What do you think of this single?

[Jeff da Weasel]

Whoo hooo!

 

Actually, I don't think I'd trade the experiences I've gained since then in exchange for the youthful advantages. I like being who I am now.

[Coaster]

no banana? you must be snobs or sumthing

[Anderton]

I have to add one more thing. Criticism can be the best possible thing on the planet to help your career. Early on I was cutting a song with a producer and she loved the music and lyrics, but thought the actual vocal performance didn't convey the emotion implicit in the words.

 

She wrote out the lyrics, and underlined words that needed to be emphasized, and double-underlined the words that could serve as the "lyrical hook." Just having someone review my lyrics and parse them into important/really important and tell me which parts to emphasize made a HUGE difference in my approach to the song. It introduced the "tension and release" element to the words themselves.

 

Ever since then, I've always reviewed my lyrics and done the underline/double-underline thing. It was probably the best advice I ever received in terms of changing how I do music, and producing really tangible positive results. That one exercise done in the middle of a session stayed with me all these years.

 

BTW as way of background...the reason why I know how producers and A&R people think comes from doing a ton of session work at CBS back in the day. Having to come up with parts that were totally subservient to the artist taught me a huge amount about playing economically and maximizing emotional impact. Watching the kind of advice artists received during the course of the sessions definitely shaped how I look at music (and I think for the better). It's also less bruising to the ego to learn from the mistakes other people make

[UstadKhanAli]

Beer is a good thing.. It's really food right?

Yes. It's liquid bread.

[UstadKhanAli]

She wrote out the lyrics, and underlined words that needed to be emphasized, and double-underlined the words that could serve as the "lyrical hook." Just having someone review my lyrics and parse them into important/really important and tell me which parts to emphasize made a HUGE difference in my approach to the song. It introduced the "tension and release" element to the words themselves. Ever since then, I've always reviewed my lyrics and done the underline/double-underline thing. It was probably the best advice I ever received in terms of changing how I do music, and producing really tangible positive results. That one exercise done in the middle of a session stayed with me all these years.

 

 

That's a really great piece of advice right there. We were doing something similar with bolding the words and making them larger to indicate the amount of emphasis, sometimes if necessary doing this for the syllables if we wanted something highlighted. BTW, we also do this for The Tibet Connection radio show, even though it's not singing, just to make things easier. Anything that can facilitate importance, meaning, emphasis, pronunciation, emotion, etc. is a beautiful, practical thing.

[UstadKhanAli]

Whoo hooo! Actually, I don't think I'd trade the experiences I've gained since then in exchange for the youthful advantages. I like being who I am now.

Ditto all of the above...including that I like who you are now. But the experience is big. That said, I wouldn't mind having the experience but with a strong healthy lower back!

[Anderton]

Whoo hooo! Actually, I don't think I'd trade the experiences I've gained since then in exchange for the youthful advantages. I like being who I am now.

Well...I had significant commercial success early on, which was great. But, I learned over time that I liked music more than commercial success, and I could support myself in a variety of different ways so I didn't HAVE to have commercial success. This freed me to make the kind of music I wanted to make. Sometimes it's sold well, like Forward Motion or the dance music that got picked up for remixes in Europe. And sometimes I just play what I have for friends. My live performances do well, but there's only so much time in the day, so they're few and far between. I guess that adds to the mystique, though

Honestly, I'd have to say that through the years, I don't think my music has gotten better or worse as much as it has broadened. For example, when I was 21, I had no idea that Zouk music even existed. Once I discovered that, it started influencing how I played. But at the core, I'm pretty much "same as it ever was." It's the externals that have changed, sometimes radically.

[siva115]

Craig-- thanks for taking the time to listen and offer your advice.

With the point regarding comparing oneself to the biggest stars in the world-- I think this is a great notion and I have always done that. In fact, many of the criticisms that have been hurled in my direction have been said over and over about one of my favorite musicians, Buckethead.

