Members grayeyes777 Posted August 31, 2008 Members Share Posted August 31, 2008 nah, I'm mostly a rhythm player. I'm better at it than lead. I would like to be better at lead though.and I guess though yes I am mostly a metalhead. I like amps to be very responsive and react quickly, as you said the "fast stop/start" stuff. otherwise I feel like the notes just get washed away amongst each other. What guitar amps that have a lot of sag, that are famously used for non-metal musical styles? fender twins, bassmans, jtm 45's have a significant amount of sag. mesas for metal amps have a little sag as well which is why some consider them somewhat "loose" on the bottom (and can be switched with the bold/vintage power switch). Most hundred watt marshalls like plexi's have very little sag. very crisp and unforgiving amps. tight bottom end and quick response. Sag is great for cleans imo. for some dirty od ala tweed fender sounds it can be cool as well (think jack white o.d., but he uses silvertones). tight is good for that old marshall sound and of course the brootalz. if you want a more vintage tone the high gain little sag sound wont get you there. one isn't better than the other, it's just preference and what sound you're going for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grayeyes777 Posted August 31, 2008 Members Share Posted August 31, 2008 Seriously?I honestly wasn't expecting that. Is it because they are virtually a Fender Bassman, which well being a bass amp- has a lot of bass in it? a bassman is a very loose amp and it responds (feel wise) to bass signals a bit slower (ala sag). it's not how much bass an amp has cause a mesa lonestar has a shizz ton of bass but sags like a mother. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rockitsauce Posted August 31, 2008 Members Share Posted August 31, 2008 Well, the music that I grew up listening to had a saggy kind of sound, course this is different than the feel of an amp. Or at least, that is how my ear percieved it. That sound has been in my head ever since. Some bands were different and had a tight sounding attack, like GLynch. Play a quickrod and you get that Dokken tightness, but I am not in love with that sound. Now, think about the opening riff to The Ultimate Sin. To me, that is the sound that sticks in my head and I love it. Its like a split second to manipulate the note before bloom that makes the magic to my ears. Maybe its more blues based, what with bends and stuff? I dunno, I just want squish. And with all these threads about the uber and the description of its sag, makes me wanna sell some stuff and buy one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JBecker Posted August 31, 2008 Members Share Posted August 31, 2008 With 6700 posts you haven't learned anything about the Bassman or the JTM45? You are aware that the Fender Bassman is far more well known for famous guitar tones than bass tones and the reissue is never found in the bass amp section for a reason... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grayeyes777 Posted August 31, 2008 Members Share Posted August 31, 2008 With 6700 posts you haven't learned anything about the Bassman or the JTM45?You are aware that the Fender Bassman is far more well known for famous guitar tones than bass tones and the reissue is never found in the bass amp section for a reason... +1. i've seen bass players playing superbass amps but not bassmans (though it did happen back in the day). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rushtallica Posted August 31, 2008 Members Share Posted August 31, 2008 A blooming notes = + 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rushtallica Posted August 31, 2008 Members Share Posted August 31, 2008 because acoutic guitars have natural sag so it ....feels more... ...oh wait.. because it feels more natural.......ummm no thats not it. must be to hide bad playing. I love sag except when playing thrash/metal that calls for a very tight response/tone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sled Posted August 31, 2008 Members Share Posted August 31, 2008 I just don't understand it. IMO you're over analyzing... it's just another tone/feel option.if you don't like it, then stay away from it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members outtahear Posted August 31, 2008 Members Share Posted August 31, 2008 I still perceive that no matter the gain level, saggyness will still smother the notes and therefore make them inaudible- all that remains is an inconherent mess? Play a well set-up old Marshall/Vox/Fender loaded w/strong NOS glass- Bloom, great harmonics, thickness with note separation and fairy dust for days. Like most of my bedroom rig... