Members Skyforger Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 because it's not the same type of product. a $15 CD isn't the same investment to a consumer as a $200+ media playing device. you can't go into a bar and pop a quarter into a jukebox and get a physical device. you can't turn on the radio and get a free physical device. you can't pay $40 and show up at some venue and take home a physical device. it's not the same market at all. and you're projecting some ideal that apple's R&D is solely based on catching on to the HOT NEW THING (which described precisely what the music industry is) when it's clearly anything but. how big were mp3 players before ipod? who was buying them? basically no one. there was essentially absolutely no market for mp3 players when ipod was announced; which is certainly among the reasons basically every tech pundit said it would be a complete and utter failure. and damn, were they wrong. iphone was NOTHING like any other "smart phone" - if they even really existed when it came out, but that comes down to semantics - when iphone came out. depends on your expertise. 3ds max dudes, yeah - they use windows. they have no choice. though a lot of the 3D artists i know moved on to maya once i came around for mac os. one of my best friends is a CAD guy and hates that he's stuck on a PC. living in hollywood, i know a {censored}load of video editors and motion graphics guys - they're all on macs. i can't speak for some of those, but i know that pixar uses proprietary hardware and software created specifically for them. same goes for ILM. this doesn't even really make sense. this machine i make my living on as a programmer i only have because i identify it as a novelty item? all the people i know at FOX and ABC are cutting/editing the TV shows people watch in FCP because it's a cool looking way for them to work? my incredibly talented motion graphics friend that worked on the SFX for everything from independence day to 2012 uses his mac because he looks hip at the office? to suggest any market penetration is due to diminishing the performance/functionality to "novelty" is just ... {censored}, i don't even know. again - tell me - who was even really selling mp3 players at all, let alone remotely like ipod in 2001? where were the smartphones even remotely like iphone before it was released? blackberry pearl? treo? who else was building a model to totally change media distribution? who else made a tablet that people actually wanted - and looked/functioned in any way like ipad? they were all just trying to shove windows into a tiny form factor; all of which were horribly unusable. keep with the dismissiveness. apple is the most valuable US company just behind exxon. whatever they've done; they've done it right. If I may add a harmless joke here... I notice Apple had a product placement in Independence Day? Now what are the odds that an Apple computer would be compatible with alien hardware? I'm sorry to ruffle feathers, but that one always makes me smile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members aenemated Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 heh that movie was on not too long ago and i totally watched it for the first time in a while. i myself still get a good chuckle out of appletalk being able to communicate with an alien ship, considering appletalk could barely communicate with anything, alien or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Skyforger Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 heh that movie was on not too long ago and i totally watched it for the first time in a while. i myself still get a good chuckle out of appletalk being able to communicate with an alien ship, considering appletalk could barely communicate with anything, alien or not. It would make perfect sense! Appletalk is compatible with nothing on earth, so there's always the chance that Apple software developers stumbled on an alien programming code Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kit_strong Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 As for the iPad, what exactly can it do that a small laptop cant besides instill a false sense of individualism? Let's see.. Boot up in just a couple of seconds. Run for 10+ hours Sit on my music stand along side sheet music. Be used while lying on my back in bed. Should I go on... The Bottom line is that the iPad is in no way meant to be a laptop replacement. And like I said before it's not a device that's for everyone but bashing something just because you don't like/appreciate it is pretty lame. Personally I have no use for an 8 String guitar and don't really understand them at all. Therefore I must conclude that 8 String guitars are just over-hyped pieces of crap that people play as fashion statements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Skyforger Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 Personally I have no use for an 8 String guitar and don't really understand them at all. Therefore I must conclude that 8 String guitars are just over-hyped pieces of crap that people play as fashion statements. Well, Dino Cazares of Fear Factory has an 8-string Ibanez, and he only uses three strings. So you might actually be right there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kit_strong Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 . All spider-webs and magic. And really? Make a giant iPod touch FOR MOBILE USE? That's smart. I agree, that is indeed very smart. When I got my iPodTouch, every time I downloaded an App I would play with it for a few minutes and think to myself "hey, this is kinda cool. If only the screen were larger". And then along comes an iPad which delivered exactly what I was asking for. I get more use out of mine than I have out of any portable device in the past. As soon as I saw that TabTookit was available in iPad format it was a done deal and I hopped in the car and went to the Apple store to buy one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Skyforger Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 I agree, that is indeed very smart. When I got my iPodTouch, every time I downloaded an App I would play with it for a few minutes and think to myself "hey, this is kinda cool. If only the screen were larger". And then along comes an iPad which delivered exactly what I was asking for. I get more use out of mine than I have out of any portable device in the past. As soon as I saw that TabTookit was available in iPad format it was a done deal and I hopped in the car and went to the Apple store to buy one. Ah, I was more referring to the fragility of it. I would never dream of taking one outside with me in case I dropped it. The drum apps on iPods and iPads are pretty cool, but I don't think I could find anything I'd really need an iPad for. But the notion of breaking something so expensive so easily frightens me immensely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members aenemated Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 if i had to, i'd find a hard time explaining why i NEED most things i have. explaining why i enjoy them would be much easier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frets99 Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 if i had to, i'd find a hard time explaining why i NEED most things i have. explaining why i enjoy them would be much easier. That's wisdom right there!