Members NeloAngelo Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 One bullet hit a sign. A woman was standing underneath it and was slightly injured by the debris.Thats why you dont {censored}ing empty your clip like you're in Die Hard. just cuz you get a badge don't make you john yippie ki yay mother{censored}in mcclaine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Y0UNGBL00D Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 it is difficult (moreso than most toughguys want to admit) to hit targets under pressure sometimes, but surroundings should have been taken into acount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members themadscientist Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 lol he was originally pointing his gun at the (future) dead guy sideways Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Y0UNGBL00D Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 i can hit a stop sign too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Lucius Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 Does anyone know where that "I shot 60 bullets into the trees" thread is?? cheers, Lucius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Fig0ta Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 USA! USA! USA! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members pickinatit Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 suicide by cop. terrible. i dont know what exactly happened here but based on the video i agree they shouldve used their training and shot him in the leg or arm. You've been watching too much TV. Shooting an arm or leg....easier said then done. 2nd - The guy was closing fast enough to the cop that in another fraction of a second he would have been within striking range with the crowbar. If the cop misses that arm or leg he or his partner might be dead instead of the perp. Having said all of that....I think the cops could have stood back or kept moving out of reach and tried to talk the guy down more but all in all I can't really fault the cops all that much. It's tricky in my estimation. The cops definitely acted in self defense but at the same time they sort of put themselves in harms way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members El Guapo Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 One bullet hit a sign. A woman was standing underneath it and was slightly injured by the debris.Thats why you dont {censored}ing empty your clip like you're in Die Hard. She was actually sitting in the Taco Bell across the street, window shattered from a stray bullet and she got hurt from the glass. I live roughly a mile away from where this happened, I was actually just there this past Friday haha. Sucks it had to happen but don't go threating people with crowbars, let alone cops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jenksdrummer Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 Those were panic shots given the speed at which those rounds were dispensed. When they tazered him and he didn't even flinch that put it on a whole different level for the officers involved. I applaud their actions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members NeloAngelo Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 You've been watching too much TV. Shooting an arm or leg....easier said then done. 2nd - The guy was closing fast enough to the cop that in another fraction of a second he would have been within striking range with the crowbar. If the cop misses that arm or leg he or his partner might be dead instead of the perp.Having said all of that....I think the cops could have stood back or kept moving out of reach and tried to talk the guy down more but all in all I can't really fault the cops all that much. It's tricky in my estimation. The cops definitely acted in self defense but at the same time they sort of put themselves in harms way. the cop was holding a k9. all he had to do was release it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jenksdrummer Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 shooting someone in the leg will always have an effect, pcp or notIt's against training, but maybe training should be altered to include the non lethal use of a firearmdude was no doubt an idiot for doing this, but gunned down in a parking lot when there's three other cops and a dog there....sorry, won't ever think that's right nor should it behe raised the crowbar, but he wasn't moving quickly at all, the officer could have kept some distance between himself and the suspectthere were options other than getting in this face, within striking distance, and then putting him downguy was high, cops acted poorly Regarding center-mass...if the officers shot for leg/knee/etc, and that goes against training, and it hits someone else...even then, center mass makes the most sense because you're less likely to have a through-target shot with pistol ammo (well, excep FMJ, which I don't think police use?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jenksdrummer Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 the cop was holding a k9. all he had to do was release it. K9 might have been next step, but when perp turned to face the officers, there was no other choice at that point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members madrigal77 Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 Fully justified. The cops had to protect themselves. The tazer did nothing. A blow to the head from a crowbar could easily kill you. Cops had no choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members pickinatit Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 Those were panic shots given the speed at which those rounds were dispensed. When they tazered him and he didn't even flinch that put it on a whole different level for the officers involved. I applaud their actions Not panicked IMO. I'm not positive but, if I'm not mistaken, Police are trained to empty their clip once they have made the decision to apply deadly force.As far as the surroundings go, I suppose the cop could have sacrificed himself for the sake of any innocent by-standers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members