Members Beck Posted October 9, 2015 Members Share Posted October 9, 2015 Cassette came a long way, and there were more improvements waiting in the wings had we not seen the writing on the wall with CD and all that. I never had anything like a Nak Dragon, but there was so much good stuff to choose from... not the least of which was the pro Tascam stuff which was defacto standard for cassette in every TV or recording studio I've ever been in. There was always one 122 or 122 MKII/III. The tape improved too by leaps and bounds with cobalt modified high bias stuff like TDK SA. Even my comparatively cheap Tascam 102 MKII does 20hz - 18kHz +/- 3db, less than 1% distortion and about 80 dB S/N with Dolby C using Tascam's standard setup tape at the time... TDK SA. TDK SA-X exceeds the factory specs, which by the way were always conservative. While other manufacturers tended to fudge numbers, Tascam had a good rep for listing conservative specs and exceeding those listed specs in actual use. Yeah, 1-7/8 ips is a little slow, but Improvements in tape formulation... finer, more densely coated oxide had the same effect as faster speeds. More and better particles per square inch is in effect the same as speeding up a normal tape. Well anyway, here's some eye candy for those who are still fond of the stuff. This is roughly 1/3 of my NOS stash, mostly TDK and Maxell of different types and eras. And don't hate me because my tape is beautiful, ok? Ok then... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ernest Buckley Posted October 9, 2015 Members Share Posted October 9, 2015 It's not a replacement for a DAW. It's an alternative to MP3s. It's something tangible, physical that someone can hold while goin' "old school". It's fun, different, and physical. Nothing more than that. Everyone realizes what it is. Everyone except me. I don`t see any fun in carrying around a bunch of archaic cassette tapes…. did that back in HS…. then the CD came along and carried a portable one along for a while… even ran with one… what a PITA. I just don`t understand any of this. I really enjoy having everything I need on my phone, including podcasts… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Beck Posted October 9, 2015 Members Share Posted October 9, 2015 Ernest, you know you want it!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blue2blue Posted October 9, 2015 Members Share Posted October 9, 2015 I am beginning to wonder if there is something else at play here, that has less to do with music and more to do with the way we interact with it and our continued dependency on computers. For example, today on the BBC there was an article talking about how our memory is being changed due to the computer. We no longer need to remember anything, instead we 'google' it. Sometimes repeatedly. (http://www.bbc.com/news/education-34454264). Not that long ago when I was back in school I read an article about how students who used electronic textbooks had a greater loss of retention of the material compared to those who used 'dead tree' textbooks. For me, I found it much harder trying to use and find stuff in the one electronic textbook I used one semester. After that it was back to the dead tree versions for me, even if they cost more. Today we see folks turning to vinyl and cassettes. When folks talk about their experience with these mediums of music, they talk about the time to actually setup the record on the turntable, reviewing the notes, taking a break to rewind the tape, etc. Could a similar thing be happening here? That when all music is digital and there is no interaction with the medium, our retention of it is diminished? It doesn't hold our attention like the music on a physical medium, where there is an interaction between the music medium and the user. Maybe I'm crazy (wouldn't be the first time I've been accused of that ), but do you think there might be a connection here? I'm not so sure about the supposed superiority of physical reading medium over electronic -- although I'm sure that for those who are easily distracted, studying something they're not interested in on the same computer that is loaded with all their entertainment and social media pastimes is going to be a challenge. I'm not entirely sold by the experience of reading on my tablet -- pages are too small for reading convenience and it's plenty annoying holding it up in reading position -- I'll use the easel but once you put the easel on a table, you might as well be reading from your nicer computer, it's going to be an all 'round more pleasant experience. But reading for information gathering and retention, I'd much rather do it on the computer where it's easy to take notes and outline my thoughts with links to specific sections of the material if at all possible. However, you may have something on the physical interaction with vinyl. Me, I get no sense of 'engagement' whatsoever from popping a cassette in -- and I've popped thousands of cassettes in over the years, tens of, probably. But there was, for me, a sense of engagement with my discs and turntable. My record collection