Members Jeff da Weasel Posted November 16, 2007 Members Share Posted November 16, 2007 That's the point, Phil. Joel might have great products at great prices. I'd just never advise someone would purchase products from a company run by a person who acts as he's done here. Hence the "bullet in the business head" reference. Too bad. You never know who's reading these threads. Know what I'm sayin'? You can't reverse that either. Sucking information out of someone's brain is difficult at best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ani Posted November 16, 2007 Members Share Posted November 16, 2007 Well, entertaining except for the career suicide of Joel DuBay. I mean, after reading his stuff, I'd never, in a million years, purchase or advise anyone to do any business ever with Ready Acoustics LLC. I've got a sound corner built out of two 4 x 8 pieces of plywood covered with Auralex, but I'm going to be in the market for more specialized sound treatment whenever I finish all of the construction in my studio. I've been taking notes relative to the behavior displayed in this thread. My orders, I'm sure, will not measure up to many successful studio owners, modest if anything, but nonetheless... I am not the only person viewing this thread. One thing that I "will" say though, is that MrKnobs has a very professional approach in conducting business; a person that I wouldn't have to think twice about contracting for professional services. I can't say that for everyone in this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members UstadKhanAli Posted November 16, 2007 Author Members Share Posted November 16, 2007 Commercial suicide or no, no one's forcing him to post here, or say the things he's saying. He clearly wants to present his business in this light here. Despite the reaction, he hasn't modified his post. This is the way he wants to present his business. I say let him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ani Posted November 16, 2007 Members Share Posted November 16, 2007 Joel is not the only one projecting a negative image for a business... That said, a song lyric comes to mind... (although in the song it's pertaining to love, the phrase is universal and applies to many different walks in life) The lyric is... You say it best, when you say nothing at all.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jeff da Weasel Posted November 16, 2007 Members Share Posted November 16, 2007 Commercial suicide or no, no one's forcing him to post here, or say the things he's saying.Right. That's the reason it's suicide... not homicide. Ah well. Not everyone gets this whole communication thing. Some never learn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members UstadKhanAli Posted November 16, 2007 Author Members Share Posted November 16, 2007 "Bad Boy"!! you're kidding oh. so i'm not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members UstadKhanAli Posted November 16, 2007 Author Members Share Posted November 16, 2007 Joel is not the only one projecting a negative image for a business...Well, I don't know. Joel comes out of nowhere three weeks after the last post and issues this odd challenge, wanting to bet $20,000 that his bags sound better than Ethan's MiniTraps, then doesn't post anymore? What did Ethan do?Anyway, whether you consider it negative or not, he's seeking free publicity. And he's got it!! Don't you just love free speech? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members UstadKhanAli Posted November 16, 2007 Author Members Share Posted November 16, 2007 Ah well. Not everyone gets this whole communication thing. Some never learn. I tihnk uyo're rghti, Ffej. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bunny Knutson Posted November 16, 2007 Members Share Posted November 16, 2007 You say it best, when you say nothing at all.... :poke: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members nursers Posted November 16, 2007 Members Share Posted November 16, 2007 I've had some interactions with John Sayers via email and phone and I believe he's nearly as evil as Ethan - in fact I believe he's Australia's Ethan.Therefore I've created:http://www.johnsayersisahippybastardfromnorthernnsw.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members phaeton Posted November 16, 2007 Members Share Posted November 16, 2007 Btw,Isn't this "mineral wool" stuff you guys are speaking of just an old-fashioned name for "asbestos"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ani Posted November 16, 2007 Members Share Posted November 16, 2007 Well, I don't know. Joel comes out of nowhere three weeks after the last post and issues this odd challenge, wanting to bet $20,000 that his bags sound better than Ethan's MiniTraps, then doesn't post anymore? What did Ethan do? Anyway, whether you consider it negative or not, he's seeking free publicity. And he's got it!! Don't you just love free speech? Joel was indeed being obnoxious and unprofessional; there is no argument there. But in regard to your question as to what Ethan did... from a professional standpoint this comment was pretty off color and distasteful. Really Joel, WTF is your problem? Wife leave you? Dog bite your ankle? Your kids make fun of you openly? Can't get it up? What exactly? And why should it concern me? And also his comment and assumption that everyone on the forum would prefer that he go away. Whether there is truth in the comment or not, it does not reflect well on Ethan's professional status to publicly condemn his competition in such a demeaning way.This forum is sponsored by a major retailer, and I'm sure that if Harmony Central were to become one sided and moderators allowed some vendors to bully others around; Musician's Friend would eventually get wind of the situation in one way or another and have to intervene. As it stands now, the thread borders on libel on behalf of the vendors involved. Public bashing between competing vendors, as Phil expressed concern, is