NIRVANA: The only important band in the last 15 years?

[Lee Knight]

What a totally vapid, useless thread. A-Squid needs to lock it, before it gets ugly.

 

 

I only got this far in the thread cause I absolutely agree with the Cooterman. Thanks Coot, now I don't have read on, thank God.

 

BTW, how I hate hate expression "important". That's not pretentious. The only important band of the blah blah blah puke.

[humancertainty]

grunge and alt rock may be easier technically to play, but it is hard to reproduce the intensity and raw emotion it conveyed. It's like saying "anyone can play punk'...until you try to learn some punk songs and go play them and be believable. Punk bands sell playing punk because they are punk. Likewise, Nirvana became a hit not because of their chops (though Cobain's ability to turn a hook is grossly underestimated by the poodle haircut and spandex crowd) but because they were the anti-80s in every respect-clothes, hair, no makeup, and they didn't sing about partying and getting into teenage girls' pants, which was pretty much what 80s music had devolved into. They certainly weren't into formula songs, slick production, catchy guitar riffs and perfect high pitched vocals. They tapped into the angst of an entire group of ugly, fat, pimply kids, the ones never picked for games in PE class or not raised in affluent neighborhoods. They were kids with broken homes, broken psyches, societal rejects, and Cobain spoke their language because he was one of them. When I first heard them, part of me didn't get it, because of what I was used to hearing. It sounded like the music was broken, disjointed, rough-until I realized they were speaking to ME, about my own broken and disjointed life, how I grew up, with multiple step dads and 'uncles', physical and emotional abuse and alcoholism and drugs- and I fell in love with them. What I love about listening to them is how you can just feel Kurt's seething anger and undirected disappointment at life almost explode from songs like 'Teen Spirit'. And THAT's what made them important, to me anyway. It has nothing to do with technical ability and everything to do with giving voice to a part of the population who previously had nearly none. I believe Curt believed every word he sang, and his audience knew it. YMMV.

 

 

This nails it. I don't know about how y'all spent your teenage years(or adult years), but watching videos of Motley Crue rolling down The Strip in a limo with a {censored}ing hot tub on the back doing blow and banging porn stars had/has ZERO relevance to my life. Nirvana didn't do a whole lot for me at the time of Nevermind's release simply due to the fact that I am old enough to have gotten into punk/hardcore/metal about a year before it hit. Black Flag meant far more to me(and still do).

It's similar to The Ramones/Sex Pistols/whatever. A bunch of musicians who were not too technically skilled realized, "Hey! We don't need guitar solos or an Overman image! We can do whatever the {censored} we want!"

Bands like The Minutemen, Black Flag, and countless other bands took it to it's logical extreme, albeit without the popularity. They were all reacting against the '70s. Nirvana was the band that popularized that reaction to the '80s. I think Nirvana hit all the harder because of MTV.

It's funny. My friend, Tad, was telling me how when Kurt played him Nevermind right after it was mixed that they all thought it was a great record and would sell 10-15,000 copies.

So Nirvana as the only important band of the last 15 years? Well, we'll say 20 for aforementioned reasons. Anyhow, absolutely not. No way. There were so many important bands in the underground and the mainstream.

They were important, though. I will agree with that.

[Dancebass]

Well since MTV doesn't play videos anymore, who knows. Probably some FaceMyTwitterSpace doodad, or whatever is flavor of the week when the time comes.

 

 

Well, that's kind of my point. The source of delivery is going to be developed again before someone can come along and have that kind of impact.

 

Elvis had Ed Sulivan which was a huge cultural mover at the time.

The 80's and later Nirvana had MTV serving as a national radio station.

Currently there is no source of delivery for that kind of cultural event.

[tacdryver]

According to MTV...if you contrast all the threads that led to 80s metal, vs the one reason that 80s metal died...Nirvana....shows you how important that band was...

