Is Buddhism a cult?

[UstadKhanAli]

It would surprise me.

[Ernest Buckley]

If you do a little reading about Christianity, in its infant days it was considered a cult. When Rome was becoming more populated with Christians that any other cult/religion, the dude ruling the land at the time (can`t remember his name right now) thought it would be a good political move for him if he made the cult known as christianity "the official religion of Rome". He did this to gain popularity and also to better rule the people.

 

It was at that moment that Christianity went from cult to religion. So is the case with all religions.

[Rudolf von Hagenwil]

I'm not sure if cult means the same in English as it means in other languages....

 

... but does cult mean worship, ceremonies, and having a sacred ideology and a set of rites centering around their sacred symbols, pretty much as the meaning of the word cult is in most other languages?

 

And if Buddhism is not cult, what are this buddhists doing at home, or in those temples, or are those all monasteries where pure dharmic philosophy is teached?

 

.

[Antman261]

Common usage of the word cult means a religiously oriented group that exploits or takes advantage of it's followers.

[UstadKhanAli]

I'm not sure if cult means the same in English as it means in other languages.... ... but does cult mean worship, ceremonies, and having a sacred ideology and a set of rites centering around their sacred symbols, pretty much as the meaning of the word cult is in most other languages? And if Buddhism is not cult, what are this buddhists doing at home, or in those temples, or are those all monasteries where pure dharmic philosophy is teached? .

 

Cult can mean that that in English. But it can also have a negative connotation, as we've had a number of cults here (Jim Jones?) that have been fanatical and exploitative.

 

At any rate, since Buddhism has been around longer than Christianity and does not actively 'recruit' members, convert, or proselytize, I feel it's safe to rule out Buddhism as a cult.

[blue2blue]

I have to say that there are major groups who call themselves Buddhist and cite a lineage back as far as the 13th century that not only engage in active proselytization as part of their dogma but who at times seem to promote attitudes that seem at odds (to this observer, anyhow) with the teachings of the Buddha. I refer to some of the Nichiren-derived schools, of course, some of which were tightly associated with Japanese ultra-nationalism leading up to WWII and some of which have since then engaged in mass proselytization and practices which bear striking resemblance to "prosperity Christianity" in the west. (Nichiren Shoshu comes prominently to mind, of course.)

[slight-return]

hey Dean;

 

ex-boulderite hear

 

the Shambala center ain't too bad, there is a meditation center in smack dab in the middle of Boulder (the mountain facility is sort of a retreat, sounds like they need the work up there, but it ain't exactly like the Shining...maybe that's a bad example as that was filmed in Estes close to that) -- I'm not sure if they are officially coonnected in terms of legal entity, but there's a decent amt of cross-talk

 

As far as the organization (I've done some sitting with them etc) they're pretty cool...I mean they have some protocol/manners type stuff in keeping with their practice, then again so does the public library

 

I suppose some of the folks (more like the students) who get enamored with Buddhism as an "alternative" (to the terrible "west" or modern life or what-have-you) get a little crunchy (it is Boulder after all - where fleece and SPD cleats are formalwear ) -- but something they'll outgrow, as that view isn't acceptance, but still rejection (of other stuff they were disappointed in) and attachment (as in "ah ha! this is THE ANSWER")

 

and that part isn't "drink the cool-aide" - it's just like the zeal of the intermediate, say the intermediate guitar player and their "devotion" to shred or to "the real blues", etc...and you kind of can see it as charming, annoying, part of the process of growing into one's own skin

 

 

I guess the con is (if you'd consder it a con) you will be working in a "retreat environment"...it's not like you can't get to other places, but like being on a resort or something -- it's not like it's off the clock at 17:00 and by 17:15 you have some suds in your hand.

You'll be eating veggie, if that's a concern for ya

don't know how they are abt sex up there

 

so, while I wouldn't worry too much abt the cult thing - you will be working at a religious institution and a remote area that could cramp your style a bit - depending on what that style is

 

you could check the Boulder center, but Boulder has a lot of IT folks, so competition could be hotter

(then again, there culd be some jobs there for ya too)

 

The general area is a trip! - really a great place to live

 

 

 

If you want to know about the area or anything, gives me a shout

[deanmass]

So, he two centers are the same company so to speak?