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grayeyes777 Posted August 31, 2008 Members Share Posted August 31, 2008 Play a well set-up old Marshall/Vox/Fender loaded w/strong NOS glass- Bloom, great harmonics, thickness with note separation and fairy dust for days. Like most of my bedroom rig... damn.... sweet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members outtahear Posted August 31, 2008 Members Share Posted August 31, 2008 Confucius say: Better to have amp than wife.Fixed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members panther_king Posted August 31, 2008 Members Share Posted August 31, 2008 Also, look into a Bogner Ecstasy for an amp with a 'perfect' amount of sag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SiCkboy78 Posted August 31, 2008 Members Share Posted August 31, 2008 Play a well set-up old Marshall/Vox/Fender loaded w/strong NOS glass- Bloom, great harmonics, thickness with note separation and fairy dust for days. Like most of my bedroom rig... BEST RIG EVER:eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Terminus Posted August 31, 2008 Members Share Posted August 31, 2008 Older amps sag, and for some reason people think that everything was better "back in the day"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grayeyes777 Posted August 31, 2008 Members Share Posted August 31, 2008 Older amps sag, and for some reason people think that everything was better "back in the day"... 50 watters are known for their sag and 100's are known for being a bit more crisp. the volume difference between a 50 plex and 100 plex is only about 4 db's or so (both are loud as hell). the main reason marshall was building the 2 different models was for the "feel" of the amp and the sound. an old 100 plex doesn't really sag much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members starsnuffer Posted August 31, 2008 Members Share Posted August 31, 2008 This thread is full of fail. -W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Uncle_Milton Posted August 31, 2008 Members Share Posted August 31, 2008 Older amps sag, and for some reason people think that everything was better "back in the day"... oh god:facepalm: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members grayeyes777 Posted August 31, 2008 Members Share Posted August 31, 2008 No, marshall went higher power because Hendrix and Pete Townsend wanted louder amps. It's a 3db difference between 50 and 100watts, but 100watt marshalls put out more than 100watts. On average 120-150 watts depending on year. There is more than a 3db difference between any 50watt marshall model, and their vintage superleads. i defer to the expert. 3db's doesn't sound like a huge volume difference to me though. hendrix running 2 or 4 simultaneously would probably show that difference. A jtm 45 or bassman feels completely different than a 100 watt plexi which was my main point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mr R Gecko Posted August 31, 2008 Members Share Posted August 31, 2008 nah, I'm mostly a rhythm player. I'm better at it than lead. I would like to be better at lead though.and I guess though yes I am mostly a metalhead. I like amps to be very responsive and react quickly, as you said the "fast stop/start" stuff. otherwise I feel like the notes just get washed away amongst each other. What guitar amps that have a lot of sag, that are famously used for non-metal musical styles? The Ecstasy has a bit of sag and lovely bloom to notes. That being said, it isn't a metal amp. Thankfully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Drew5887 Posted August 31, 2008 Members Share Posted August 31, 2008 The AC30 has alot of sag to it when overdriven in my experience. I really love sag when playing with light distortion because it gives the feel of a more overdriven amp with the dynamics and clarity of a vintage amp. Angus Young solos have alot of this character. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members petejt Posted September 2, 2008 Author Members Share Posted September 2, 2008 Honestly I knew that come across stupidly, but I was confused at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Murmur1 Posted September 2, 2008 Members Share Posted September 2, 2008 Of these three amps rank them in order of saginess: Randall rg100es Mrashall dsl50 Laney gh50l Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members NixerX Posted September 2, 2008 Members Share Posted September 2, 2008 Some ppl like their toans like they like their tittes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tlbonehead Posted September 2, 2008 Members Share Posted September 2, 2008 Yeah I can understand why tighter amps are preferred for metal music, which is why I prefer tight amps. But surely tight amps work fine for other musical styles? They do for me. I don't really get this "bloom" thing. I still perceive that no matter the gain level, saggyness will still smother the notes and therefore make them inaudible- all that remains is an inconherent mess? What are some examples/clips of saggy amps used with lower gain & other musical styles? Listen to WALK AWAY-James Gang WHILE MY GUITAR GENTLY WEEPS -Beatles/EC. Sag can be a beautiful thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Cliff Fiscal Posted September 2, 2008 Members Share Posted September 2, 2008 You all act like you crank up your 100w amps in your bedroom. Dream on, wankers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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