But clearly you know better than I, and I want to try and pull some more specifics out of you. What would you do if you were me, as a musician trying to "make it" or make a living or whatever; willing to play any kind of music in any capacity? I'm asking from a marketing standpoint and a technical standpoint.

Also, regardless of the mediocre impression the song gave you, what would you do to maximize its potential (once again, from a marketing standpoint)?

Thanks again.

[Anderton]

Craig-- thanks for taking the time to listen and offer your advice. With the point regarding comparing oneself to the biggest stars in the world-- I think this is a great notion and I have always done that. In fact, many of the criticisms that have been hurled in my direction have been said over and over about one of my favorite musicians, Buckethead. But clearly you know better than I, and I want to try and pull some more specifics out of you. What would you do if you were me, as a musician trying to "make it" or make a living or whatever; willing to play any kind of music in any capacity? I'm asking from a marketing standpoint and a technical standpoint. Also, regardless of the mediocre impression the song gave you, what would you do to maximize its potential (once again, from a marketing standpoint)? Thanks again.

 

Well, this is going to sound crass, and frankly, is one of the reasons why I stopped worrying about commercial success and more about music itself. But I always advise bands to come up with an album title, a unique identity, and a marketing/promotion plan before they record one note. The title sets the tone, and the identity is essential to differentiate yourself from the rest of the world.

 

The marketing plan is KEY. Do you intend to go for a major label release and have them market it? Then you need to be prepared to "follow the rules" for pop singles, and you NEED to generate something that an A&R person believes is a hit. This can involve serious compromises, like finding some gorgeous babe to front the band, and auto-tune the hell out of her if she can't sing.

 

Or maybe you want to go viral and get independent sales to leverage a better deal if you do sign with a major. Then live performance is key. You need a great live act, and you need to sell your music at gigs. You're limited in one respect because people will want that music to be a souvenir of the gig, so you can't stray too far from what they've heard. You need to become video-savvy ASAP and get material up on YouTube and also generate video for your virtual press kit.

 

There's a video floating around the net which is about one minute of a festival gig I did with Brian Hardgroove from Public Enemy. It was posted about two years ago and it STILL gets links and people still email me about it. Video is a very powerful promotional medium and not taking advantage of it is sort of like playing a guitar with three strings. I can almost guarantee that if your music had been part of a music video with really evocative images, it would have had a better reception because through the video, you could have helped reinforce any emotional impact you wanted the music to have.

 

If you're ugly and short but talented , then you might want to pursue "behind the scenes" music like soundtracks and jingles. "Real" musicians look down on that, but frankly, I love doing that work and find it challenging, satisfying, and profitable. One friend of mine, Larry Fast (ex-Peter Gabriel band) does lots of sonic logos, like the seven-note tag that XM uses. He calls it equivalent to "painting in minuature," and has made a ton of money from it but also really digs the challenge. It's often been said that your best work comes when working within limits, and soundtracks, jingles, and logos make very defined limits.

 

Bottom line is I think it's best to work backward from the intended goal. When you have a goal in mind, everything you do will be informed by that goal, and contribute to realizing that goal. If you record first, listen back, and then decide what your goal is going to be, sometimes that can work but it's a less efficient way to achieve commercial success.

 

One thing I advise EVERYONE to do is play live and develop a killer live act. Nothing gives you more brutal feedback faster than whether the audience stays or leaves, and gives polite applause or a thundering ovation. It's the most honest form of reality check you can get.

[Anderton]

Oh, one last thing: In my experience, the musicians who have achieved the greatest commercial success and longest careers were true to themselves. This doesn't mean you can't follow the rules and manufacture hits, like the Brill Building writers in the 60s. You can analyze what makes for a hit, and do a Diane Warren and hit the target every time. But, that's not what some people want to do.