 

I have always heard great things about Boulder, but never been. Been to Keystone/Denver, never north.

[slight-return]

I'm not entirely sure if they are the same legal entity (for employment and and that), but there's community cross-talk there (probably most important for the "cult" part), but we should prabably be able to find out quickly

 

 

 

While it's worth checking out, I would expect the Boulder Center to be more competitive in terms of IT jobbing...just a heads up there

 

 

There's an old tale (probably many cities use this ) of "niwot's Curse" - where the curse is oonce you live there...well you are trapped

 

while I enjoy other areas too, I have absolutely no reservations recommending it as a place to be

[UstadKhanAli]

 

I have to say that there are major groups who call themselves Buddhist and cite a lineage back as far as the 13th century that not only engage in active proselytization as part of their dogma but who at times seem to promote attitudes that seem at odds (to this observer, anyhow) with the teachings of the Buddha. I refer to some of the Nichiren-derived schools, of course, some of which were tightly associated with Japanese ultra-nationalism leading up to WWII and some of which have since then engaged in mass proselytization and practices which bear striking resemblance to "prosperity Christianity" in the west. (Nichiren Shoshu comes prominently to mind, of course.)

 

 

If that's NST - the people who chant "Nam Myoho Rengeh Kyo" before a gohonzon and wish for material possessions - then yes, you're absolutely right. And I was considering mentioning them but didn't because I don't consider them to be real Buddhism at all, and neither does anyone else I know. I am extremely familiar with them, and yes, they actively try and get people to join them. They give such a bad name to Buddhism I can't even tell you, because unfortunately, for a lot of Americans, this is their introduction to Buddhism.

 

The Buddhism that I refer to is Indian-based, as of course, that's where it came from, not from the rantings of a controversial and despised 13th Century monk from Japan who branded other forms of Buddhism heretical.

 

I strongly dislike NST, and again, must emphasize that no one I know who is Buddhist considers them to be Buddhist.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nichiren

One common source of such controversy is the perception that Nichiren Buddhists insist that only the school they follow is the correct form of Buddhism, a conviction that started with Nichiren himself. - from Wikipedia.

 

That's hardly a Buddhist philosophy.

 

No, this is not Buddhism at all, but a radical departure.

[nice keetee]

Whatever happened to the Hare Krishna? Who used to sell books of dogma at Grand Central in NYC? Is any of that related? Sorry for so many questions.

[murvyn]

The Society for Krishna Consciousness is still around, though you don't see them running around in orange robes so much any more. Nowadays, they usually just look like random hippies.

 

I'd say the majority of Evangelical Charismatic Christian "churches" have more cult-like aspects than any other major religious groups today. The majority of these so-called churches and "worship centers" are just big old-fashioned snake oil money scams. They prey on the weak and ignorant, and their political chicanery is getting way out of hand. People, especially those who consider themselves Christians, really need to start speaking out about these dangerous groups. Watch the documentary "Jesus Camp" and you'll see just how dangerous these people are... their corruption of the youth is outrageous and criminal.

[alfonso]

Any philosophy can be a cult if polluted by mental shortcomings as "truth" or "better". It can be a source of knowledge, instead, if considered as a revelation of humanity, like all the other ones. I'd dig, I'd study, I'd read but I wouldn't belong. A philosophy is a product of mind, considering it as a "truth" is incredibly arrogant and harmful as the history of inquisition reveals. I think that the only decent "truth" you can find in one religion is what you find in any other one.

 

What makes religions different one from the other is the junk part, the mythology, the fairy tales for the superficial and the scared. You won't find anything really useful in that part. But every religion contains seeds of wisdom if watched with loving eyes.

 

That's only the way I see it, it's not even a suggestion.

 

[John Sayers]

Whatever happened to the Hare Krishna? Who used to sell books of dogma at Grand Central in NYC? Is any of that related? Sorry for so many questions.

 

there is a Hare Krishna farm near where I live. It's basically made up of single men and women who have nowhere to go and are getting over, or continuing their drug problem, there are constant fights and they mostly exist on unemployment benefits.

 

I doubt Buddha intended his thoughts to become a religion as he said this:

 

Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense."

 

Buddha (563BC-483BC)

[AmmonHennacy]

Christ wasn't interested in organized religion either-- remember the Pharisees and Sadducees? Performing miracles on the Sabbath? Clearing the Temple?

