Members UstadKhanAli Posted October 10, 2007 Author Members Share Posted October 10, 2007 Run, do not walk, away from Foam by Mail. See this: www.ethanwiner.com/fraud.html Wow, that's amazing that anyone would have the stones to try and get away with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members myfipie Posted October 10, 2007 Members Share Posted October 10, 2007 I heard about these guys recently - haven't tried them myself, but I have been considering it. http://www.gikacoustics.com/products.html I have!!! But then again I own the company! Glenn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil O'Keefe Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 Terry, we had an anechoic chamber at the labs I used to work at, and it used massive amounts of incredibly thick foam... so yes, I agree with you - foam isn't bad per se, and yes, it's capable of absorbing LF sound, but not in the standard 2" thick sheet versions that most people buy or think of when you say "acoustic foam". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil O'Keefe Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 PS I do own and use some Auralex foam, and I have had good experiences with their products. If I was going to buy a foam product, or recommend one, it would definitely be from them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators MrKnobs Posted October 10, 2007 Moderators Share Posted October 10, 2007 I use carpet backing. Real cheap! And really good for putting under carpet! but that's about it Terry D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil O'Keefe Posted October 10, 2007 Share Posted October 10, 2007 But most of us aren't builders, and it's really only sold by places that either sell it to construction folks or that sell bass traps. 6 sheets of 2" 2x4 703 from Ready is $80, plus it's fairly expensive to ship because of the size. I looked around and there wasn't really any option here in the area. I called Corning to check and they verified that there wasn't.Owens Corning has always been, in my experience, less than helpful whenever I have contacted them. Fortunately, there is a place here in SoCA that sells mineral wool, compressed fiberglass etc. to non-contractors and their prices are generally very good. They're called Southwestern Insulation and they're located in Garden Grove CA. Here's their contact info:12851 Nelson StGarden Grove, CA 92840(714) 530-2980They usually deliver (locally) for free too. Ask for Jeff. Home Megastores aren't usually going to stock it - the best place to look in my experience is in the phone book under insulation suppliers / contractors and start calling around until you (hopefully) find a good local source. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members UstadKhanAli Posted October 10, 2007 Author Members Share Posted October 10, 2007 Run, do not walk, away from Foam by Mail. See this: www.ethanwiner.com/fraud.htmlSo I emailed this link to my band. My singer writes back, saying: "FOAM FRAUD!Is nothing sacred?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members myfipie Posted October 11, 2007 Members Share Posted October 11, 2007 So I emailed this link to my band. My singer writes back, saying: "FOAM FRAUD! Is nothing sacred?" I think guitar picks still are, but maybe there is fraud in that now. Glenn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators MrKnobs Posted October 11, 2007 Moderators Share Posted October 11, 2007 I think guitar picks still are, but maybe there is fraud in that now. Glenn Picks haven't been the same for a while now. Back in the day (see the video in my sig), I used to light my Fender thin picks and throw them into the audience. They burned so fast and violently they never hit the ground. These days, they hardly smolder. Terry D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ethan Winer Posted October 11, 2007 Members Share Posted October 11, 2007 "FOAM FRAUD! Is nothing sacred?" LOL, nothing is sacred these days. Fraud is rampant everywhere, and it's not just Foam By Mail as I hope you read. --Ethan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members riceinfusions Posted October 12, 2007 Members Share Posted October 12, 2007 www.the-truth-about-ethan-winer.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members John Sayers Posted October 12, 2007 Members Share Posted October 12, 2007 Creating a special website just to attack someone without revealing who you are is lower than anything you accuse Ethan of IMO. 13. Ethan Winer employs a "well liked" forum moderator who uses several different identities to conceal his relationship with Ethan Winer, all the while pumping his first for him and accusing others (in public forums) of attacking this "poor" helpless salesman. This employee (name not yet disclosed) has entered forums such as www.johnlsayers.com (and others) and lambasted and ridiculed those who question Ethan Winer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Anderton Posted October 13, 2007 Members Share Posted October 13, 2007 I don't have a very high opinion of anonymous opinions. I received a request to delete this thread because of Ethan's accusations of fraud against a company, and was told of the existence of a web site that refuted everything Ethan said. I asked for the URL so that I