Personaly, I think Nirvana ushered in a whole generation of 'I'm a {censored}, and it's ok' type of music that was evidentely a sentiment building up by all the people sitting on the sidelines, while type 'A' guys like me were banging every hot chick we could find, all the while listening to 'Nobody Rides For Free'

Grunge was a different message, I think, and not just about quiet/loud/quiet/loud...it was about giving up...and I think led to a whole Napolean Dynamite...Toby Maquire as a superhero bull{censored}, that I think is now coming to an end..

Remember...back in the 80s, we watched Stallone, Chuck Norris, Steven Segal, kicking everyone's butt...on the big screen...Where are the tough guys now?

Interestingly, is what the lady's think about this...I am even seeing some voiced sentiment on 'where are the men these days' which might drive guys to man up a little more....and thier music as well.... and I am not talking about death metal sausage fests, playing to an audience of 15 guys standing there twittering on thier Iphones, no women to be seen for miles...

I think people got tired of the high adrenaline type of entertainment...I liked grunge, good stuff, but it's done...country and hip hop, had the last decade.....but....something new is coming...I can feel it....

The 60s had the hippy thing...70s stoner/classic rock...80s pop/metal / 90s grunge / 2000s..? we saw white kids trying to be black or every rocker trying to be a cowboy to sell albums...

I hope that whatever comes down the road, that it really means something....I really believe rhat many people are looking for an identity, and they look for it many times in thier music....

[6StringSling]

 

grunge and alt rock may be easier technically to play, but it is hard to reproduce the intensity and raw emotion it conveyed. It's like saying "anyone can play punk'...until you try to learn some punk songs and go play them and be believable. Punk bands sell playing punk because they are punk. What I love about listening to them is how you can just feel Kurt's seething anger and undirected disappointment at life almost explode from songs like 'Teen Spirit'. And THAT's what made them important, to me anyway. It has nothing to do with technical ability and everything to do with giving voice to a part of the population who previously had nearly none. I believe Curt believed every word he sang, and his audience knew it.

 

Not that I haven't had my share of dark times but I blame that on ME and MY choices, not society. There have been uncounted thousands of people in history who had a much worse life in much worse societies than Cobain ever did and all his "angst" was just crybaby whining to me. The fact that he eventually took his own life proves to me what a loser he was to begin with. I cannot find sympathy for those who lack the courage and drive to overcome their demons (or at the very least, put in an honest effort at overcoming them); not when there are so many children who through no fault of their own will never have (or even live to have) the opportunities in life that Cobain did. Every time I walk into a place like Fred Meyer's (that would be similar to Kroger's for you east coasters) I am struck by the fact that I have more options in that short time I will be shopping than millions of people on this planet will ever have in possibly a lifetime.

 

I realize that there are microcosms in microcosms in microcosms in all facets of life but I never could, nor ever will be able to, accept the kind of music like Nirvana as "speaking to me" because I have better things to do than feel sorry for myself for having to accept the consequences that arise from my own choices.

[BlueStrat]

Not that I haven't had my share of dark times but I blame that on ME and MY choices, not society. There have been uncounted thousands of people in history who had a much worse life in much worse societies than Cobain ever did and all his "angst" was just crybaby whining to me. The fact that he eventually took his own life proves to me what a loser he was to begin with. I cannot find sympathy for those who lack the courage and drive to overcome their demons (or at the very least, put in an honest effort at overcoming them); not when there are so many children who through no fault of their own will never have (or even live to have) the opportunities in life that Cobain did. Every time I walk into a place like Fred Meyer's (that would be similar to Kroger's for you east coasters) I am struck by the fact that I have more options in that short time I will be shopping than millions of people on this planet will ever have in possibly a lifetime.

I don't know if I have ever read more ideas in one paragraph with which I almost wholly disagree.

C'est la vie!