 

As you search, you may want to consider the peace churches- Quakers, Amish, Mennonites. They seem to stick closest to Christ's ideas without all the adminstrators.

 

I'm not recruiting, simply observing. I'm a die-hard Catholic who has learned to ignore some of the sillier parts of the religion while embracing the spirit of the rank and file Catholics who are busy feeding the poor, clothing the needy, etc.

[Rudolf von Hagenwil]

-- remember the Pharisees and Sadducees? Performing miracles on the Sabbath? Clearing the Temple?

 

I remember as if it was yesterday!

 

 

.

[the stranger]

Any philosophy can be a cult if polluted by mental shortcomings as "truth" or "better". It can be a source of knowledge, instead, if considered as a revelation of humanity, like all the other ones. I'd dig, I'd study, I'd read but I wouldn't belong. A philosophy is a product of mind, considering it as a "truth" is incredibly arrogant and harmful as the history of inquisition reveals. I think that the only decent "truth" you can find in one religion is what you find in any other one. What makes religions different one from the other is the junk part, the mythology, the fairy tales for the superficial and the scared. You won't find anything really useful in that part. But every religion contains seeds of wisdom if watched with loving eyes. That's only the way I see it, it's not even a suggestion.

 

That's beautiful, man.

[Magpel]

As far as I'm concerned, it ain't a cult until protein-deprivation mind control techniques are deployed. And Buddhists, while largely vegetarian, eat plenty of beans.

 

But I do believe that a funny thing happens when eastern religions move west. The west seems to read eastern spiritual practice as yet another route to a super-self, kind of like a healthy, sustainable substitute for the hallucinigeons that got the west hyped on buddhism to begin with. Bourgoise Buddhism seems to me about guilt management and distancing oneself from

crass american materialism, which makes it a kind of material pursuit itself if you accept enlightenment as commodity... whereas it seems traditional Buddhism is more about self-denial, asceticism and, especially, alms and compassion.

 

But no, not a cult, I would say.

[FireWithin]

If buddism is not a cult then what were/are all those warrior monks about?

[RockViolin]

If buddism is not a cult then what were/are all those warrior monks about?

 

 

Self defense?

[Super 8]

 

On the religion side this video has "Enlightend" me. http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/

 

 

The reviews are in.

Here's what one critic had to say....

 

 

