Members Ed A. Posted June 12, 2011 Members Share Posted June 12, 2011 It's really not that bad.I agree. You'd think that from some of these views, the people there are all godless devil-worshiping heathen liberal socialist baby killers. That's not true, there's also fundamentalist Christian conservative war mongers too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members elsongs Posted June 12, 2011 Members Share Posted June 12, 2011 When you have some work experience, you learn that religion and politics discussions are not tolerated in a normal work enviornments. That's unfortunate, since there are definitely ways to discuss religion and politics - note the word was "discuss" and not "debate" - without getting antagonistic. Unfortunately that requires a level of intelligence that most people in this world sorely lack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members UstadKhanAli Posted June 12, 2011 Members Share Posted June 12, 2011 At my work, we've discussed politics and religion, sometimes at length, without having problems. The occasional intense debate, sure, but it was still a discussion. And among friends, this isn't an issue either. Same thing..sometimes, intense debates, but they're still discussions. So it is quite possible to have these at work without ruining friendships or relationships or whatever. But you do have to tread carefully and carefully choose who you are willing to discuss these things with, obviously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ernest Buckley Posted June 13, 2011 Members Share Posted June 13, 2011 It never even occurs to me to go there.I`ll just add to the OP, racism, bigotry, etc... are alive and well. Nothing has changed even though you would like to think people are more compassionate, understanding, etc... but its human nature. Most people are stuck in a little corner of their world where most people think, look and see the world like they do... its easy to get sucked in. The internet brings out the best and worst of us... the worst most of the time. Any political forum is going to allow people to be their true selves, especially when 99% of the its members are hiding behind silly avatars. Just my $.02EB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members gubu Posted June 13, 2011 Members Share Posted June 13, 2011 Want to know what the sad thing is? PP is the busiest forum in HC... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ed A. Posted June 13, 2011 Members Share Posted June 13, 2011 Some of the debates on PP regarding religion have influenced my beliefs and made me consider other possibilities that I had not previously considered. There are some very interesting points of view there if you look beyond the stupid stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members roomjello Posted June 13, 2011 Members Share Posted June 13, 2011 i dont go there because it is pointless to argue with people that are not smart enough to be able to change their minds. i dont think anyne there really wants to change or understand anything, they just want to argue pointlessly, and i can do that at home or at work if i want to. It seems to me like it is a process of digestion. When we are fed truths that disturb us we spit them out, but we know that ultimately they are truths and that we have to reconcile with them eventually. This starts the battle within us and we fight and spit and choke and fight some more. But if we do not fight and spit we do not get closer to getting it down. So, yes it's a nasty scene, and if you don't need to go there consider yourself lucky, but some do and it is actually good for them and those around them as they need each other to complete or at least move the process forward. A racist who is vocal and defending is a racist who is trying to justify their poor conscience, they are slowing coming away from it, it's the quiet ones who are dangerous. Same for all criminals of the race. We can be confident though that in the end we are all moving toward the same realizations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members philbo Posted June 13, 2011 Members Share Posted June 13, 2011 i dont go there because it is pointless to argue with people that are not smart enough to be able to change their minds. i dont think anyne there really wants to change or understand anything, they just want to argue pointlessly, and i can do that at home or at work if i want to. I agree completely. It's a waste of time to get into a battle of wits with unarmed opponents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members WRGKMC Posted June 13, 2011 Members Share Posted June 13, 2011 That's unfortunate, since there are definitely ways to discuss religion and politics - note the word was "discuss" and not "debate" - without getting antagonistic. Unfortunately that requires a level of intelligence that most people in this world sorely lack. Its not that you dont have the occasional light or private discussion with a coworkers, especially when somethings current in the news. When you look at it from a managers standpoint, they want their employees to work as a team. So long as that kind of stuff doesnt interefere with productivity its ignored for the most part. If someone gets emotionally or actively involved, preaching to others or drumming up political support etc, then it becomes a problem just as big as sexual harrassment can be. Its pretty much illegal to make employees unconfortable like that and its where an employer has the responsibility to call someone aside for some one on one counciling of whats acceptable in a work enviornment. You'd be surprised what these HR departments include with their employment at will policies. Everything from dress codes, to hair length, deoterants and purfumes you can wear etc. Again, companies may not strictly inforce all those rules, but it does give them the tools to get rid