Members Spike Li Posted November 15, 2011 Members Share Posted November 15, 2011 But, but... its not exactly the same as guitars built 50 years ago!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members GAS Man Posted November 15, 2011 Author Members Share Posted November 15, 2011 ^^ Yeah, let's think about that for a second. When they first starting making guitar/lutes, whatever, from wood, most bowls and spoons were also made from wood. So were most all transportation devices. Hair combs were made from bone, clothing was often made with animal skins, hair or bone stays. You would actually think by now that modern metals, plastics and fibers would have replaced wood. But that would not be Tradition! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BryanMichael Posted November 15, 2011 Members Share Posted November 15, 2011 My biggest observation over the years has been (and I freely admit this is true of ME) that a very large portion of GAS and guitar ownership is pure fetishism. We are a vain, insecure and image conscious bunch and the electric guitar is an ICON in and of itself, regardless of the specific icons it embodies (LP, strat, SG, steinberger, etc...) They are associated with an image, a sound, and an elusive identity factor that on some level...we ALL crave.I have a cousin who has always been into finding old, cheap, and odd instruments and paying very little for them, getting them painted professionally and finding odds and end parts. It's cool, and he feels some kind of "pride" in playing a $200 guitar, as for him, owning 40+ $200 guitars (what is that...$8000.00??) (not to count the paint jobs, pickups, neck resets, and other tweaks to make them playable) seems to be no big deal, but someone dropping $800 on an axe seems extravagant to him. The great thing about the latest round of "cheap" guitars (SX, ROndo, Xaviere) is that they REALLY allow us to indulge our fantasies and fetishes (mostly image based if we were to be honest) without breaking the bank AND many times you are getting a GREAT looking, playable, and nice sounding guitar that is fun to own and play. I think we should just admit that no matter WHAT we buy or play, there is a bit of fetishism at work in those choices...and that's OKAY! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Spike Li Posted November 15, 2011 Members Share Posted November 15, 2011 My biggest observation over the years has been (and I freely admit this is true of ME) that a very large portion of GAS and guitar ownership is pure fetishism. We are a vain, insecure and image conscious bunch and the electric guitar is an ICON in and of itself, regardless of the specific icons it embodies (LP, strat, SG, steinberger, etc...) They are associated with an image, a sound, and an elusive identity factor that on some level...we ALL crave. I have a cousin who has always been into finding old, cheap, and odd instruments and paying very little for them, getting them painted professionally and finding odds and end parts. It's cool, and he feels some kind of "pride" in playing a $200 guitar, as for him, owning 40+ $200 guitars (what is that...$8000.00??) (not to count the paint jobs, pickups, neck resets, and other tweaks to make them playable) seems to be no big deal, but someone dropping $800 on an axe seems extravagant to him. The great thing about the latest round of "cheap" guitars (SX, ROndo, Xaviere) is that they REALLY allow us to indulge our fantasies and fetishes (mostly image based if we were to be honest) without breaking the bank AND many times you are getting a GREAT looking, playable, and nice sounding guitar that is fun to own and play. I think we should just admit that no matter WHAT we buy or play, there is a bit of fetishism at work in those choices...and that's OKAY! Well duh! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mymindsok Posted November 15, 2011 Members Share Posted November 15, 2011 Hasn't always been that way around here. I remember the days of building guitars from parts for people in need... Those were fun days here on the board... Steve-O, you got that right! This place used to be rockin with guitar giveaways, people helping each other out with parts and advice, great HNGD boobie threads, free trade threads... Then we built a guitar for that chick over in Europe (Yugoslavia?) and absolutely everyone had something positive to contribute! Now, about all we seem to get is a few guys asking dumb questions and people arguing about cheap guitars being as good as Custom shop stuff or whether Gibby should charge money for their guitars or not. I dunno... All I can say is that the place has really slipped and I miss the friendliness and comradely spirit and of the old board but things change, time moves on and Leaoaprdstar and some of our other friends will never be back. Not here anyway. Just one of those things I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bsman Posted November 15, 2011 Members Share Posted November 15, 2011 My, but we've strayed far from the original premise of the thread. Anyway, this place has always had its ups and downs -- it'll be back. Anyway -- here's an interesting thing I've noticed: It seems like the folks who are most ardent in their admiration, love and support for the various reliced models are also the folks who are most likely to blow a gasket if they receive a new guitar that has any defect that can be detected only in a 10x magnifier... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members GAS Man Posted November 15, 2011 Author Members Share Posted November 15, 2011 I dunno... All I can say is that the place has really slipped and I miss the friendliness and comradely spirit and of the old board but things change, time moves on and Leaoaprdstar and some of our other friends will never be back. Not here anyway.Just one of those things I guess. True. And indeed leopardstar was a gem of a guy. But I also miss Batotman who could pinch off a turd in the middle of a thread, but yet it always seemed to remain light to me because, that was just him. Even if he was telling you that your NGD was a road apple, you could easily take it with that grain of salt because you knew he never held back with his bombastic opinions. Plus nobody matched his GAS'n and flip'n. It was funny as hell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members steve_man Posted November 15, 2011 Members Share Posted November 15, 2011 Yup, I remember another guy that got messed over on a guitar in the spam thread...ended up losing his Strat in the deal. So, like the forum did with Stratogirl, the forumites pooled our resources and built him a Strat. I seem to remember that whoever built it put a waterslide on the back of the headstock about the HC guys.... Good times there...and not that long ago... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Brainfertilizer Posted November 15, 2011 Members Share Posted November 15, 2011 I guess one that I've been thinking about is how Les Paul owners claim that having metal rods sunk into wood is obviously the best way to transfer vibrational energies from the strings to the wood when you have a TOM bridge, but is 100% the worst way when it comes to neck joints, where only glue can transfer the vibrations properly. The other one isn't really a paradox held by any one person, but just that the 2nd part wasn't objected to by anyone when it was mentioned once:If having the wood held together with a thin layer of glue in a set-neck guitar results in better sustain, then how can it be that the late 70s / early 80s breadboard guitars abandoned as a design because having the wood held together by a thin layer of wood resulted in a deadening of sustain? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BeanoBoy Posted November 16, 2011 Members Share Posted November 16, 2011 Theres also the cheapie snobs who look down on people who buy expensive guitars because they think that they are snobs... Some truth there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members GAS Man Posted November 16, 2011 Author Members Share Posted November 16, 2011 I guess one that I've been thinking about is how Les Paul owners claim that having metal rods sunk into wood is obviously the best way to transfer vibrational energies from the strings to the wood when you have a TOM bridge, but is 100% the worst way when it comes to neck joints, where only glue can transfer the vibrations properly. Yeah, I like this one. Bolted necks bad, bolted bridges good - what's wid dat? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blind radish Posted November 16, 2011 Members Share Posted November 16, 2011 Played this guitar in two different stores .... VERY nice guitar .... VERY NICE! I'm waiting for my second baked maple to arrive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members GAS Man Posted November 16, 2011 Author Members Share Posted November 16, 2011 Played this guitar in two different stores .... VERY nice guitar .... VERY NICE! Glad to hear that. It's due to arrive today! It was an impulse buy largely cuz I thought it looked so cool. I'd often see them in Bbreakers vintage guitar photos and think "I'd never want one of those". I have usually not been that fond of bridge only pickup guitars and when I do consider them, I usually like them to be in a thicker body than an SG, like maybe an LP Junior for more depth of tone. But I think it must be "imprinting" because when I saw this new model arrive at SW, I wanted to have it if I could get a good price. And it did come together. That plus 18 months of 0% financing on Gibsons made it an offer I failed to refuse. But since it's running in the low 40s around here, it will probably be tomorrow before I get it out from acclimation to give it a test run. mmmmm-mm - baked maple and bacon coming up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frets99 Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 