Well although this movie has some SCAWY music and some very flashy sounds it is laden with falsities. Uncountable falsities about religion and the origins of man. At NO TIME IN MANS HISTORY was the SOUTHERN CROSS viewable by people above 30 degrees latitude south. Therefore Egyptians and others above the equator or parallel to it would have no knowledge of the southern cross. Horus was a GOD not man and was not crucified at all. In real history Ra is the sun god and later becomes confused with Horus mostly attestable to the greeks. Horus is the god of TWO eyes the MOON and SUN. Hours comes from the Greek HORAE who were goddess of order and later came to mean the progression of time. Horus is not depicted on the Eqyptian hieroglyph in this movie it is the king Akhenaten so that goes out the window. There is a mention of Krishna Attis Dionysus Mithra and others having the same birth dates as Jesus and similar life stories......FALSE. Attis not crucified and was a god not a man, Krishna in the GITA shows his GOD image to Arjuna and this is attestable to the arch angel Michael who is a perfect extension of god. Michael is seen as having many faces and represented as a warrior amongst the arch angels. Exactly what is revealed to arjuna before his epic battle in that portion of the Mahabarata. Krishna was not crucified and was born on the date july 19th he was wounded by an arrow and died. Mohammed is actually listed on a piece of paper that slips by with the name Xaca as also crucified to compound the "reality and gravity" of what is in truth garbage. Mohammed was not born on DEC 25 as were any of the others listed. Mohammed was born on JUNE 8th and died after falling ill as did Xaca which is another was of saying Buddha. The Buddhas mother was MAYA which literally translates to ILLUSION... be wary of false gods and false prophets. The "reclining" Buddha so often heard of comes from his postion at the time of his death after becoming ill. At the time of his death the buddha said dont say that we have no master now....all created things must end. God is Creational not of Creation. Mithra was not Crucified and was not BORN on Dec 25th more rubbish he was a god and is of origin which is obscured by subsequent invasion and redifining of his role as a deity. The SUN as center of the astrological calendar.....am I mistaken or do we view the zodiac from the EARTH.....the sun is not the center of the viewable zodiac the earth is and is depicted as such in many drawings. The mitre started off as a simple low rounded cap and become what it is in modern times and is not some SIGN of the age of pices...that is laughable. SARGON although having similar stories of origin to MOSES is chronicled in the writings of the 7th century Assyrians and therefore much after the time of Moses. Our knowledge of history is limited and so it would seem correct if not put in perspective. Minos is a king and a mythical tyrant nor is ther any correlation to Moses. Now comes an interesting note NEMO is some how related to MOSES in this dung heap of a film NEMO in latin means.... NO MAN or NO ONE.... WHOM is at work here in this film I ask you. Evil lies in men and men do evil in the name of good. The inquistion was evil and done by the church and by individual men who have FREE will granted by god because he is loving and gives us many gifts. The past evils of individuals under the name of the church are just that past evils done by MEN who chose to do evil not by Jesus or GOD. Jesus was a rebel and not a slave.....he bucked the system and did not follow it. We are meant to be stewards of the earth and not abuse it, we are meant to live with love... for those that know god know love and those that know love will know god. Not kill one another out of greed. The Mark of the Beast described in Revelations chapter 13 is one of the most interesting portions of Bible Prophecy. First here's the actual verses: And [the Antichrist] causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads: And that no man might buy or sell, save [except] he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name. Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six. Rev 13:16-18 There is truth and lie in this video......beware.....to the detriment of us all if we forget that we are spiritual beings on this physical journey. That we are meant to follow a covenant with god to prevent what is described in Revelations as the NEW WORLD ORDER! George Bush I would never defend. Lies secrecy and scandal abound today. As we travel further from God the world spins ever out of control. Religion is not to enslave but to set you free.....question your government.....why are we killing innocents for profit? Question why the NEW WORLD ORDER is running your life.....Jesus would have. Don't use falsities and half truths to mar Christianity. If we followed what god hopes for us in the message of Christ Jesus would we be in the trouble we are today......the answer is obvious.....no. The Devil hopes we turn from god but worship the god of finance. Moses warning has returned......we worship the calf again and it stands in the shape of a cast bull on wall street. READ THAT AGAIN. The golden cow has replaced our GOD.

http://elearningrandomwalk.blogspot.com/2007/07/zeitgeist-movie.html

[UstadKhanAli]

 

If buddism is not a cult then what were/are all those warrior monks about?

 

 

So a prerequisite for a cult is to have warriors?

[philbo]

 

The reviews are in. Here's what one critic had to say.... http://elearningrandomwalk.blogspot.com/2007/07/zeitgeist-movie.html

 

 

It sounds like this guy is very sure of his facts.

 

I'd like to talk to him someday - - I've never met anyone who actually was there with Horus, Jesus, Krishna, Attis, Mohammad, et al., and so can categorically state what is true about them. It would be quite a privilege to run into someone that old.

[Rabid]

 

Christ wasn't interested in organized religion either-- remember the Pharisees and Sadducees? Performing miracles on the Sabbath? Clearing the Temple? As you search, you may want to consider the peace churches- Quakers, Amish, Mennonites. They seem to stick closest to Christ's ideas without all the adminstrators. I'm not recruiting, simply observing. I'm a die-hard Catholic who has learned to ignore some of the sillier parts of the religion while embracing the spirit of the rank and file Catholics who are busy feeding the poor, clothing the needy, etc.

 

 

It is a shame that more people don't take this view and see this part. What people tend to forget is that any large group is going to develop factions, and corrupt members, and start taking blame for the world

[seahorse]

 

and found myself getting a little uncomfortable in the description, which, since I am trying to use the teachings to Buddhism to calm me, embrace or let pass fear/doubt, etc, gives me a bit of a conundrum. What are YOUR thoughts? !

 

 

Here's the deal. You looked into it and it made you feel uncomfortable. That's your little inner voice telling you to stay away. This isn't meant to knock Buddhism, but an endless discussion about Buddhism is ignoring the heart of the matter...you looked into this place and got a weird vibe from it.