was very important to me (and still has personal historic value to me) and I did everything I could to ease the heartbreak of record wear and damage, always cleaning records thoroughly before play, using inner sleeves properly, never playing them more than once a day. There was a ritual -- however not one I had any real enjoyment of. Each play, each cleaning seemed to take the records one step farther away from pristine listenability. Well, it wasn't just seeming. (And, yes, I would buy new copies of certain records -- and, of course, later 'replaced' a number of favorite LPs with CDs; I didn't get rid of the LPs, but I didn't, you know, listen to them.) So, for me, the ritual wasn't about enjoyment or preparation for the 'event' of listening -- it was simply about trying to preserve the fidelity going forward. Have I missed that? Hell, no. Are you nuts? I have ears. I can hear the much higher fidelity of properly mastered CDs. And if I couldn't evaluate my own experience, I'd nonetheless have the 'assurance' of every objective measure of audio quality at our disposal that the sound was far better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blue2blue Posted October 9, 2015 Members Share Posted October 9, 2015 Given that it's a Nakamichi, the spec sheet probably had a tolerance on that frequency response. I have a Sony TDC-5M that I used as a field recorder when I couldn't afford a Nagra. I used it enough so that I wore out the head and had to replace it. I did a full checkout and tune-up with the new head and it was about 1 dB down at 18 kHz. My reel-to-reel recorders of the time weren't that good. Frequency response isn't everything, and unless it was way off in the mid range, it's doubtful that anyone, musician or not, could tell you that it was several dB down at 20 kHz. Tape path stability and noise are really more significant. Toi get rid of the noise that comes along with extending the bandwidth for low tape speed and narrow tracks, we got Dolby (and occasionally dbx) noise reduction, and that introduced its own anomalies that could be easily deteced in an A/B comparison. Same with tape path instability which causes modulation noise (including linear and "scrape" flutter), also easy to detect. I'm not defending the cassette. I'm happy to have something better to use now. But a good quality cassetted deck brought better recording capability to the home than with the home-priced reel-to-reel recorders of the day. Did you ever compare your cassette recordings to a tape recorded and played on your grandfather's Webcor? And it was a success as an in-car player where mobile disk players were a dreadful failure. Are people who are buying new cassettes also getting overhauled Nakamichi Dragons to play them on? Is this another Tape Project only with cassettes? I don't think so. I expect that today's cassette fans are audiophiles, they just think it's cool and retro. Me? I'm waiting for someone to write a web browser for my Commodore VIC-20. Then I'll get it out of the closet. I'm with you for everything except, maybe, the comparison to 'home-priced' reel-to-reel recorders. If you mean the very low end stuff, the Lloyds junk and such, sure, yeah. But even once you got above the no-names and up into even the Sony stereo decks (and I had one, their cheapest in the US in 1969 -- equivalent to $780 today) and used 7-1/2 ips you had at least somewhat superior sound to all but possibly the best cassette decks. (Admittedly, my Sony deck didn't have the speed accuracy of the TASCAM's that powered my old analog personal rig, or the HF response, even at 7-1/2; but the TASCAMs were made to sell at a much higher price point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blue2blue Posted October 9, 2015 Members Share Posted October 9, 2015 Originally posted by UstadKhanAli It's not a replacement for a DAW. It's an alternative to MP3s. It's something tangible, physical that someone can hold while goin' "old school". It's fun, different, and physical. Nothing more than that. Everyone realizes what it is. Everyone except me. I don`t see any fun in carrying around a bunch of archaic cassette tapes…. did that back in HS…. then the CD came along and carried a portable one along for a while… even ran with one… what a PITA. I just don`t understand any of this. I really enjoy having everything I need on my phone, including podcasts… And me. Of course. Let's make a pros and cons list for cassettes... [TABLE=width: 500] [TR] [TD]PROS[/TD] [TD]CONS[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD] [/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]tangible[/TD] [TD]requires physical storage space -- a nontrivial issue for even a relatively small collection[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD]no direct access to tracks[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD]high hiss without noise reduction[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD]noise reduction reduces fidelity; 'advanced' NR introduces dynamic tracking error[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD]poorest