could conduct my own research. I never received this URL, and it is likely that the person who posted it here is the same person who asked me to delete the thread. However, this doesn't refute Ethan's claims of fraud from others, but makes several claims about Ethan's products. I believe in letting people have their say, and the people who frequent this forum can make up their own minds. Having said that, though, I will say that Ethan puts his name out there and doesn't post things anonymously. When asked if he stands behind his statements, he does so publicly. That kind of behavior carries more weight with me than anonymous posts. However, people are allowed to say their piece here. We are perfectly capable of making up our own minds based on the quality and quantity of data we receive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Anderton Posted October 13, 2007 Members Share Posted October 13, 2007 I received an email from the person who asked me to consider removing the link in Ethan Winer's post. He said, and this is correct, that he asked me to consider removing the link, he did not ask me directly to remove it. He also said he did not post the "truth about ethan winer" link, and added: "I don't condone that hurtful and careless website and I want NO part of this nastiness" and he went on to call that link "shameful." Furthermore, he said: "With all due respect, I'd rather Mr Winer's post remain intact and have us fight it out (off the web) with him, than propogate a web-world full of such nonsense. I'll simply have no part of it." I must say that the concept of dealing with something offline rather than airing one's dirty laundry in public is something that I support and respect. So, I sincerely hope that the people involved can deal with this among themselves, and come to an understanding. If this forum (admittedly in some circuitous way) helps resolve these issues, so much the better. Now let's get back to acoustic treatment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ethan Winer Posted October 13, 2007 Members Share Posted October 13, 2007 www.the-truth-about-ethan-winer.com I laughed so hard when I saw that I almost spit up my coffee. I tracked down the web ownership and it was registered through a cloak service. But the writing in that "blog" is pure Joel DuBay. This is exactly the childish stuff Joel has been doing for a few years now, as detailed in my Fraud Report linked above. Looks like I have yet another entry to make! BTW, Joel did something similar to another acoustic treatment vendor, Glenn Kuras of GIK, but not quite so hateful. Joel took apart one of Glenn's bass traps, then posted a YouTube video - anonymously, of course! - showing step by step how to build it. Joel, have you no shame? You have proven beyond doubt to everyone reading this how devious and dishonest you really are. --Ethan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ethan Winer Posted October 13, 2007 Members Share Posted October 13, 2007 I laughed so hard when I saw that I almost spit up my coffee. OMG, I just realized there's a 20-MINUTE MOVIE that goes with Joel DuBay's anti-Ethan web site! Folks, if you have add-ons disabled in your browser, enable them so you can see all the effort Joel put into this. My favorite part is where he calls me an aetheist (sic). Though the flaming MiniTrap is pretty funny too. --Ethan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ready Acoustics Posted October 13, 2007 Members Share Posted October 13, 2007 OMG, I just realized there's a 20-MINUTE MOVIE that goes with Joel DuBay's anti-Ethan web site! Folks, if you have add-ons disabled in your browser, enable them so you can see all the effort Joel put into this. My favorite part is where he calls me an aetheist (sic). Though the flaming MiniTrap is pretty funny too.--Ethan This is not my website. This is not my work and I don't condone it. I'll have no part of your pathetic insults Ethan Winer. You've done more to create chaos in this industry (in my opinion) than any other. Keep lying to folks about acoustics, and some will drink your kool-aid. Others and folks who do just small amount of home-work understand quite well what you are up to in these posts and at your slanderous website. I on the other hand, don't laugh at this kind of thing and along with your website dedicated to re-inventing acoustic sciences and ruining companies in your same field, I find this shameful, too Get a grip and get a life. Once again, you ETHAN WINER have turned a thread about acoustics into an attack campaign against yet another business in our industry. Well, hip-hip hooray Mr Winer. Job "well" done. Now leave me alone once and for all. ~ Joel DuBay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SkullCap Posted October 13, 2007 Members Share Posted October 13, 2007 Not that I'm an expert, but I've had good luck with RealTraps for my studio. It works well.What I know even less about is cheap foam stuff that we can use to make the sound a little better in our rehearsal studio. We have no need to soundproof, just to reduce the reflections a bit and "focus" the sound a little bit more. A friend of mine sent me this:http://www.foambymail.com/Pyramid.htmlAt any rate, if you have any suggestions, please let me know. The room is long, probably about 12 feet