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Skyforger Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 That's wisdom right there!! He's got a point for sure, but take pity on a penniless bum eh? I can't afford things like this As you've probably read, I've had the same phone for three years In this day and age, if I were still at school I'd be an "underprivileged" child! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Spike Li Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 because it's not the same type of product. a $15 CD isn't the same investment to a consumer as a $200+ media playing device. you can't go into a bar and pop a quarter into a jukebox and get a physical device. you can't turn on the radio and get a free physical device. you can't pay $40 and show up at some venue and take home a physical device. it's not the same market at all. and you're projecting some ideal that apple's R&D is solely based on catching on to the HOT NEW THING (which described precisely what the music industry is) when it's clearly anything but. how big were mp3 players before ipod? who was buying them? basically no one. there was essentially absolutely no market for mp3 players when ipod was announced; which is certainly among the reasons basically every tech pundit said it would be a complete and utter failure. and damn, were they wrong. iphone was NOTHING like any other "smart phone" - if they even really existed when it came out, but that comes down to semantics - when iphone came out. depends on your expertise. 3ds max dudes, yeah - they use windows. they have no choice. though a lot of the 3D artists i know moved on to maya once i came around for mac os. one of my best friends is a CAD guy and hates that he's stuck on a PC. living in hollywood, i know a {censored}load of video editors and motion graphics guys - they're all on macs. i can't speak for some of those, but i know that pixar uses proprietary hardware and software created specifically for them. same goes for ILM. this doesn't even really make sense. this machine i make my living on as a programmer i only have because i identify it as a novelty item? all the people i know at FOX and ABC are cutting/editing the TV shows people watch in FCP because it's a cool looking way for them to work? my incredibly talented motion graphics friend that worked on the SFX for everything from independence day to 2012 uses his mac because he looks hip at the office? to suggest any market penetration is due to diminishing the performance/functionality to "novelty" is just ... {censored}, i don't even know. again - tell me - who was even really selling mp3 players at all, let alone remotely like ipod in 2001? where were the smartphones even remotely like iphone before it was released? blackberry pearl? treo? who else was building a model to totally change media distribution? who else made a tablet that people actually wanted - and looked/functioned in any way like ipad? they were all just trying to shove windows into a tiny form factor; all of which were horribly unusable. keep with the dismissiveness. apple is the most valuable US company just behind exxon. whatever they've done; they've done it right. You raise a lot of good points and im gonna backpedal a bit here and admit that I am overly dismissive of Apple products. I still however am of the opinion that they dont do anything significantly different or better than their competitors so im afraid we'll just have to agree to disagree on that. IMO, Apple made technology "cool" again with the ipod and subsequent products, eg imac, etc. I remember back when nobody know about Apple and the last thing they brought out was the old black and white Macintosh. Hell, i even had one of these as a kid: Then seemingly out of nowhere they burst back onto the market with mp3 players with huge hdds (why do you need 80gb for mp3s? Do you go jogging for 2 weeks straight? ) and computers that looked like this: ...that were more expensive than their similar counterparts and had the added bonus of being compatible with {censored} all... I didnt get it. And i still dont. I just dont buy the hype. They seem very much like a "style over substance" company which doesnt appeal to me, but it obviously works for them so i guess who am i to argue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Willyguitar Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 He's got a point for sure, but take pity on a penniless bum eh? I can't afford things like this As you've probably read, I've had the same phone for three years In this day and age, if I were still at school I'd be an "underprivileged" child! I refuse to use a phone that costs more than Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Doctor49 Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 I refuse to use a phone that costs more than Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members aliensporebomb Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 I'm an IT supporter and developer and I work all day with Windows and Linux for my bread and butter, when I use a Mac, I don't feel as though I'm at work, simple as that. Great assessment! I also am an IT Systems Administrator and feel the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members aliensporebomb Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 My 2 year old XPS M1330 still has better specs than the Air. I am not going to get into this old foray but it seems Mac lovers care not about specs, only looks else they wouldn't buy these products. And for the OP who works in IT, as do I (18 years now) he should know better. I am sure he's well aware of the fact that Apple is still selling overpriced machines with three year old Core Duo procs in them. Show me a model you can order with a blu-ray player, 4GB RAM, i7, discreet graphics for under a grand and I'll jump. Oh, you can buy plenty of these in that price but not from Apple. Oh, and there's no amount of fairy dust you can sprinkle on them to justify why they charge so much for upgrades on top of the base price. {censored}ing absurd. You're forgetting the Windows tax. You can buy a Windows laptop for $450 but you can't buy it for that cheap with Office ($210 for Home and Student) which 98% of the businesses in the world buy because if you're going to interface with other businesses you need it.So add that. Not to mention the operating system needs to be upgraded to the professional or ultimate edition (around $183 or so) in order to connect it to an active directory domain network. It's just a fact. Home premium is not a suitable operating system for business use. So your savings are kind of thrown under the bus there. (prices were quickly looked up over at Amazon.com). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members aliensporebomb Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 Oh and as far as specs on the Mac side go - my Corei7 iMac beats a lot of machines that I work with on a daily basis including some servers Output from the program "Geekbench" from Primate Labs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members aliensporebomb Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 And as far as the iPad goes: I've never seen any product that has gotten so much entrenchment in such a short time. At work it was "UNSUPPORTED!" at least initially - but then management and users started buying them (because they could and they were inexpensive to try) they make a terrific presentation device for audio/visual images. All of a sudden, a lot of computers start looking dowdy and slow - and the average end user (not you or me). It's not suitable for everyone but for your average Joe who just needs to read e-mail and have access to the web it works surprisingly well. It's a niche product but this "niche" seems to be growing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members atrox Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 I'm in the graphic design and motion graphics industry. For the latter, a PC is just as good if not better than a Mac to use in a working situation. For the former, Mac is really the only way to go if you want true color consistency. Nothing will meet the color output synching (ColorSync) of Mac. That said, we just use Macs at work for 3D, motion & print. We use MS Office on our computers and share those files with PC's with no issues. Our Macs all have WMV capabilities and the PC's all have QuickTime, so sharing media files is a non-issue. Essentially, there is no Office platform conflict these days. Now I am biased somewhat. I have been using Macs since 1985 (still have the first Mac in my basement and it still works). However, trendy fads do not last 25 years in the real world. Trendy mp3 players do not last nearly 9 years in the market while completely saturating the market the entire time. We'll see (and are seeing) the same trend with the iPad and iPhone. They are good products that are pricy indeed, but they work well. That is the difference between Apple and say... Atari. Atari's products were {censored} and they went away even though at one point, they saturated the entire gaming market. In the early and mid 90's, Apple products were {censored} and they almost folded too, until they got their act together. That's pretty much it. That said, I have Windows 7 on my Mac at home and I think it's great.... about time i don't run it much, but I am having fun playing in it. I still think the UI is whack though. As far as the Air's go, I'd wait a bit for the second generation. Apple tends to really upgrade things quite a bit on a yearly basis and sometime even drop prices as the technology behind it all gets cheaper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members atrox Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 Oh and as far as specs on the Mac side go - my Corei7 iMac beats a lot of machines that I work with on a daily basis including some servers Output from the program "Geekbench" from Primate Labs. I have the same machine. Love it! At work I run two 20" wide-screens. I can't wait to get home to my 27" screen. It's way faster than my work computer too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Skyforger Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 I refuse to use a phone that costs more than Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Skyforger Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 You raise a lot of good points and im gonna backpedal a bit here and admit that I am overly dismissive of Apple products. I still however am of the opinion that they dont do anything significantly different or better than their competitors so im afraid we'll just have to agree to disagree on that. IMO, Apple made technology "cool" again with the ipod and subsequent products, eg imac, etc. I remember back when nobody know about Apple and the last thing they brought out was the old black and white Macintosh. Hell, i even had one of these as a kid: Then seemingly out of nowhere they burst back onto the market with mp3 players with huge hdds (why do you need 80gb for mp3s? Do you go jogging for 2 weeks straight? ) and computers that looked like this: ...that were more expensive than their similar counterparts and had the added bonus of being compatible with {censored} all... I didnt get it. And i still dont. I just dont buy the hype. They seem very much like a "style over substance" company which doesnt appeal to me, but it obviously works for them so i guess who am i to argue? Did you include the Apple 3? I think that was the one that had such an overheating problem, the RAM chips would pop out of the motherboard! The suggested course of action was to drop it from about three inches to re-seat them. No joke! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members atrox Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 Couldn't agree more. Sod any phone that's over Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Busk Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 actually, they're likely driven to sell products and make a profit. you know, like basically any business on the planet. Yeah, and Apple is quite mainstream. I think they are the second biggest company in the world now in terms of market cap. Maybe, they'll buy Microsoft one of these days.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members atrox Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 Yeah, and Apple is quite mainstream. I think they are the second biggest company in the world now in terms of market cap. Maybe, they'll buy Microsoft one of these days.... I think there could be antitrust issues with that Besides, Windows is finally good on it's own and Apple doesn't want to be involved directly with gaming consoles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Skyforger Posted January 19, 2011 Members Share Posted January 19, 2011 Well, yeah. That is what YOU use your phone for. Others like to have the bells and whistles... I don't know of a computer these days that doesn't have Bluetooth capabilities built in. To each his own, eh? This computer is about three years old now, but I don't know how long bluetooth has been the norm for wireless data communication. For me, owning a phone with all these bells and whistles is as pointless as owning guitars with pickups anywhere but the bridge. I just don't use them. Though that's soon to change when the 50s classic vibes get dropped into my Bullet. But I digress. If you like your bells and whistles, and you've got the cash to buy them, by all means, buy that sucker and enjoy the {censored} out of it. I'm a little strapped for cash since finishing college, so I gotta make do with what I can afford. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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