time domain performance of any popular music medium in terms of flutter; overall speed accuracy typically spec'd at 2% for consumer machines[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD]real time counters expensive and inaccurate[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD]susceptible to physical damage, even from sunlight; susceptible, like all magnetic tape, to humidity issue damage[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD]high distortion[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD]poor bass and treble response, uneven frequency response in general[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]more convenient shape than LP, marginally lighter[/TD] [TD]smallest graphic display space of any mainstream physical medium; even mp3s allow embedded graphics[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD]susceptible to damage from magnetic fields (speakers, old-fashioned CRT TV's and monitors, refrigerators and other appliances with powerful electric motors)[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD]noticeable degradation from a single copy; daisy chain copies become nearly unlistenable in only a few iterations[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]high nostalgia value for some[/TD] [TD]no longer cheap or readily available, particularly as magnetic tape stock is expended[/TD] [/TR] [/TABLE] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mandolin Picker Posted October 9, 2015 Members Share Posted October 9, 2015 However, you may have something on the physical interaction with vinyl. ... But there was, for me, a sense of engagement with my discs and turntable. My record collection was very important to me (and still has personal historic value to me) and I did everything I could to ease the heartbreak of record wear and damage, always cleaning records thoroughly before play, using inner sleeves properly, never playing them more than once a day. There was a ritual -- however not one I had any real enjoyment of. Each play, each cleaning seemed to take the records one step farther away from pristine listenability. Well, it wasn't just seeming. (And, yes, I would buy new copies of certain records -- and, of course, later 'replaced' a number of favorite LPs with CDs; I didn't get rid of the LPs, but I didn't, you know, listen to them.) So, for me, the ritual wasn't about enjoyment or preparation for the 'event' of listening -- it was simply about trying to preserve the fidelity going forward. Have I missed that? Hell, no. Are you nuts? I have ears. I can hear the much higher fidelity of properly mastered CDs. And if I couldn't evaluate my own experience, I'd nonetheless have the 'assurance' of every objective measure of audio quality at our disposal that the sound was far better. In some ways, I think you may have strengthened my point. Never said the 'engagement' had to be positive or enjoyable. The mere fact that you had a ritual to clean the records and use the inner sleeves made the music more valuable - it was something to be taken care of otherwise the music would suffer. There is no such interaction today. Nothing to take care. Nothing to indicate any value to the music that is contained in the medium of 0s and 1s. The music players themselves are often not dedicated machines (unlike turntables, amps and cassette decks) but rather just another piece of software (that is often free) and a small part of an overall computer or phone system. When taken in as a whole, how we interact with music now verses 20 years ago, we devalue the medium in which the music is delivered. We don't have to take care of it (its always there as part of the stream), we don't have to buy equipment specific to listen to it (the software is included as part of the computer or available through a web site). We might even get it for free if we don't mind listening to commercials. All of this can be seen as 'devaluing' music. The music hasn't changed, but we no longer have to take care of it or how we listen to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blue2blue Posted October 9, 2015 Members Share Posted October 9, 2015 In some ways, I think you may have strengthened my point. Never said the 'engagement' had to be positive or enjoyable. The mere fact that you had a ritual to clean the records and use the inner sleeves made the music more valuable - it was something to be taken care of otherwise the music would suffer. There is no such interaction today. Nothing to take care. Nothing to indicate any value to the music that is contained in the medium of 0s and 1s. The music players themselves are often not dedicated machines (unlike turntables, amps and cassette decks) but rather just another piece of software (that is often free) and a small part of an overall computer or phone system. When taken in as a whole, how we interact with music now verses 20 years ago, we devalue the medium in which the music is delivered. We don't have to take care of it (its always there as part of the stream), we don't have to buy equipment specific to listen to it (the