of offensiver workers without winding up in lawsuits. This is the way major corporations operate weather you like it or not. if you dont have those kinds of restrictions on your job, then i guess you've never worked for big companiews before because they all have those kinds or restrictions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members nat whilk II Posted June 13, 2011 Members Share Posted June 13, 2011 We can be confident though that in the end we are all moving toward the same realizations. What realizations are you referring to, here? nat whilk ii Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Philter Posted June 13, 2011 Members Share Posted June 13, 2011 Want to know what the sad thing is?PP is the busiest forum in HC... I don't think it's sad. Some of the topics of discussion on the PP are things that will have big impacts on all of our lives. It's hard to say the same about the analog/digital debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Anderton Posted June 13, 2011 Members Share Posted June 13, 2011 The other thing is that politics is constantly generating new material, so there's always new stuff to discuss. Also, you get pretty big posts counts when the discourse goes "I know you are, but what am I?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Zooey Posted June 13, 2011 Members Share Posted June 13, 2011 There's a guy over there who used to primarily frequent this forum currently posting 100 times per day in HCPP. Good times, I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ryst Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 You must figure somebody is going to feel hurt, deeply insulted or offended. True. But getting your feelings hurt or feeling deeply insulted or offended is a choice. You can simply choose not to be offended as much as you can choose to be offended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members gubu Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 I don't think it's sad. Some of the topics of discussion on the PP are things that will have big impacts on all of our lives. It's hard to say the same about the analog/digital debate. I don't think PP is sad in itself. I often enjoy the robust and frank exchange of views that goes on over there. And, information is often to be had over there well in advance of standard news media. The recent amount of racism and trolls with their fingers in their ears repeating the same thing over and over again is disappointing tho. A lot of the better informed members seem to have left in the last 12 months. I remember the standard of debate being much better there before. Maybe it's just me What is sad is that the busiest forum on one of the best online web resources for musicians and techs is a poli forum, not a musical/tech one. edit:- tho maybe that's not sad at all, just a reflection on our times. People don't seem to have the spare time and cash to devote to music that they had during the 'boom' years. Traffic seems to have dropped on a lot of music/tech related boards, not just HC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Zooey Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 What is sad is that the busiest forum on one of the best online web resources for musicians and techs is a poli forum, not a musical/tech one. This is just my personal opinion, but I wish HC outside of the user forums was more user friendly. I used to spend a lot of time reading and writing reviews and I don't do that so much just because of the sheer number of clicks it takes to arrive at useful information. As for HCPP, it's kind of a unique forum in that it can't be written off as the mouthpiece for any political bias. If I'm going to discuss politics (or discuss the law, which is my personal thang), I don't want to do it where I'm preaching to the choir, and I don't want to do it where I'd be flooded or moderated off the forum completely. There are surprisingly few fora like that out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members gubu Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 This is just my personal opinion, but I wish HC outside of the user forums was more user friendly. I used to spend a lot of time reading and writing reviews and I don't do that so much just because of the sheer number of clicks it takes to arrive at useful information.As for HCPP, it's kind of a unique forum in that it can't be written off as the mouthpiece for any political bias. If I'm going to discuss politics (or discuss the law, which is my personal thang), I don't want to do it where I'm preaching to the choir, and I don't want to do it where I'd be flooded or moderated off the forum completely. There are surprisingly few fora like that out there. Agreed all round. That's exactly what I like about HCPP, all opinions are welcome, except the really repugnant ones. They usually find themselves banned. Apart from that, it can be pretty no-holds-barred. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Lee Flier Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 I think the OP is right... the Political Party is a dark place, but that's because it reflects the reality of human nature. A lot of people can't stomach that or don't want to constantly be reminded of that. But it's out there, and it's affecting all of our lives, and pretending like it doesn't exist, or that you're above it all... that's not going to make a positive difference in the long run. LOL... sure it does. One might very well be aware of the dark realities of human nature and yet choose to spend their energies setting a more positive example. If angry mobs were allowed to rule society in the name of "getting in touch with our dark side," we'd never have made what progress we HAVE made. Really, just as somebody is aware of the existence of junk food but chooses to eat healthy food, people's "mental diet" - what you feed your brain