across, and about 24 ft. long, and has a suspended office-style ceiling and drywall. It's in a rehearsal studio, along with a bunch of other bands. I appreciate any helpful tips or links to foam / sound deadening / diffusion manufacturers, mineral wool, bass traps, etc. that are inexpensive. Thanks! I went to walmart (ugh!, i know) and bought several queen size foam matress pads for around $18.00 each. not a bad deal and it definitely makes a difference. i don't know if they're fire proof or flame resistant though. anyway, my $.02 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil O'Keefe Posted October 13, 2007 Share Posted October 13, 2007 I do think that whomever started / posted the link to that site should have the stones to stand up and stop concealing their identity. Like you Craig, I give very little credibility to anything said by someone who is unwilling to put their name behind it. Ethan sez -> I tracked down the web ownership and it was registered through a cloak service. I also did a WhoIs trace on the website, and what Ethan said is true - it was registered via a cloaking service. Tacky indeed. Craig sez -> He also said he did not post the "truth about ethan winer" link Last word on the subject from me, but I traced the IP addresses, and they're different, non-proxy, and trace back to different areas of the country; thus supporting that statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil O'Keefe Posted October 13, 2007 Share Posted October 13, 2007 I went to walmart (ugh!, i know) and bought several queen size foam matress pads for around $18.00 each. not a bad deal and it definitely makes a difference. i don't know if they're fire proof or flame resistant though. anyway, my $.02 The problem with most "mattress foam" is that it's the wrong type of foam. It may look similar, but look at it closely, and chances are it's a closed cell type foam. Acoustic foam is open celled, where the cell walls are not closed off. The idea is that sound needs to be able to travel through the open foam material and is absorbed through friction with the fibers. Closed cell foam isn't nearly as effective. If it is working to your satisfaction, then great. But I would normally advise people to steer clear of "mattress pad foam". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ethan Winer Posted October 13, 2007 Members Share Posted October 13, 2007 I traced the IP addresses, and they're different, non-proxy, and trace back to different areas of the country; thus supporting that statement. I'll have more to say on all of this soon, but it's trivial to fake that. For example, I have an emergency Earthlink dial-up account for the occasional time my cable Internet goes down. Earthlink has call-in numbers all over the country. So if I wanted to perpetrate such fraud I'd just call up one of their Idaho numbers and post away. Understand that Joel has already been caught doing this twice so far (I suspect more, but can prove only two), so hopefully he's learned that it's important to cover his tracks! --Ethan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil O'Keefe Posted October 13, 2007 Share Posted October 13, 2007 Ethan, I'm not about to openly give away all my methods and secrets, but I'm pretty competent at this stuff, and I can almost always tell if someone is using a proxy, or is on a dialup or if I'm getting spoofed or they're bouncing things. I'd rate the probability of accuracy of what I posted previously at close to 90% - I'm that confident with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ethan Winer Posted October 13, 2007 Members Share Posted October 13, 2007 Ethan, I'm not about to openly give away all my methods and secrets, but I'm pretty competent at this stuff In the grand scheme of things, it doesn't matter whether our Mr. DuBay posted that link to the Ethan Sucks site, or it was his partner in Jacksonville Florida, or a friend living who knows where. There is no question that Joel is behind the site, and I'll address that soon. --Ethan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Lee Flier Posted October 13, 2007 Members Share Posted October 13, 2007 I have!!! But then again I own the company! Glenn Hi Glenn! (Glenn is here in Atlanta and our bands have shared bills on quite a few occasions ). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SkullCap Posted October 13, 2007 Members Share Posted October 13, 2007 The problem with most "mattress foam" is that it's the wrong type of foam. It may look similar, but look at it closely, and chances are it's a closed cell type foam. Acoustic foam is open celled, where the cell walls are not closed off. The idea is that sound needs to be able to travel through the open foam material and is absorbed through friction with the fibers. Closed cell foam isn't nearly as effective. If it is working to your satisfaction, then great. But I would normally advise people to steer clear of "mattress pad foam". believe me, it's not what's desired. i'd love to have some aurilex or some other type of "real" acoustic foam, but it was what was in my budget and it's just a small home studio / practice space. it really does make a difference though. it's better than nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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