software is included as part of the computer or available through a web site). We might even get it for free if we don't mind listening to commercials. All of this can be seen as 'devaluing' music. The music hasn't changed, but we no longer have to take care of it or how we listen to it. [bold added] Would gold-plated disks telegraph more musical value? I've seen thousands of live music shows. What did I take away? The music. Things are tangible. Music is not. Me, I value music more than ever. I have 1900 albums and at least another 100, maybe 200 singles and 78s. The fact that these days I don't physically open them up and fuss with machines in between listens or that I can find almost anything I want to hear in a matter of seconds, or that I am able to create wildly eclectic mixes on the fly -- a process I used to labor HOURS over in tape days -- has not in any way I can imagine devalued music -- to me. In fact, it has increased my enjoyment enormously and freed my tastes to explore as far and wide as I like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members dboomer Posted October 10, 2015 Members Share Posted October 10, 2015 I don't think anyone "yearns" for cassettes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mandolin Picker Posted October 10, 2015 Members Share Posted October 10, 2015 Folks, it not the actual physical media or cassettes or vinyl or tape or CD. Its the ownership and effort that is put into it. Music today has relegated itself to elevator music status. Its ubiquitous. Its everywhere and you don't have to do anything special to get it. Generally anything that comes that easily looses value. Think about it this way. Two groups of people who have the same model automobile - same year, make and model - same options - everything identical. The first group of people purchases the vehicle, takes the time to hand wash and wax their car, changes the oil, gets under the hood, etc. Some even put a cover on it every night. Then you have the second group who leases the car. They may run it through a car wash when its dirty and maybe take it to Jiffy Lube to get an oil change. Chances are the first group places a higher value on their car then the second group. There is ownership in the first group, and there is involvement with the vehicle. The second group is simply paying to use the vehicle, and they will get another one in a couple of years anyway. Chances are they place a lower value on the vehicle. Both groups are talking about the same car. With music, there are some folks like us, who spend money to own music, make music, record music. We are much like the first group that owns the care, hand washes and waxes, and changes oil. The music, like the car, has value. The majority of folks today are more like the second group. They don't own music instead they steam it - just like the second group that leases the car. They may update the software (like running a car through a car wash) but there isn't a lot of involvement with the music. If they don't like what's playing, just wait a bit and something new will come along. Years ago, most folks were in the first group as they had to buy a turn table or cassette deck, and take care of the music. And they owned it. Today, not so much. Today, music doesn't have the value among most folks that it use to have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Anderton Posted October 10, 2015 Members Share Posted October 10, 2015 I am beginning to wonder if there is something else at play here' date=' that has less to do with music and more to do with the way we interact with it and our continued dependency on computers. For example, today on the BBC there was an article talking about how our memory is being changed due to the computer. We no longer need to remember anything, instead we 'google' it. Sometimes repeatedly. (http://www.bbc.com/news/education-34454264). Not that long ago when I was back in school I read an article about how students who used electronic textbooks had a greater loss of retention of the material compared to those who used 'dead tree' textbooks. [/quote'] It's been established time and time again that when more senses are involved in the learning process, the greater the retention. A physical book engages the sense of smell, touch, and also, the audible results of flipping pages...maybe even writing in the margins. But if you're crazy, I'll raise the bar. The brain is capable of rewiring itself, we know that because of accident victims and such. The saying that we only use 10% of our brain's capacity, if true, may mean we have a lot of redundant backup systems. I think modern society may be rewiring its brains to convert ROM into RAM. We have such a huge amount of stimulus flying past us every second, and it goes into our brain, no matter how briefly. We need to retain virtually none of it, because it's so easily accessible if we want to, although most of the time we don't. We needed a fair amount of ROM to survive, but no longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Notes_Norton Posted October 10, 2015 Members Share