Female Singers and their bad attitudes - pls comment

[nchangin]

I know there are female singers who give problems to the Band. There was this girl who was a sexy and pretty...age 20+. Her singing was average...nothing great...but not lousy either. Being the only girl in the band with 4 other guys....she gets all the attention and praises from the customers, naturally. She was humble at 1st when she started...but after only 6 months or so...she started to be arrogant to the band leader and became lazy to learn new songs. She gave the 'Hey...you need me cos without me your band is worth nothing' attitude to the band members. She was holding the Band ransom with her bad attitude. The band had to swallow their pride and kept her in the Band for another 3 months before they finally kicked her out.

 

Every lead singer (except 1) I've known has either issues with depression or big head. In your case obviously you have tainted musicanship and she has 0 for musicianship with her display of attitude at the current time. I don't think it's a gender bias trait, I think it's a "lead singer" trait based off my personal experiences. Either nip it in the butt with an intervention or say goodbye, cause eventually she will be gone or you will be. Take your pick.

[msmooth]

I don't have a problem with lead vocalist (male or female) who does not play an instrument in a band, as long as he/she is going to do the majority of the singing and is a good front person.

 

However, one time I was playing with some guys (Lead vocalist, bass and vocals, me on guitar and vocals, keys and vocals and drums) where the singer was only singing lead on 1/4 - 1/3 of the singing. He didn't play anything else and would sing many backing vocals so there was a lot of "dead" time with him. He refused to do certain songs or play certain places, was adamant that no blue or off color banter/lyrics was permitted, because if children heard it would affect his image. He then wanted to bring in another guitarist which would have put us at 6 piece. ... I only stayed with them for 2 weeks. I have since formed another band with the bassist (and now the drummer) and have been playing out for about a year and 1/2, while he is still trying to find a band. He is a very good singer.

[msmooth]

I also played in a band that had two lead singers the male sang and played sax on some songs and percussion on some and the female singer played some keyboards and some percussion also. It worked out well.

 

In a duo situation I would the other singer to play something to help fill out the sound. However, I would do a duo with my wife if I could talk her into it. She is an amzing singer (she can harmonize with a fart!!) and we have a good musical connection and seem to know where the other is going to go.

[daddymack]

In the 80s, my band went through several female lead vocalists...but they were not technically 'fronting the band'. None were 'just singing'; I agree with TAH that in a small ensemble (4 piece in this case) it is not unreasonable for everyone to contribute to the overall sound so they all had to either play keys, or rhythm guitar, at a minimum. In that band the bassist also played guitar, I covered guitar, keyboards, harmonica and bass, and the drummer could play keyboards, as well as harmonica while he drummed.

The ladies were there to give us breadth...to let us do more material than what most other cover bands were doing....and when it worked, it worked well. We all sang lead on more than one song per set; sadly every one of the ladies decided they should be the focus, should be running things, should have total control over the material (even what they didn't sing), etc. because for some odd reason, being the only female on stage, 90% of the 'audience attention' at breaks went to them...go figure...which obviously led to them thinking they were more important than the rest of the band.

However, that said, I have worked with male lead singers who also felt they should be in total control...I always told them (male or female): when you bring in the charts, and do the arranging for all the instruments, and have the skill to produce the sound of this band, you can be in total control. Until then, bite me.

[chevybusa]

LOL As others have posted, I've had that experience with BOTH genders, and I have had positive experiences with female lead singers, but yeah I can relate and have some interesting stories involving female singers...

 

I remember being in a band once that somehow one of the members met this SMOKING hot chick that wanted to sing for us (the bassist was singing and did a good job) but they were all convinced that having this gorgeous woman fronting us would increase our bookings and we'd all make more money even though we'd be splitting the pay 4 ways instead of 3. I wasn't so convinced, but I figured what the hell, why not.