 

If you're true to yourself and achieve commercial success, then you're freed from having to try and calculate what to do next. Of course, the odds are that by being true to yourself, you won't achieve commercial success, but that's life. The world is full of one-hit wonders who achieved a brief moment of commercial success because they followed the rules, and struck a nerve with the public. But they couldn't follow it up because it was manufactured, and they couldn't duplicate the recipe. If it comes from inside, you can ALWAYS duplicate the recipe because the recipe lies within you.

 

Personally speaking, being true to myself has meant sufficient but limited commercial success. On the other hand I've been able to maintain a viable career for several decades, which at least for me is better than having a monster hit and then trying to live off of it ever after. I must say it still kind of freaks me out to hear a track I recorded years and years ago on Deep Tracks, but it's all part of a continuum so I don't have to look back on it as an isolated event that will never happen again.

[UstadKhanAli]

 

Well, this is going to sound crass, and frankly, is one of the reasons why I stopped worrying about commercial success and more about music itself. But I always advise bands to come up with an album title, a unique identity, and a marketing/promotion plan before they record one note. The title sets the tone, and the identity is essential to differentiate yourself from the rest of the world. Bottom line is I think it's best to work backward from the intended goal. When you have a goal in mind, everything you do will be informed by that goal, and contribute to realizing that goal. If you record first, listen back, and then decide what your goal is going to be, sometimes that can work but it's a less efficient way to achieve commercial success. One thing I advise EVERYONE to do is play live and develop a killer live act . Nothing gives you more brutal feedback faster than whether the audience stays or leaves, and gives polite applause or a thundering ovation. It's the most honest form of reality check you can get.

 

 

This is effin' brilliant. Probably everyone knows by now that I am the World's Worst Marketing Person. I just suck at it. But I also know what works, having played in bands before and also because I have a brain.

 

So many times, working backwards, whether it's planning an event (get the theme and vibe first, then everything flows from that), writing an essay (start with the title and a killer first sentence), music (start with a title and vibe or work from a particular emotion or start with a photo as inspiration) works so well...so when you apply it to a concerted marketing strategy like this, it's just gonna work so much better.

 

This ain't crass, this is just smart while giving artists the ability to keep their integrity and essence of who they are intact.

 

I've cherry-picked the stuff from the post that I especially like above, but it's all useful.

 

See what a cool thread this has turned into?

[Anderton]

And I'll add one more thing from an A&R perspective:

Play me something I haven't heard before.

It's like the guy who sent me some music while I was at a magazine. It sounded a lot like Prince, which was a good thing in terms of music, but a bad thing in terms of success. Why? We already have Prince. We don't need another one.

[UstadKhanAli]

That's sort of the opposite of what many do, which is to try and play something that sounds almost exactly like what's been done before. And I suppose sometimes that works , but most of the time, no.

[boosh]

So what is different about this Spammer other than the fact that he came back 12 times to only talk about his own stuff again?

[UstadKhanAli]

So what is different about this Spammer other than the fact that he came back 12 times to only talk about his own stuff again?

That's a purty big difference, though, isn't it?

[boosh]

That's a purty big difference, though, isn't it?

Well only thing I can think of is that his strategy sucks,..

He'd be better off spamming 8000 forums and visit them only once than spamming 80 forums and trying to defend his music to the 12 people that go into a live-discussion with him and coming back 12 times.

And what I really hate is that the Luke SkyWalker character is nice to him,...

How come he's been a pain in the ass to me plenty of times but this spammer here doesn't need to whipe his own ass,.. No,..man,..LukenSkywalker would be happy to help him,....

Who is this spammer dude?? Obama's Illigit son? Paris Hilton in disguise??

This whole thread is a bloody viral is it?? Just to bother me,..

That's it right?? You just don't want me to put on my music here,... or is it that Sack ClaXXTOn dude again??

{censored}i it,... where's the aluminium,... I gotta make a hat,...

[UstadKhanAli]

I don't know anything anymore, Booshie. I've been flamed by Lukenheimer at least three times as well. I just try and keep cool and enjoy the forum.