Posted October 10, 2015 I don't know about you Craig, but I'm using more than 10% - I'm flat out pedal to the floor full tilt boogie and wishing I had more You mentioned all the senses. I walked into a used record store in Miami, Florida back in the 1980s (Blue Note Records). Bob, the owner had original Charlie Parker LPs on the Dial Label. He would take them out from under the counter, open them a bit, and smell the record with a deep inhale -- like you would savor the aroma of a cup of coffee. Sure, he did this as a lighthearted display of reverence, but it was effective. I do miss the album cover art of an LP and there is a nostalgia for watching the record spin and the tone arm make it's way to the middle of the record. I prefer the warm distortion of the record over the harsh distortion of the CD (each changes the tone of the original), but I prefer to listen on CDs. I don't like the surface noise of the record, I find the pops and crackles distracting, I like the longer length of the CD and I've gotten used to the difference in tone. (I've heard my favorite tenor sax player, Stan Getz in person, and his tone is truer on LP than on CD). I find somethings lend themselves to the CD distortion and others do not. Stan Getz and vocalist Mark Murphy sound better on LP. Symphony orchestras sound better on CD, the violins have more 'ice' to them. But I listen to Mark and Stan on my CD. Others like Stanley Turrentine sound good in either medium. Of course these are my ears and the result of my experience. One size does not fit all. In the car, I listen to mp3s on my iPod. With road noise and everything else, it's not a pristine listening environment and convenience trumps fidelity. I have about 10,000 songs on my iPod culled from my LP and CD collection and a few that I've purchased on Amazon. But I have absolutely no love or nostalgia for cassettes. They were a convenient tool in their day, but they involved too many compromises to be missed by me. Between tape hiss, high frequency loss, and the occasional feeding of the tape machine (no matter how clean the heads, when the machine is hungry, it eats tapes), I found the tool useful but full of hassles. I do have some virgin still in the wrapper tapes. Anybody want to buy them? Insights and incites by Notes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blue2blue Posted October 10, 2015 Members Share Posted October 10, 2015 There's a psychological dysfunction known as fetishism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mark L Posted October 10, 2015 Members Share Posted October 10, 2015 I have a fondness for cassette tapes. My first multitrack recorder was tape cassette-based. Here's a pic. I hope this works... It's even got Dobly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blue2blue Posted October 10, 2015 Members Share Posted October 10, 2015 I think what I find so bothersome about this is the repeated and seemingly unavoidable implication that those of us who don't show a slavish adulation of things are 'devaluing' music. I find that offensive, plain and simple -- although I strongly doubt Bob is intentionally trying to offend; I suspect he takes an if-the-shoe-fits sort of approach. But it's still very bothersome. I've seen well over 170 live, symphonic concerts and countless thousands of other live musical shows ranging from Louis Armstrong and a reconstituted Hot Five, to Jimi Hendrix. to Doc Watson, to Pepe Romero, to the LA first wave punkers, the Germs, to Fela Kuti, to Argentine tango master, Astor Piazzolla and a good slice of everything in between. And, with regard to the tools of both listening and creating: I have 1200+ LPs, 500+ CDs, and between 100 and 200 singles and 78s. I've owned everything from wind-up acoustic phonographs to modern, high precision 'tables, I've owned 10 reel tape decks (5 of them multitrack), over 30 cassette decks (not counting portables and microcassettes), I even searched high and low to buy a HI FI VHS Stereo deck with AVC-defeat to avail myself of the then-best (arguable) quality home analog; all that not to mention several DAT machines, a 16 track ADAT rig, as well as early CD burners that were not just plenty expensive to buy but 'outrageously' expensive to feed (for a while, anyway -- my first blanks cost $18 a piece! And, of course, there's my current 10 channel DAW rig.) So I've been around several blocks. Several times. One thing I don't do is I don't conflate music with medium. I don't confuse music with things. And I find it perplexing to have to suffer under the implication that such an attitude somehow 'debases' music. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blue2blue Posted October 10, 2015 Members Share Posted October 10, 2015 I have a fondness for cassette tapes. My first multitrack recorder was tape cassette-based. Here's a pic. I hope this works... It's even got Dobly! I'll bet you had a lot of fun, despite its apparent modest feature set -- and I'm guessing, not-necessarily stellar technical quality. It has kind of an early Fostex look. Did they market Fostex in the UK? My first tape recorder didn't even have a capstan. The 'erase head' was a permanent magnet glued to a brass spring lever that pushed against the tape in record mode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mark L Posted October 10, 2015 Members Share Posted October 10, 2015 I'll bet you had a lot of fun, despite its apparent modest feature set -- and I'm guessing, not-necessarily stellar technical quality. It has kind of an early Fostex look. Did they market Fostex in the UK? My first tape recorder didn't even have a capstan. The 'erase head' was a permanent magnet glued to a brass spring lever that pushed against the tape in record mode. I had a ton of fun with it. Sound quality was bad, even with Dobly. However, I found it quite incredible that you could record on FOUR SEPARATE TRACKS!! And yes, Fostex gear was sold in the UK. Way out of my price-bracket, though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blue2blue Posted October 10, 2015 Members Share Posted October 10, 2015 The original Portastudio 144 listed for $1100 in the US, according to http://museumofmagneticsoundrecording.org -- adjusted for inflation that's a little over $3600. You could buy a new Toyota Corolla for less than twice that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mandolin Picker Posted October 10, 2015 Members Share Posted October 10, 2015 I think what I find so bothersome about this is the repeated and seemingly unavoidable implication that those of us who don't show a slavish adulation of things are 'devaluing' music. I find that offensive' date=' plain and simple -- although I [i']strongly[/i] doubt Bob is intentionally trying to offend; I suspect he takes an if-the-shoe-fits sort of approach. But it's still very bothersome. And I find it perplexing to have to suffer under the implication that such an attitude somehow 'debases' music. No one trying to offend anyone on this end. More so just observations as to how society treats music today as opposed to 20, 30, 40 years ago. I think one of the worst things we ever did was to take music out of the schools. Everytime the school budget was cut the art and music departments took the hit. It got worse when the STEM curricula hit the schools. I know one music teacher in our county who teaches at 5 different schools - a different school every day. And there are some schools that don't have music that often. Everytime we do stuff like this, it shows what value we as a society place on music. So no, its not just the material things of music (like vinyl or tape) - it is the whole attitude towards music. Over the past years we have taken more and more of the value away in the things we do, and the technology we use in consuming music. Some of it is conscious (like cutting school funding), and some of it isn't (the medium that stores the music). Folks like us that visit forums like this are the exception, not the rule. We have the stuff of music all around us. But the majority of music consumers don't, because they no longer need to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blue2blue Posted October 11, 2015 Members Share Posted October 11, 2015 Well, I certainly agree with you on the unfortunate dearth of funding for music arts education in so very many school districts around the country. Not everyone is going to want to be a musician, but the overwhelming majority of people enjoy music to some degree -- and the handful that don't at least deserve a decent chance to see what all the noise is about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Anderton Posted October 11, 2015 Members Share Posted October 11, 2015 I've always thought there was an analog to the hardcover/paperback thinking in publishing. The LP was the "hardcover," the cassette the "paperback" that was cheaper, more portable, and of less concern if you misplaced it on Summer vacation. Then the CD became the hardcover, and the MP3 the paperback. I think where we're going is FLAC will become the hardcover (although I'm not sure how/if that will manifest itself as a physical format), and streaming the paperback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members UstadKhanAli Posted October 11, 2015 Members Share Posted October 11, 2015 Everyone except me. I don`t see any fun in carrying around a bunch of archaic cassette tapes…. did that back in HS…. then the CD came along and carried a portable one along for a while… even ran with one… what a PITA. I just don`t understand any of this. I really enjoy having everything I need on my phone, including podcasts… So would I....if I actually put things on my phone (I hate wearing ear buds and headphones, and listen to stuff in the car or near a computer, so I don't need stuff on my phone). But remember: It's not a replacement for a DAW. It's an alternative to MP3s. It's something tangible, physical that someone can hold while goin' "old school". It's fun, different, and physical. Nothing more than that. Everyone realizes what it is. You realize what it is. It's different. It's solid. Tangible. Different. You interact with it. That's all you have to