 

So our first practice with her, she doesn't show up. She texts one of the guys saying she's having "female problems". We reschedule, and she shows up over and hour late, saying she was fighting with her boyfriend. She didn't know ANY of the songs even though she'd been given the set list weeks prior, she had printed out the lyrics, and just kinda half assed tried to sing while reading them...it was a {censored}ing joke. I could tell right away that dealing with her at all was gonna be a complete waste of time but the other guys were conivinced that she just "needed a little more time". Next practice she did do a little better and actually knew SOME of the songs, so I thought, OK, maybe I was wrong, maybe this chick just needs more time. Then next practice she doesn't show up, then texts one of the guys saying she has serious stage fright and anxiety and just can't perfrom. WTF!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

 

Another time I got roped into playing with a band that had a female singer but their guitarist had moved so they needed a new one, and my buddy said I'd be a perfect fit...I called her, got the set list, leanred it, showed up to the first practice, and it was rediculous, the drummer obviousdly had a HUGE crush on her, and was clearly threatened by any other male precenese...the thing is the singer wasxn't interested in him AT ALL, but she wasn't interested in me at all either!!! But this clown wouldn't look me in the eye, would make smart alec comments under his breath without looking at me whenever I said something, would say things about my playing to the singer or bassist without looking at me or acknowledging me, it was just {censored}ed up. After about an hour of this I just said "dude, you've got a serious {censored}ing problem, you're obviously in love with this woman and it's not reciprocated, but I don't know what the {censored} your problem with me is, she isn't interested in me either, so what the {censored} is up?" He then threw a temper tantrum and got up and left...the bassist ran after him and the singer told me that he was "really sensitive". Yeah, I'm really gonna stick around to deal witht hat bull{censored} LOL. I told her sorry but it wasn't gonna happen and loaded up and took off...I told my buddy who recommeded me thegig what had happened and he was surprised, he said he had no idea about any of it...maybe it was just me for some reason the guy thought that I was somehow gonna hook up with the chick, even though like I said she just wasn't interested in me at all...go figure...

 

I also remember being at a show that a band I was in was playing at where the other band had a female lead singer, and while they played great together and evrythng seemed great watching them she was constantly giving shoutouts to her bandmembers and telling the audience how great they were and all that, then afterwards I overheard her talking to some people at the bar, talking all kinds of {censored} about her bandmembers and how being in such a lame band was killing her and all that...unreal...

[chamcham]

Last time I checked, singers do play a musical instrument.

It's called: the voice.

 

Just kidding.....

 

If I recall correctly, PINK can't play anything and it's never been a problem for her.

 

In any case, for most bands, the audience considers the singer to be the single most important person. The lead singer directly interacts with the crowd and at the end of the day, most people only remember the singer's name.

 

Unless you play an instrument yourself, most people don't remember who the

keyboardist,bassist, guitarist, or drummer are. In addition, in an era of pop

music where session musicians record many songs, band members often become faceless.

 

In a sense, this recognition leads to fame (in the sense that the singer becomes the

image of the band) and that becomes power, which then can turn into arrogance.

 

Replace a drummer or bassist and probably no one will notice.

Replace the singer and you might want to consider changing the name of the band.

 

That's the unfortunate reality today.

If it were me, I'd fire the singer and search for a new lead singer.

 

Then post a message on your Social media announcing auditions a new lead singer and go from there.

 

At the end of the day, a band should be about chemistry and not about any single individual. Otherwise, that single person would be better off going solo.

[iloveespguitars]

In my perfect world, my band consists of 5 members. All of which is me.

[mr3lions]

In a perfect world EVERY singer would bring an instrument to the table.

And EVERY member of the band would bring backing vocals to the table.

[mr3lions]

In a perfect world EVERY singer would bring an instrument to the table.

And EVERY member of the band would bring backing vocals to the table.

[Steven S]

 

Ok...so what's your story about female singers with bad attitude?

 

 

Replace them

[tim_7string]

I haven't had a whole lot of experience with female singers. We had one in my first band, but she only sang 2-3 songs. Had a band for nearly two years with a pretty lady as the star. She was unusually helpful and humble. Very sweet, despite her beauty and vocal ability. My wife sang two songs in a project we had three years ago. It overwhelmed her, but she definitely enjoyed the attention.

 

And I had a female bassist that sang about a fourth of the songs in my band last year. Her style didn't really mesh with ours and she did have a bit of an ego. She probably thought we would crash and burn without her. We did appear to get more gigs while she was in the band, but it wasn't just for her singing. Anyway, when she pulled some stuff I didn't agree with, I decided to risk it and fired her. If anything, it has refocused our band to become what we are really all about.