 

[Anderton]

So what is different about this Spammer other than the fact that he came back 12 times to only talk about his own stuff again?

1. He provided a topic for discussion that goes beyond his spamming.
2. He's both clueless and sincere...a rare combination in forums
3. He obviously really wants to make it, but I hope that as this thread continues, he'll understand that he's only at the very beginning of what will be a long, difficult, and ego-bruising journey that has an infinitesimal chance of success. But, note that I didn't say NO chance of success...
4. I'm going to extract what I said and turn it into a Talkbox article for EQ magazine, so it's been worth the time to me!
5. He is now in a position where either he will continue to participate in the forum, and attempt to contribute something to it, in which case we'll all be glad he didn't go away. Or, he'll keep spamming and will be treated with such unrestrained cruelty and mockery that he'll leave, in which case we'll be glad he didn't stay. Either way, the forum doesn't lose.

As you know, I normally delete these types of threads (or you might not know because I delete them). But in this case, the discussion had already started, so I figured what the hey, let's see how this plays out.

It's like sometimes I'm late getting to shoe spam or whatever, and there have been so many funny responses I just can't bear to delete them. When a thread takes on a life of its own, I let it live just to see what happens.

Remember, this is all performance art to me...and as to Lukenskywalker, the dude obviously has some issues BUT he is aware of them and is one of the few people to come in here and apologize for posts he made. I have the feeling he's fighting some demons and sometimes they win a round, but he doesn't give up, and he's landed some pretty good punches himself.

If this forum can in any way help in that evolution, then it's all good.

Finally, about making it in the music biz...it reminds me of the movie Dumb and Dumber, where Jim Carrey asks Holly Hunter if there's any chance of them getting together. She replies "Oh, about one in a million." This look comes across Carrey's face...and slowly, there's a smile. "So there IS a chance!"

That describes the odds of making it in the music business, and the reaction of most people trying to make it in same.

[boosh]

Remember, this is all performance art to me...and as to Lukenskywalker, the dude obviously has some issues BUT he is aware of them and is one of the few people to come in here and apologize for posts he made. I have the feeling he's fighting some demons and sometimes they win a round, but he doesn't give up, and he's landed some pretty good punches himself.

 

 

I was just teasing Lukenskywalker Craig,..I'm pretty sure he knows that now,.. We had some conversations and he's a great guy! I actually enjoy his posts 98% of the time and some day we're gonna drink beers, lots of them.

[boosh]

As you know, I normally delete these types of threads (or you might not know because I delete them). But in this case, the discussion had already started, so I figured what the hey, let's see how this plays out. It's like sometimes I'm late getting to shoe spam or whatever, and there have been so many funny responses I just can't bear to delete them. When a thread takes on a life of its own, I let it live just to see what happens.

 

 

 

The funniest ones are those in which you or Gus change the words,.. those always crack me up.

[Rudolf von Hagenwil]

So what is different about this Spammer other than the fact that he came back 12 times to only talk about his own stuff again?

 

 

 

The OT is a little marketing genius, and when he sold the 1000th copy on iTunes of his ambient blues single, he is entering the charts in Germany, provided he has a record company there.

[Lukenskywalker]

I was just teasing Lukenskywalker Craig,..I'm pretty sure he knows that now,.. We had some conversations and he's a great guy! I actually enjoy his posts 98% of the time and some day we're gonna drink beers, lots of them.

Boosh, thanks, yes, I do know that you were teasing...we are alot alike...I can give, so I better be ready to take it.

[Lukenskywalker]

I don't know anything anymore, Booshie. I've been flamed by Lukenheimer at least three times as well. I just try and keep cool and enjoy the forum.

yes Ken, I have flamed you on occasion, but Man, sometimes you really NEED a good flamin'....

[Giorgi]

I really liked it.

[siva115]

I really liked it.

Thanks!