as you play guitar. You can buy the ruler itself for $5 or buy a kit including under string radius gauges and fret guards for doing touch up work.  I paid $60 for a set of Radius gauges when the first came out so these generics are a very good buy.  https://www.ebay.com/itm/For-Guitar-Bass-Setup-Premium-Luthier-Tools-Kit-11-Part-Understring-Radius-Gauge-/362852345581?_trksid=p2349526.m4383.l4275.c10#viTabs_0
 

 

  

 

[Grant Harding]

Well that answers the OP question of "how do I get into doing fretwork on guitars?". 😀