Glad to hear that. It's due to arrive today! It was an impulse buy largely cuz I thought it looked so cool. I'd often see them in Bbreakers vintage guitar photos and think "I'd never want one of those". I have usually not been that fond of bridge only pickup guitars and when I do consider them, I usually like them to be in a thicker body than an SG, like maybe an LP Junior for more depth of tone. But I think it must be "imprinting" because when I saw this new model arrive at SW, I wanted to have it if I could get a good price. And it did come together. That plus 18 months of 0% financing on Gibsons made it an offer I failed to refuse. But since it's running in the low 40s around here, it will probably be tomorrow before I get it out from acclimation to give it a test run. mmmmm-mm - baked maple and bacon coming up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members csm Posted November 16, 2011 Members Share Posted November 16, 2011 Played this guitar in two different stores .... VERY nice guitar .... VERY NICE! Looks like a cleaner, shinier version of the 1963 Jr which was my first decent electric guitar ... and which i wish I still had. Wonder if it feels or sounds like it ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members GAS Man Posted November 16, 2011 Author Members Share Posted November 16, 2011 Is MF carrying that!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members GAS Man Posted November 16, 2011 Author Members Share Posted November 16, 2011 Looks like a cleaner, shinier version of the 1963 Jr which was my first decent electric guitar ... and which i wish I still had. Wonder if it feels or sounds like it ... Visually, I was attracted to the "clean" design. Stop by and play it mate. I live in the Pacific NW. With the climate here, you'll feel like you never left jolly ol England. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members csm Posted November 16, 2011 Members Share Posted November 16, 2011 ^^^ Love to ... Been to the PNW (well ... Seattle ...) and the climate is indeed eerily reminiscent of a wet autumn in da Yew Kay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ralph onion Posted November 16, 2011 Members Share Posted November 16, 2011 This is a great place, no matter the views on different gear. What makes it great is the diverse opinions sprinkled with prejudiced bull{censored} every now and then. But hey, I am and always have been open to bitches, complaints, and honest reviews. HG is to me a place to "let her rip!" Rock and Roll and most music we all know or discover is all about rebellion! I paid my dues from the mid fifties to the late 80's, {censored}ed up hearing, lungs probably coated with THC Tar and a liver that is probably 30% effecient. My penis don't complain however! What a good fine life I found and lived thru Rock and Roll, or Music. I wouldnt do a goddamned thing different. As Neil said; "Keep on Rockin.....". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cratz2 Posted November 16, 2011 Members Share Posted November 16, 2011 I think the biggest ones have been covered, esp the cheapie vs expensive trip... As in politics, both far sides make us sane ones in the middle have internal face palms constantly. I think of all the members on the board, there are like three that have believe and state what should be obvious to players with no hangups: A $2,000 guitar is almost always going to be superior in almost every respect to a $200 guitar. The strides that have been made in entry and near-entry level guitars since 1980 has been nothing short of amazing and there's no shortage of gig-able guitars in the $350 range but if any of us won a lottery for twenty million or more, very few of us would buy multiple SXs, Agiles, Xavieres or current Squiers. I like Will's website TheFrugalGuitarist and I've certainly taken some small sense of pride in being able to make an $80 used guitar sound on par with a friend's ~$800 guitars but let's face it: how many of us, if we made $500,000 a year, would tour or attend a music school with a $200 guitar? On the other hand, how many of us would truly be embarrassed to play a gig with a 20 year old Squier that played and sounded good if that's all we had? As far as the recent wood choices of Gibson, and I don't have anything against the members that are staunchly against said changes, but for how many years have some LPs had a mahogany body, mahogany neck and a maple top? How radically different is that from a mahogany body with no maple top and with a maple fretboard? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Will Chen Posted November 16, 2011 Members Share Posted November 16, 2011 On the other hand, how many of us would truly be embarrassed to play a gig with a 20 year old Squier that played and sounded good if that's all we had? Not I! I couldn't give a crap what people think of the gear I gig, I prefer to let my tone, and more importantly my music, do the talking. The stereotypes used to be TGP was elitist and HCEG was the forum for the masses, but I got to tell you, I've found the exact opposite to be true. TGP seems far, far more open to gear discourse without the politics than HCEG. You can have an Epiphone thread over there without having it devolve into a US vs China debate. Same deal at TDPRI, folks just seem to love guitars and music and want to talk rather than the insider clique nature of HC in general. HCEG used to be a terrific place to hang, when they messed up the site moving to a different forum without fully testing it they lost a bunch of solid members. I just don't feel myself connecting with the forum like I used to and as such my participation as been dramatically cut back. I mean, the first post of this thread is a great example...passive aggressive slam against a faction of the forum. In the old days, stuff like this would be considered trolling and shot down quickly...but maybe I'm just looking at the past through rose colored glasses... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cratz2 Posted November 16, 2011 Members Share Posted November 16, 2011 Not I! I couldn't give a crap what people think of the gear I gig, I prefer to let my tone, and more importantly my music, do the talking. For the record, I definitely did not mean to say that I would be embarrassed either. I've proudly rocked an older Squier for years and for a couple years, it was my #1: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members GAS Man Posted November 17, 2011 Author Members Share Posted November 17, 2011 HCEG used to be a terrific place to hang, when they messed up the site moving to a different forum without fully testing it they lost a bunch of solid members. I just don't feel myself connecting with the forum like I used to and as such my participation as been dramatically cut back. I mean, the first post of this thread is a great example...passive aggressive slam against a faction of the forum. In the old days, stuff like this would be considered trolling and shot down quickly...but maybe I'm just looking at the past through rose colored glasses... I was already a little troubled that some folks were not "getting" the intent of this thread, and sure that has to be my fault since I started it. Others here definitely do understand what my intent was and have added some interesting posts. However, maybe the thread title was hard to decipher or the "talking" icon to the thread was not recognized. My OP was just an opening idea and was in no way a criticism, it was just one observation. And no one can refute that because I wrote the damned thing and know my intent. But clearly it wasn't understood that way by all. The idea was to see what "contradictions" people may have observed here in the popular HCEG views. My random example was that a lot of folks here have often criticized minor pentatonic scale blues roots guitar playing as being boring , old wankery, and the same old worn out thing. I don't say that, I play that; but yet I see it stated here often. A contradiction (paradox) within the group is that the most popular "hot" guitars here (which others very often refer to as cheap or inexpensive, e.g. the "Cheap Guitars and Cheap Drinks" thread) are generally "Student Grade" instruments. Even Carlos Santana has referred to his SE model as a good student grade guitar. So the contradiction I mentioned is that one paradigm here is pro (favorable towards) student level grade instruments, while another penchant here that often gets repeated here is slamming a mid level playing style (i.e. above Twinkle Twinkle Little Star, but below Brian Eno) that's the base of popular blues rooted music. I never said everyone here says that or believes that, nor did I impugn peoples choices for bargain instruments. I've bought dozens of guitars myself that fit that description. Also in the 8 years I've been here, I don't troll, I don't pick on the quality of others' gear, I quick to join in with Happy NGD posts, I share my passion for the instruments, and the only time I've ever attacked another forumite is when I get tired of them picking on others' choices. To those that get that, thanks. This was to celebrate or be amused by the differences and contradictions, not to call anyone out. It's the collective differences that make this place an entertaining and informative forum, but not everyone here agrees with all the popular premises. For those that didn't get it, again, sorry. And if you think the years of yore were so great, then you have a short memory for the many who've been banned here for crapping on most every thread they ever opened. But even to be fair to them, some of them provided the spice, even if it might have just been salt. I'll conclude with an image of a true paradox. This one is classic. there seems to be a paradox, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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