 

[Nijyo]

 

Not that I haven't had my share of dark times but I blame that on ME and MY choices, not society. There have been uncounted thousands of people in history who had a much worse life in much worse societies than Cobain ever did and all his "angst" was just crybaby whining to me. The fact that he eventually took his own life proves to me what a loser he was to begin with. I cannot find sympathy for those who lack the courage and drive to overcome their demons (or at the very least, put in an honest effort at overcoming them); not when there are so many children who through no fault of their own will never have (or even live to have) the opportunities in life that Cobain did. Every time I walk into a place like Fred Meyer's (that would be similar to Kroger's for you east coasters) I am struck by the fact that I have more options in that short time I will be shopping than millions of people on this planet will ever have in possibly a lifetime. I realize that there are microcosms in microcosms in microcosms in all facets of life but I never could, nor ever will be able to, accept the kind of music like Nirvana as "speaking to me" because I have better things to do than feel sorry for myself for having to accept the consequences that arise from my own choices.

 

 

Your inability to relate to the genre and lyrical subject matter has zero to do with its influence on popular rock. :poke:

 

You don't like it, we get it, but that's not germane at all to the overall importance on popular music that came later.

[Austincowbell]

Not that I haven't had my share of dark times but I blame that on ME and MY choices, not society. There have been uncounted thousands of people in history who had a much worse life in much worse societies than Cobain ever did and all his "angst" was just crybaby whining to me. The fact that he eventually took his own life proves to me what a loser he was to begin with. I cannot find sympathy for those who lack the courage and drive to overcome their demons (or at the very least, put in an honest effort at overcoming them); not when there are so many children who through no fault of their own will never have (or even live to have) the opportunities in life that Cobain did. Every time I walk into a place like Fred Meyer's (that would be similar to Kroger's for you east coasters) I am struck by the fact that I have more options in that short time I will be shopping than millions of people on this planet will ever have in possibly a lifetime. I realize that there are microcosms in microcosms in microcosms in all facets of life but I never could, nor ever will be able to, accept the kind of music like Nirvana as "speaking to me" because I have better things to do than feel sorry for myself for having to accept the consequences that arise from my own choices.

do you need a ladder to get off of this?

[6StringSling]

 

Your inability to relate to the genre and lyrical subject matter has zero to do with its influence on popular rock. :poke: You don't like it, we get it, but that's not germane at all to the overall importance on popular music that came later.

 

I never said it wasn't influential. Someone made a comment about 90's music being a riff repeated for five minutes and I gave an opinion.

[tlbonehead]

I too liked Nirvanna for the 'lack of production' sound. Todays generation doesn't really understand that live music does not sound like the album. Of course thats not totally true as certain types of music can sound very close live but in general they are not comparable. Now on the negative side, the entire Seattle/grunge sound can be summed up in two lines from a song I wrote 15 years ago: "Life sucks, life sucks, life sucks, I'm wearing flannel" "Life sucks, life sucks, life sucks, I live in Seattle" The 90's was a total loss musically.

you don't understand it so it was automatically bad?

[tlbonehead]

Huh?

huh x2!

[tlbonehead]

, Cumbersome and Hungerstrike to name a few.

something tells me you aren't playing PLUSH correctly. Those two 80s songs seem like Mr. Rogers theme songs compared to PLUSH from my perspective.

[wades_keys]

I understand the guy wasn't at Woodstock but he's no Lemmy! :poke:

Damn dirty hippy. :poke:

[wades_keys]

Artist of the past 15 years would have to be Garth Brooks. Even though he was building succuess before that. I would say a close second for Phish who really hit their stride about 15 years ago with the release of Hoist and being able to sell out major ampitheaters. I'd also throw the Dave Matthews Band into this discussion as well.