 

 

Well, I'll contend that keyboard players get slagged with owning and dragging great piles of equipment because they're expected to cover so many bases. At the very least they deserve danger pay.

 

 

A guy I went to school with once proposed the idea of paying shares to musicians based on what they did musically. I thought that was kind of funny. I used the example of Rush and asked him if he thought Geddy Lee deserved three-fifths of the money because he sings all the songs, plays bass guitar and plays keyboards, while the other guys 'merely' play guitar and drums. He said yeah.

 

So, if you divide up money based on job, that would be lead vocals, guitar, bass guitar, drums which is 25% for each job. In my trio, that would mean that since I sing 2/3rds of the songs and play guitar, while the bass player sings 1/3rd of the songs and the drummer 'only' drums (quite well too), the drummer should only get 25% of the money, the bass player should get 33.3% (25% + 8.3%) and I should get the rest at 41.67% (25% + 16.67%). If I sang lead on all the songs, I'd get 50% and the bassist would just get 25%.

 

I personally feel that if the work is equally divided, everyone should get paid the same. Since that has been rare in my experience and I'm usually the one doing the bandleader duties, as well as promo, booking, equipment purchases, upkeep and rentals, I take 10% off the top and divide the remaining 90% three ways.

 

When going from a four-piece to a three-piece, it's easy to feel like the drummer is doing the same work whether it's a trio or quartet, but I feel this way is fair. It also means that we have to get paid a lot more to justify having a fourth member while continuing to get our usual amount of cash (or perhaps a bit more) when sliced four ways.

[cherri]

I play in a pop duo with a female singer. I play guitar, she plays bass. We have no drama. We have wine and cute matching outfits. Our significant others don't display any insecurity about our musical pursuits.

 

We have a trio, but the original drummer (male) had constant personal drama. Now we book shows with whichever of our drummer friends are available, or we play as a duet.

 

My point is, you can't blame drama on gender.

 

I read this thread wondering ... isn't this a forum about solo and duet acts? Seems several of the posters are discussing 4 and 5 piece bands.

[daklander]

 

I, personally, won't work with a singer who can't play well at the same time...too many other singer/musicians to choose from who can, and it's what everyone brings to the table...when you're 1/2 or 1/3 of the act, everyone must wear more than one hat. ..........

 

 

In your case Terry, you are the front man when you pull in additional backup musicians so with that in mind you are correct. However, if the singer in a duo, or band with more members, is the one who keeps it all going on stage but does not play another instrument they, male or female, should be paid a commensurate share. If you own all the equipment, do all the booking & etc that share needs to be addressed when the interview takes place. However, a singer has an instrument, their voice, and to outright require an additional instrument seems to be very possibly ignoring someone who could well make a huge difference in your show and subsequent bookings and income.

Of course, what works for you works and that's great but keep in mind the difference in locals may well make a huge difference in the availability of multi-instrumentalists.

[EightString]

I would like to have watched as someone tried to tell Frank Sinatra that he didn't deserve as much pay because he was "just" a singer.

[chamcham]

If instruments represent body parts, they would be:

 

Singer - boobs/chest

Keyboard - head

Guitar - penis/vagina

Drums - arms and feet

Bass - booty

 

Naturally, singers are gonna be the first (and often only) thing people notice.

Keyboardists will be praised by cerebral intellectuals.

Guitarists get the groupies.

Drummers are the support and foundation and so are invisible and taken for granted.

Bassists will have fans that don't understand why singers are so popular.

[Bob Dey]

Female Singers and their bad attitudes - pMs comment

 

Let her know that she is replaceable. Everybody is aren't they? She could start her own band, buy a PA, truck to carry equipment, replace musicians with bad attitudes, plan rehearsals, arrange songs, find gigs etc.

[pogo97]

I would like to have watched as someone tried to tell Frank Sinatra that he didn't deserve as much pay because he was "just" a singer.

 

Sinatra's relationship with Tommy Dorsey was troubled, because of their contract, which awarded Dorsey one-third of Sinatra's lifetime earnings in the entertainment industry. In January 1942, Sinatra recorded his first solo sessions without the Dorsey band (but with Dorsey's arranger Axel Stordahl and with Dorsey's approval)...

[Notes_Norton]

Divas or Divos - it doesn't matter - they are not welcome in my band.