not something that needs to be done on these forums.Don't get me wrong, I laughed when I read Ethan's comments, and they WERE entertaining... but professional... NO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members myfipie Posted November 16, 2007 Members Share Posted November 16, 2007 Btw, Isn't this "mineral wool" stuff you guys are speaking of just an old-fashioned name for "asbestos"? wow if that is the case then I am going to have some pretty mad employees some day. No this is not asbestos or anything even close. If you do have a question about this stuff you may want to read the following thread to put your mind at ease.http://www.recording.org/ftopict-21013.htmlGlenn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ethan Winer Posted November 16, 2007 Members Share Posted November 16, 2007 Don't get me wrong, I laughed when I read Ethan's comments, and they WERE entertaining... but professional... NO. I agree to an extent, but try to see this from my perspective. Joel and his partner Scott Foster have been pulling this crap for more than four years, and I have turned the other cheek more times than I care to count. I have at least 70 different threads I've saved over the years where Joel and his partner have started public fights, insulted me personally, gotten half a dozen of their friends to gang up on me, indicted my products as ineffective and overpriced, called me incompetent and a fraud, and much worse. Just yesterday Joel DuBay added the following vile comments to my new YouTube video : Oh my god! This is the GAY-EST, most self indulgent cry for help anywhere on YouTube. And you don't even have to look closely to see his Depends puffing up his curdlled ass. What an embarrassment.You GO Tinker Bell!hahahahahahaahahhahahahahahaha Of course I deleted it, and I blocked his account from adding more comments in the future. But this is exactly the sort of BS I've put up with from Joel and his partner for a very long time. I agree with Phil that attacking your competitors is unprofessional, and I would never do that unprovoked! But what would you do, Ani, if a gang of thugs harassed you like this for 4+ years, and how would you respond? --Ethan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Lee Flier Posted November 17, 2007 Members Share Posted November 17, 2007 I'd have to agree - I've never seen Ethan behave any way other than extremely gracious and professional in the many years I've been dealing with him and/or reading his forum contributions. It takes a LOT to provoke him, and I'd say he's certainly allowed to bite back a time or two considering what he's experienced! In fact, the fact that it's so out of character makes it even funnier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ani Posted November 17, 2007 Members Share Posted November 17, 2007 Ethan,Word of mouth goes a long LONG way whenever a company has established a reputation; that holds true for good or bad. I learned of your products and also your tips on how to DIY through a man that I have the utmost respect for both personally and professionally; John Sayers. John is a qualified acoustician whose knowledge and expertise in the industry has been well established. Whenever John provides a name as a reference; I feel confident, by association with John, that it is a name that I can trust. A bit about John before I move on.... Although I have never met John face to face, John is a very genuine and generous man; this I can say without a doubt. His willingness to share his knowledge and assist others when he KNOWS that there will not be an immediate gain of profits, if ever there will be any opportunity for profit whatsoever, is astonishing and adds a magnitude of weight to his credentials as both an individual being and as a professional service provider. From my personal experiences in talking with John one on one or participating in group discussions where he has been involved; his energies are spent nurturing those seeking to get established in the business. Whether it is an artist looking to build a home studio, a young engineer seeking to expand his knowledge, or someone that may be picking his brain to someday rise up to be his number one rival; John is a true mentor and is confident enough to pay his knowledge forward without fear of getting beat out on a sale, and even more so, not EXPECTING a sale for sharing his expert advice. That, to me, says a LOT!!!I have visited your DIY tip sheets and browsed many other areas of your site lurking and "learning" from all of the information that you provide to any and ALL that seek to learn; THAT also says a lot. It says even more when your site comes highly recommended from a well respected source. In sharing your knowledge with others, openly and freely, you build a client base. You do not have to reach out to customers because they are already coming to your doorsteps feeding off of the information that helps them to grow in knowledge of the business. When they are ready to make a purchase; they are going to go where they feel comfortable and buy from a trusted name. If they have grown to trust the information you provide; your place will probably be the first stop when they come to the marketplace to buy.I have not witnessed the other websites, or threads in other forums where this Joel guy has openly bashed you or any others for that matter; what I see is the activity that has gone on in this thread and this thread alone. That is something to be considered as a professional service or product provider. Had it not been for me already being familiar with your products as a result of having had them recommended by John; the counter attacks on your competition in this thread would have caused me to turn my interests away from all vendors involved in the mud slinging contest. I would not have visited ANY of the sites for any other reason other than to see what the big fuss was all about.I thought it was a pretty bold challenge for Joel to bet $20,000.00 in a product war, but even THAT was not enough to spark enough interest for me to visit his site. I just thought he was being an obnoxious asshole and threw my own .02 in to show him how ignorant his post was in attacking a well known name among forum members when he had all of 6 posts. It was not until John's post about Ready Acoustics' product being a "bag" that I even decided to take a look at his site. I don't know why you would even want to waste ANY energy on this guy... his whole game has a "Jerry Springer Mentality" vibe going to it. Your established reputation places you FAR ABOVE that level; don't let him drag you down. You mentioned that he was making a fool of himself; in submitting to his tactics and publicly retaliating, he has pulled you and your product line into the spotlight along side him. You asked this:But what would you do, Ani, if a gang of thugs harassed you like this for 4+ years, and how would you respond?I can answer this from both a personal perspective and a professional perspective; the two answers would not be the same.I don't have time to go into it tonight, but in short... being in front line supervision for a major corporation with a staff of between 60 and 80 employees to watch over (by myself) on any given day of the week; if I allowed the gang of thugs that harassed me routinely to break my spirit.... I wouldn't last a week in management. It is an absolute "MUST" to keep composure whenever conducting business. If I didn't, I'd be eaten alive with EEO's (mostly frivolous) and grievances. Whether any held merit or not, the time and energy spent if "dealing" with the consequences of retaliating against those that try to make my life miserable would consume my time and energy and take away all the means of remaining an effective manager. In business, a person has to learn when to draw the line....Now, if a person wants to drag their personal qualms with me out into the streets.... let them hit me with their best shot and see where it goes from there. I'd be ready to kick some serious bootie.I don't blame you for having a weak moment, because this kid is a joke, but do the fist fighting out in the streets where no one knows your names. Trust me, I "loved" some of your smart-ass remarks... I got a big giggle out of them... but... I stand by my opinion as to what is and what is not acceptable when it comes to professionalism. Whenever the brand names come into play.... then those having stakes in the products in question have entered into the professional arena, or lack thereof. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ethan Winer Posted November 17, 2007 Members Share Posted November 17, 2007 Good post, Ani. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ethan Winer Posted November 17, 2007 Members Share Posted November 17, 2007 the fact that it's so out of character makes it even funnier. The funniest reply (IMO) I ever made to the shenanigans from these trouble makers was my Post #69 in this thread: http://womb.mixerman.net/showthread.php?t=3090 --Ethan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil O'Keefe Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 Btw, Isn't this "mineral wool" stuff you guys are speaking of just an old-fashioned name for "asbestos"? The eekphil is not applicable here. Mineral wool (sometimes called "rockwool") is not asbestos, and as far as I know, no major health concerns like you have with asbestos exist with it (or fiberglass), although I would recommend taking the appropriate precautions when working with it - wear a long sleeve shirt (the stuff WILL make you itch!), wear a respirator (or at least a dust mask) when cutting and installing, and make sure the material is covered with at least one layer of a acoustically permeable fabric to help retain the fibers so they don't come loose and float around your room. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil O'Keefe Posted November 17, 2007 Share Posted November 17, 2007 I've had some interactions with John Sayers via email and phone and I believe he's nearly as evil as Ethan - in fact I believe he's Australia's Ethan. Therefore I've created: http://www.johnsayersisahippybastardfromnorthernnsw.comOnly good mates can get away with stuff like that. For the record, I've worked with Nursers. He's a hippie Paul Hogan wannabe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members franknputer Posted November 18, 2007 Members Share Posted November 18, 2007 For the record, I've slept with Nursers. He's a lovely Paul Hogan wannabe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil O'Keefe Posted November 18, 2007 Share Posted November 18, 2007 :mad: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Billster Posted November 18, 2007 Members Share Posted November 18, 2007 The eekphil is not applicable here. Mineral wool (sometimes called "rockwool") ... I would recommend taking the appropriate precautions when working with it - wear a long sleeve shirt (the stuff WILL make you itch!), wear a respirator (or at least a dust mask) when cutting and installing... And wear goggles, especially if you also wear contact lenses. and make sure the material is covered with at least one layer of a acoustically permeable fabric to help retain the fibers so they don't come loose and float around your room. And it will look nicer too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil O'Keefe Posted November 18, 2007 Share Posted November 18, 2007 :phil: to Billster for catching and correcting my omission regarding the importance of eye protection - and for proper use of the eekphil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members nursers Posted November 18, 2007 Members Share Posted November 18, 2007 Only good mates can get away with stuff like that. For the record, I've worked with Nursers. He's a hippie Paul Hogan wannabe. :mad: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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