know. That's what some like about it. Sure, it's not as convenient and doesn't sound as good. But that's not the point, is it? It's simply different, and different sounding and tangible. That's it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members UstadKhanAli Posted October 11, 2015 Members Share Posted October 11, 2015 And me. Of course. Let's make a pros and cons list for cassettes... [TABLE=width: 500] [TR] [TD]PROS[/TD] [TD]CONS[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD] [/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]tangible[/TD] [TD]requires physical storage space -- a nontrivial issue for even a relatively small collection[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD]no direct access to tracks[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD]high hiss without noise reduction[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD]noise reduction reduces fidelity; 'advanced' NR introduces dynamic tracking error[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD]poorest time domain performance of any popular music medium in terms of flutter; overall speed accuracy typically spec'd at 2% for consumer machines[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD]real time counters expensive and inaccurate[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD]susceptible to physical damage, even from sunlight; susceptible, like all magnetic tape, to humidity issue damage[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD]high distortion[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD]poor bass and treble response, uneven frequency response in general[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]more convenient shape than LP, marginally lighter[/TD] [TD]smallest graphic display space of any mainstream physical medium; even mp3s allow embedded graphics[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD]susceptible to damage from magnetic fields (speakers, old-fashioned CRT TV's and monitors, refrigerators and other appliances with powerful electric motors)[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD] [/TD] [TD]noticeable degradation from a single copy; daisy chain copies become nearly unlistenable in only a few iterations[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]high nostalgia value for some[/TD] [TD]no longer cheap or readily available, particularly as magnetic tape stock is expended[/TD] [/TR] [/TABLE] Most people won't get it. And really, there's not much to get. All of the above is true, of course. But believe me, I go to these places where DJs (or would that be CJs?) are "spinnin'" cassettes. There's record stores that sell these limited release cassettes. I don't want them. You don't want them. Pointing out that they're inferior is, well, obvious. But because they're special, different, tangible, inexpensive, fun (for some) to interact with or collect, or some or all of the above, that makes a very very small niche available. It's not taking the world by storm. It's not nearly as big as LPs, which many on this forum also cannot wrap their heads around. But for some, it's a wonder of yesteryear or something different, just like people collect old 78s or wax cylinders or old Fords or whatever...or simply find interest in them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blue2blue Posted October 11, 2015 Members Share Posted October 11, 2015 I've got a working cassette deck in my car. I don't think I've put an actual cassette in it in a dozen years -- I finally pulled the last of the cassettes out of the hutch under it a few weeks back... I think they may be negatively impacted by a decade in a hot car... ). But thank goodness for the cassette-form-factor electro-magnetic transducer thing I can plug into my cheapo Android (with its $18 32 GB microSD). It came with a portable CD player but I always found that a big pain, hard to control, sensitive to bumps, etc. But the transducer thing is a pretty good conduit from my phone -- not too hi fi, maybe, but then neither were the cassettes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Vito Corleone Posted October 11, 2015 Members Share Posted October 11, 2015 I've got a working cassette deck in my car. I just recently purchased a 2003 Escalade for hauling around my band's trailer with. In addition to the 6 disc CD changer and overhead DVD player, the darn thing has a cassette deck in it! At some point I'll have to pull out some old cassette to see if it still works and what it sounds like, or maybe record a new one? After holding on to my cassette collection for years, a couple of years ago I finally went ahead and trashed the entire thing except for those that serve as "master copies" of old original music and live recordings I've recorded with bands over the years. (After having dumped them to my computer, of course.) But the FIRST thing I did with that car was have Bluetooth and USB added to the sound system. I rarely, if ever, play CDs in any of my cars anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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