 

No matter how popular you are, even if you are as popular as Elvis Presley or Aretha Franklin were, you are just a singer. Same goes for other musicians.

 

Many years ago our band was hired to play backup for a lead singer. Male, good looking, great voice, wonderful stage presence, and a brother manager. The guy was a divo and as far as his brother was concerned, could do no wrong, even if he didn't sing the song in the same arrangement that he asked for the day before.

 

We made it about 4 practice sessions and told the brother it just won't work out and went our separate ways.

 

Later on we found out he was a rising star in Las Vegas who got "kicked out of town" because of his divo attitude.

 

Nobody in the band is more important than anyone else, and the audience is more important than everybody in the band.

 

Insights and incites by Notes ?

[Shaster]

But every time ... EVERY TIME, the female singer in the duo starts lobbying to get more songs. First, it's a covert effort during set-list arrangement. Then I point out the discrancy and it's, "Oh, sorry..." Then it turns more overt. "I think that I would sound better singing that song.", trying to get the band to help her "steal" songs she likes away. Not knowing that when she isn't around, sometimes audience members tell the band that I'm the better singer, and the band would sound better if I sang more. Then it becomes blatant. I have had a female co-singer just launch into the vocal on one of my songs at a gig. Wow. Maybe if I worked in a duo with another male singer, I would encounter the same behavior? I don't know. God, I love being a solo act.

 

Funny, even before I read your post I was going to say... the biggest difference between male and female singers I have found is that with a "psycho" male singer, I will know right away. The first moment I meet a full tilt ego guy, I know immediately. With female singers I have found that it takes time. They test the waters, see who's strong and who is weak, and then (if they are diva's) they strike; with a vengeance.

 

Naturally I have worked with many wonderful female and male singers, but I've usually found the nutty females are like sleeper agents, while their male counterparts are like visible wierdos with a big sign that says "hire me at your own risk".

[EightString]

 

Funny, even before I read your post I was going to say... the biggest difference between male and female singers I have found is that with a "psycho" male singer, I will know right away. The first moment I meet a full tilt ego guy, I know immediately. With female singers I have found that it takes time. They test the waters, see who's strong and who is weak, and then (if they are diva's) they strike; with a vengeance. Naturally I have worked with many wonderful female and male singers, but I've usually found the nutty females are like sleeper agents, while their male counterparts are like visible wierdos with a big sign that says "hire me at your own risk".

 

 

 

I hate to say it, but I can relate.

 

The problem-child guy singers throw off a palpable "steer clear" vibe right away. I can spot the raging 'tude from a d-bag male singer almost instantly.

[Terry Allan Hall]

 

In your case Terry, you are the front man when you pull in additional backup musicians so with that in mind you are correct. However, if the singer in a duo, or band with more members, is the one who keeps it all going on stage but does not play another instrument they, male or female, should be paid a commensurate share. If you own all the equipment, do all the booking & etc that share needs to be addressed when the interview takes place. However, a singer has an instrument, their voice, and to outright require an additional instrument seems to be very possibly ignoring someone who could well make a huge difference in your show and subsequent bookings and income. Of course, what works for you works and that's great but keep in mind the difference in locals may well make a huge difference in the availability of multi-instrumentalists.

 

 

Some valid points...

[stunningbabe]

Another prob with having 1 female singer in the band : EVeryone in the Band wants to sleep with her! Due to this...jealousy is the name of the game. She knows all the guys wanna bed her...so she plays hard to get..and flirts with the drummer one...then with the bassist the next day...and etc....and giving false hopes to each dude in the band.

[stunningbabe]

She manipulates each dude with her sex appeal to her advantage.

[eyesore]

yeah ;i guess we've all paid our dues with "bands". thats why we're all solo- duo 's now! [i am anyway]

[Guitarman63]

I play in two power trios, as well as my solo gig. "No chicks in the band" has always been my motto. I have seen it quite a few times with other bands, the chick dates one of the members then all of a sudden she is with someone else in the band then the next thing you know, no more band. It is hard enough getting, and keeping a good band together without drama. Let alone throwing a girl in the mix. Don't get me wrong, I like to listen to a good female singer who can front a band, and if she is easy on the eyes even better. But I don't need the extra B.S. in my projects. Just my opinion......