When do you think valve amps will become obsolete?

[BHz_econo]

I'm ready for cassettes to make a come back.

[the Dodo]

 

Solid State and Digital modeling has so much potential that's wasted on trying to emulate.

 

 

This.

[THAT4301]

 

Once designers start designing amplifiers that don't use a tube amp as a bench mark. Solid State and Digital modeling has so much potential that's wasted on trying to emulate.

 

 

Oh man, I've been saying this for forever, I'm glad some people agree. "Rather than carving something original, let's try to tap into the already existing "doesn't know any better" market!"

[melx]

 

If people have an amp they're in love with I'd recommend they buy enough valves to last them the rest of their lives now, while they're extremely cheap (sovteks are great, haters gonna hate). The second the chinese or sovtek factory says "not profitable any more", prices are gonna go up and up.

 

 

yeah, this.... when all valves become NOS and only people at TGP can afford them.

[surferbeto]

Tube amps will not become obsolete until the stars fall from the sky. People will always crave that golden tone and the soft glow.

[mr benn]

the D.I.Y scene shows no signs of moving away from tubes,because theirs such an abundance of information out there! be it schematics or forums or pics of old amps to work from

as the internet has taken off so has interest in tube amps,it's a golden age right now as the info is so freely available

even if in 30 or 40 years digital has taken over the mainstream,as long as websites & fourms have Search functions and there's a history of threads with us saying "tubes amps mop the floor with digital" then people will always be curious

[melx]

 

the D.I.Y scene shows no signs of moving away from tubes,because theirs such an abundance of information out there! be it schematics or forums or pics of old amps to work from as the internet has taken off so has interest in tube amps,it's a golden age right now as the info is so freely available even if in 30 or 40 years digital has taken over the mainstream,as long as websites & fourms have Search functions and there's a history of threads with us saying "tubes amps mop the floor with digital" then people will always be curious

 

 

but they won't be able to afford the

[mr benn]

but they won't be able to afford the

[JRBain]

they already ARE

 

This.

 

This is pretty old technology that we're talking about, after all. There have to be more 'effective' ways of amplifying an electric guitar, but we don't want to know. We like our old technology.

 

However, I don't suppose that modelling technology could ever remove the need that some have of tube amps. There's more to a tube amp, particularly an old handwired one, than just the sound. You have the look, the tolex scuffs and wear, the smell, the crackles from old pots and speakers, inconsistencies in the wiring and component values from amp to amp, aged components, old tubes... Digital technology will never be able to recreate that, any more than a Variax could emulate SRV's strat. It might sound roughly the same, but it doesn't feel or look the same, and these are a bigger part of playing music than many are willing to admit.

 

I mean, even if technology evolved to the point that all you needed at the gig was a Steinberger and a USB pen drive to use your presets on the in-house Axe-FX, would the experience be the same? I really don't think it would.

 

Digital modelling has its place. I would love to own an Axe-FX. It gives the user access to recorded guitar sounds that are really very good. Much better than an amateur at home with amps at low volume is likely to achieve otherwise. It also gives me access to all of the guitar tones that I love the sound of but could never justify owning. I daresay that little by little, the big amp companies will start to incorporate digital modelling technology into their high end gear (moreso than they already have), and little by little people will be persuaded that it's perfectly possible to get a great sound with a modeller.

 

I actually don't think that the majority of guitar players are as conservative as we sometimes claim - I have seen no-one as yet complaining about the fact that the El Capistan is digital. It sounds amazing, and that seems to be good enough (as it should be). Based on that, I like to think that if Fender were to produce a completely digital Deluxe Reverb that sounded and played practically the same as the 'real thing', people would buy them.

 

The bottom line I think is that we have a bad impression of digital technology because of crappy Boss pedals, Zoom Multi-FXs and old PODs...

[mr benn]

the problem lies squarly at the feet of the brands though,they seen solid state and then digital as a way to make something cheaper,not as an avenue for development to make it better

and it's obviously left a bad taste

 

I played an award session sessionette 75 (I think?) and it sounded fantastic with not a valve in sight! why?

because they put alot of work and good old fashioned English audio engineering into designing a good circuit using very high quality parts,it would wipe the floor with any DSP loaded valvestate!

but nobody bought them because they are "expensive for only a solid-state amp"

 

it's the same for the old Jazz Chorus amps!