on a regular basis - is important. Being aware of unpleasant realities is important and normally doesn't do long term mental damage, any more than eating a donut once a month is going to make you fat or give you a heart attack. But if you spend a good chunk of your time and energy wallowing in the kind of mindless and hateful crap that often gets posted in the PP... well, that ain't good. It boggles my mind how some people spend all day long posting in there and basically drown out anyone who might pop in with a reasonable comment. One of the darkest sides of humanity is the attention whore - and the only way to deal with an attention whore is just ignore them. It does nothing positive to give them any energy at all. That said, there's often informative stuff in the PP, or was before I stopped going there, and maybe still is. And there are, or were, some thoughtful, bright and funny people on there. But I just don't have the time to wade through all the other crap to get to the good stuff, and anyhow I have people in real life with whom I can discuss politics in a (usually) more productive way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members roomjello Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 What realizations are you referring to, here? nat whilk ii Truth, realizations of truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members moonlight Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 People freely speaking their mind versus people forced to get along under threat of their livelihood... doesn't sound like a positive argument for civility to me.I think the OP is right... the Political Party is a dark place, but that's because it reflects the reality of human nature. A lot of people can't stomach that or don't want to constantly be reminded of that. But it's out there, and it's affecting all of our lives, and pretending like it doesn't exist, or that you're above it all... that's not going to make a positive difference in the long run.Anyway Who, too bad your entire existence on the Political Party consisted of a few posts in a thread about Congressman Weiner. There's a huge amount of noise in the signal over there (like all the Weiner threads) and it takes some time to cut through it. Ya you do gotta stick around for a bit and figure out who is what when. I have a few peeps on ignore. Helps to cut down on some of the noise of the riff raff. I've learned a few things, said oops on a few things, and most certainly have stuck a stick in the side of a few folks. :poke: Unfortunately, that translates to nothing more then a tickle to some. alright... back to your regularly scheduled posting. please forgive my intrusion. I have to go the political side and fight now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members uppercasenoises Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 Hi! HCPP regular here. Honestly, the forum is quite entertaining if you don't take it seriously at all. However, if you go in looking to change people's political views, and you're completely serious about doing that, then you're going to get very frustrated. It all depends on how you view the forum. The vast majority of people over there are just trolls looking for LOL's to be had. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Shane Marley Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 Hi! HCPP regular here. Honestly, the forum is quite entertaining if you don't take it seriously at all. However, if you go in looking to change people's political views, and you're completely serious about doing that, then you're going to get very frustrated. It all depends on how you view the forum. The vast majority of people over there are just trolls looking for LOL's to be had. Yep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members nat whilk II Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 So HCPP is then a place where cynics and adolescents go to goad cranks and bigots into cage fights, basically. Oh, and everyone wears a mask, and a certain percentage are probably drunk. Occasionally a sincere soul reads the sign on the door and enters, hoping for a decent debate on a real issue or importance, but soon walks out with a thousand WTF?s above their head. Am I missing anything? nat whilk ii Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Lee Flier Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 Honestly, the forum is quite entertaining if you don't take it seriously at all. Even on that level, I mostly don't find it very entertaining. However, if you go in looking to change people's political views, and you're completely serious about doing that, then you're going to get very frustrated. I don't necessarily care about changing anyone's views. But when it comes to political discussion, I do like to have something approaching an honest discussion, even if there's the inevitable exchange of barbs. I have no use for a troll-fest at all. It all depends on how you view the forum. The vast majority of people over there are just trolls looking for LOL's to be had. Exactly. Trouble is, trolls are all the same, and for the most part not LOL-worthy, they're just pathetic. Again, it's how you choose to spend your energy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members newbie chick Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 My ears were burning so I had to stop by and defend the intellectual thunderdome that is the Political Party. It is possible to have an intelligent discussion but they are very rare and it usually doesn't last before a partisan of either side posts to defend their preferred sacred cow. Elsongs, there are many people on HC-PP who dislike Anderton for various reasons.Hello Lee, You are the only person to have ever warned me in the Political Party. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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