[JilaX^]

I mean seriously did I have an "aha" moment when I hear Nirvana....No. Did I own the album yes. Lets give the guy props though, hands down the most influential artist of the past generation was Garth Brooks he changed the face of Country music and had 6 albums sell over 10 Million units, Including one that sold 22 Million. Compare that to Nirvana's 1 album that sold 11 Million, yes a good mark, but not it the same league as the Beatles, game changing or whatever. They were part of a scene all those bands deserve credit, maybe you could say that the Seatle/grunge movement was the most important/influential thing in music but not just Nirvana, you would have to include Stone Temple Pilots, Soundgarden, Pearl Jam etc. Here is a good test ask younger folks....None of my daughters friends now about Nirvana, but they sure as hell know who Garth Brooks is, just like The Beatles or other bands/artists that transcended their generation and scene.

Nirvana has sold over 50 million albums....


Also, I don't know. ANYONE, who knows Garth Brooks (Except maybe my Aunt ). Everyone does know Nirvana, though. I'm 18. Sorry to disappoint you, but Garth Brooks doesn't transcend neither his generation or his scene.

[wades_keys]

grunge and alt rock may be easier technically to play, but it is hard to reproduce the intensity and raw emotion it conveyed. It's like saying "anyone can play punk'...until you try to learn some punk songs and go play them and be believable. Punk bands sell playing punk because they are punk. Likewise, Nirvana became a hit not because of their chops (though Cobain's ability to turn a hook is grossly underestimated by the poodle haircut and spandex crowd) but because they were the anti-80s in every respect-clothes, hair, no makeup, and they didn't sing about partying and getting into teenage girls' pants, which was pretty much what 80s music had devolved into. They certainly weren't into formula songs, slick production, catchy guitar riffs and perfect high pitched vocals. They tapped into the angst of an entire group of ugly, fat, pimply kids, the ones never picked for games in PE class or not raised in affluent neighborhoods. They were kids with broken homes, broken psyches, societal rejects, and Cobain spoke their language because he was one of them. When I first heard them, part of me didn't get it, because of what I was used to hearing. It sounded like the music was broken, disjointed, rough-until I realized they were speaking to ME, about my own broken and disjointed life, how I grew up, with multiple step dads and 'uncles', physical and emotional abuse and alcoholism and drugs- and I fell in love with them. What I love about listening to them is how you can just feel Kurt's seething anger and undirected disappointment at life almost explode from songs like 'Teen Spirit'. And THAT's what made them important, to me anyway. It has nothing to do with technical ability and everything to do with giving voice to a part of the population who previously had nearly none. I believe Curt believed every word he sang, and his audience knew it. YMMV.

That's it - exactly.

As a "musician" I always grappled with the simplicity and the sloppy guitar in Nirvana songs.

But as a listener, that {censored} spoke to me.

That's a good place to be as a listener, and after Nirvana I never listened to nor played any 80's metal any longer - it just didn't speak to me anymore and I realized that those 80's guys were just putting themselves on a pedestal largely and saying "look at me".

Cobain seemed to tap into the intimacy of a 70's singer/songwriter, but his music also rocked out.

The man was a genius.

[wades_keys]

Also, I don't know. ANYONE, who knows Garth Brooks (Except maybe my Aunt ). Everyone does know Nirvana, though. I'm 18. Sorry to disappoint you, but Garth Brooks doesn't transcend neither his generation or his scene.

I dunno - Garth is pretty dam important in the country scene.

Only time will tell if his music will be considered "classic".

[wades_keys]

 

Grunge was a different message, I think, and not just about quiet/loud/quiet/loud...it was about giving up...and I think led to a whole Napolean Dynamite...Toby Maquire as a superhero bull{censored}, that I think is now coming to an end.. Remember...back in the 80s, we watched Stallone, Chuck Norris, Steven Segal, kicking everyone's butt...on the big screen...Where are the tough guys now? I think people got tired of the high adrenaline type of entertainment...I liked grunge, good stuff, but it's done...country and hip hop, had the last decade.....but....something new is coming...I can feel it.... The 60s had the hippy thing...70s stoner/classic rock...80s pop/metal / 90s grunge / 2000s..? we saw white kids trying to be black or every rocker trying to be a cowboy to sell albums... I hope that whatever comes down the road, that it really means something....I really believe rhat many people are looking for an identity, and they look for it many times in thier music....