NeloAngelo Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 K9 might have been next step, but when perp turned to face the officers, there was no other choice at that point. at the distance from the perp, that dog would have been on him before he fully loaded a swing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jenksdrummer Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 Not panicked IMO. I'm not positive but, if I'm not mistaken, Police are trained to empty their clip once they have made the decision to apply deadly force. As far as the surroundings go, I suppose the cop could have sacrificed himself for the sake of any innocent by-standers. Given they're using a GLOCK40 or similar, those pistols hold a lot more than what was fired. I'm sure we're also hearing more than 1 officer firing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members madrigal77 Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 Oh and as far as people saying it was a "panic shot" and he shot too many times, the guy just took a tazer to the face like it was nothing. The cop, once he made the choice to fire, had to make sure the guy was down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jenksdrummer Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 Having watched the shooting portion several times... Officer w/ K9 fired 5 rounds first, perp starts to spin around and stumble as officer #2 fired off 5 rounds in quick succession. Perp was not on the ground. Someone needs to tell officer #1 (k9) not to do the gangsta thing...watch that mythbusters episode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mesa4x12er2 Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 Should've been shot, yes. Should've been shot 10 times? The {censored}.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dr.Picklebottom Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 Apparently you know nothing about police training. They are taught to NEVER shoot to maim. If you shoot, you do it to kill. yeah, i guess i dont know anything about police training. i just assumed, incorrectly apparently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jenksdrummer Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 Oh and as far as people saying it was a "panic shot" and he shot too many times, the guy just took a tazer to the face like it was nothing. The cop, once he made the choice to fire, had to make sure the guy was down. I agree. Having watch it several times since my panic shot comment, I don't see it as a panic-reaction by the officers involved. They did what they had to. Perp took a VERY aggressive stance with his crowbar (looks to me like a conduit bender)...when he turned around to face them and didn't either (A) lay down or (B) drop his weapon...they really had no choice. They followed protocol. Where they looking to shoot the guy? Not in my opinion...the dog got overlooked because they didn't really get a reasonable amount of time between the tazer and the shooting to utilize it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jesse G Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 you have a continuum of force: words >hands > baton/spray > tazer > firearm.you can see what level was required. a crowbar is a deadly weapon. one strike to the temple could have killed an officer. life for a life. if on PCP, with a face tazering having no effect, leg shooting wouldnt do anything. its also against training to shoot other than center mass.if pcp-man would have put that crowbar in the officers head, this thread woul read "shoulda shot him" {censored}ing this. Everyone saying "excessive force" "shoulda shot him in the knee" etc. just don't have a clue about police work or what they are talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dr.Picklebottom Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 {censored}ing this. Everyone saying "excessive force" "shoulda shot him in the knee" etc. just don't have a clue about police work or what they are talking about. im not saying youre wrong but what exactly qualifies you as a police work expert? arent you like 16? tough life, so far? are you a burnt out teenage detective on a tough case as we speak? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members duncan Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 So, just to clarify... we all know for a fact he was on PCP? or is it just speculation because he shrugged off a taser to the face? Personally, I think shooting a man 5 times in the chest and then another 5 times when he's on the ground is a bit much. Do I have a problem with the use of deadly force when it is warranted? Of course not. But this wasn't a case where deadly force was needed. The cop in the back (who shouldn't have been so close), had the dude been able to make a swing (he looked like he was just faking it to get some distance between himself and the cop) would be trained to disarm him easily. Hell, even the installers for the telecommunications company I work for are trained how to do that. The shooting cop could have easily released the Shepherd. PCP or not, you release that dog, buddy is dropping the crowbar and dropping to the ground. You can be as numb as {censored} to whatever amounts of pain, but if a dog is ripping through the tendons needed to close your hand, or the muscles to hold your arm up, you're going to drop whatever is in your hand. Also, had the cop disarmed the dude with the tactics he was trained with, PCP or not, buddy would have dropped the crowbar. But hey, let's bring in all the rednecks and internet tough guys who just want to be John Rambo claiming that buddy deserved to die, and they would have done the same thing. Apparently anyone who would have done anything but shooting the guy dead is a bleeding heart liberal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ComOp Posted January 24, 2012 Members Share Posted January 24, 2012 Dude, I've seen the Andy Griffith show on netflix, cop shoulda asked him to come to jail and have some of Aunt B's homemade pecan pie. /HCAF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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