[TheQuietWilds]

A few things I wanna say in this conversation:

 

The electric guitar and tubes are dialectically connected. Tube amps, electric guitars and effects pedals are all made to sound good together. When will tube amps be obsolete? When people stop building guitars and effects based on what sounds good coming through a tube amp. When people build a guitar, they probably bench test it through a fender, marshal and vox amplifier to make sure it sounds right. Guitar amps are then tested and designed to sound good with those guitars, and the cycle continues. Same dialectic is applicable to effects - they are designed with the 'limitations' of tube circuitry and electric guitars in mind. Solid state has two choices - break from that dialectic or emulate. The latter is dramatically commercially easier, if less effective in the long run at creating an interesting and useful niche.

 

Tubes are widely used in places other than guitar amps - pro audio and hi-fi gear for example. I wouldn't expect to see tube manufacturing declining any time in the next two or three decades, as we are really just entering into the heyday of consumer pro audio gear (vs most pro audio gear being bought by commercial studios). Personal studios is a dramatically larger retail base that will (and is) leading to a flourishing of boutique pro audio gear sold to an avocational audience. We are also entering into a golden era of boutique production w/r/t guitar gear. I don't see this market going quickly downhill any time soon. By boutique here i mean the literal dictionary definition of the word, not just 'high quality/price.'

 

EDIT: It all has to do with the subjective yet shared experience of music. Take the violin for example - lots of people made violins in different ways at some point. At some point, someone heard the violin and appreciated certain qualities about it and developed techniques or wrote music that relied on their subjective appreciation of one version of the violin. Someone heard that music, or learned that technique, and built a violin based on their appreciation of certain qualities of that music. With every generation of violins and violin music, the definition and qualities that define a 'good' violin or violin composition tightened, until there is actually a pretty wide agreement about what exactly makes a great violin. The same thing has happened between guitars and rock, and between guitars and tube amps.

 

TL;DR? Tubes aren't going anywhere, as they've become inextricable from our cultural consensus on electric guitar and electric guitar based music.

[surferbeto]

People were talking like y'all about tube amps being obsolete and going away back in the early 1980s. But they didn't. They came back because they sound great and people like them. They feedback and distort in very endearing ways that can be imitated but (arguably) not improved upon by modeling tech. Modeling tech can probably invent new, cool things that never were, but I don't think they'll ever completely supplant tubes for making tube tone.

[imbuedblue]

Tube amps will become obsolete when something comes along to replace the 1960s as the Golden Age of pop music.

[pbone]

I don't ever think people will stop using tube amps, but the alternatives (solid state & modeling) will continue to get much, much better and closer to replicating tube amps. The modeling thing is probably going to be the first to get there, every patch and update gets us a little bit closer.

[THAT4301]

Does anybody seriously still think of the 60s as the golden age of pop music, who wasn't alive at the time?

[pbone]

...yeah...

[THAT4301]

WELL YOUR OPINION IS WRONG.

[pbone]

...yeah...

[SnowViking]

As long as there are electric guitars there will be valve amps.

 

Obsolete in 5 or 10 years?

 

That's cheered me up.

 

[scolfax]

 

Once designers start designing amplifiers that don't use a tube amp as a bench mark. Solid State and Digital modeling has so much potential that's wasted on trying to emulate. Although Vintage {censored} will always be coolio.

 

 

+1

[macadood]

is classical music dead? in some ways yes, in others no - similar to tube amps. not many people listen to classical music anymore, at least the majority of the younger people in the West - yet there are still plenty of people who listen to and enjoy it and theres still a market for it.

 

amp modelling has its advantages but has some disadvantages too, i dont see it ever taking over a toob amp.

 

and will rock n roll ever die? i'd hope not, but will it become what music of the 20s or 30s is to us now? that was only like 80 years ago!!!

[BlueSteam]

 

As long as there are electric guitars there will be valve amps.

 

 

+1

 

And it's been said already, but there are more tube amps available right now than ever before. Just a little over a decade ago when I first started playing, tube amps cost more than beginners could afford. With what's available today in the beginner's market, I'd say a whole new generation of tube lovers is being raised. On a different, but kind similar note, the acoustic guitar didn't go away because the electric guitar became popular.

[evets618]

This is like asking if real women will go away because porn is so much better now.

If tube amps go away, what will the modelers model?

ROTFLMAO.

[TheStallionMang]

Please don't take my tube amps away.