 

I couldn't have said it better myself.

 

I eventually grew tired of the whiny angst-ridden Seattle knockoffs.

 

Nirvana impacted me at first, but only at certain moments.

 

I suspect that many, like me, would alternate between moments of despair and moments of having to man up and get to work.

 

I was once the kid that everyone liked to mess with - but rather than whine about it, I got tough and started fighting back.

[mineame]

I will admit that I liked Nirvana when they first came out. I bought their Nevermind CD, learned to play a few songs off of it I quickly grew tired of the CD.

 

However, when I hear a song of theirs today, I find myself liking it.

 

I still don't know if would say that Cobain was the Morrison of his generation.

 

I also think that there were much better bands to come out of Seattle in the 90's. Matter of fact, I would probably list Nirvana near the bottom of my personal favorites for that time period.

 

AiC, Soundgarden, Mother Love Bone (RiP Andrew), Pearl Jam ...

[JilaX^]

I dunno - Garth is pretty dam important in the country scene. Only time will tell if his music will be considered "classic".

Yes, but anywhere outside the country scene he's scarcely known. Everyone knows Nirvana.
I don't think I know a single young person, who won't recognize Nirvana when Smells Like Teen Spirit is played. They're already considered classic.

[S.L.B.]

Nirvana has sold over 50 million albums.... Also, I don't know. ANYONE, who knows Garth Brooks (Except maybe my Aunt ). Everyone does know Nirvana, though. I'm 18. Sorry to disappoint you, but Garth Brooks doesn't transcend neither his generation or his scene.

So you had never heard the name Garth Brooks before? Interesting.

Thats a bit generous on the album count I would say seeing as how there best selling record just recently topped the 10 million mark. Besides I don't think you want to try that route, Gart has sold over 130 Million records and 220 million singles. 6 albums that are certified Diamond Platinum.

I don't even like him all that much, but you gotta give props. The fact is his music gets player right along side current artists, and he's just as popular as ever. He's already transcended his generation, and taken the world by storm.

And what exactly did Nirvana do to transcend their genre? Its still mostly angry young men that listen to the angst filled music just like I did 15 years ago. Oh and by the way all the girls were too busy singing Garth Brooks "The Dance" and totally didn't get Nirvana.

[S.L.B.]

Yes, but anywhere outside the country scene he's scarcely known. Everyone knows Nirvana. I don't think I know a single young person, who won't recognize Nirvana when Smells Like Teen Spirit is played. They're already considered classic.

Don't confuse what you and your small group of friends know with worldwide acceptance, notoriety, and fame.

The dude's hat is in the Smithsonian.

[S.L.B.]

I don't think I know a single young person, who won't recognize Nirvana when Smells Like Teen Spirit is played. They're already considered classic.

Yea, and a lot of that exposure comes from the song being on guitar hero. And I don't disagree with the fact that they are classic. But hardly the most important in the past 15 years, or only as sugguested. Not even close really.

[JilaX^]

Yea, and a lot of that exposure comes from the song being on guitar hero. And I don't disagree with the fact that they are classic. But hardly the most important in the past 15 years, or only as sugguested. Not even close really.

 

 

I don't they're the only or most important neither, tbh.

[S.L.B.]

He's popular within the US , outside? Not so much.

 

 

Um well he's sold 123 Million units in the states 220 Million world wide so I guess 100 Million records outside of the states is not that popular?

 

 

 

They've transcended their genre by reaching my entire generation.

 

 

That would be transcending a generation not a genre, transcending a genre would be a rock band capturing country listners or a country artist capturing rock listners just like Garth did when he came out and turned millions of people on to country that would never have given it a second listen. Nirvana was only popular to a certain demographic and to the most part remains that way.

 

Funny that I take this position btw as I owned a Nirvana album and Never a Garth record.