This forum, bias and "Clone Threads"

[Terminus]

You gonna keep ignoring this Kittie?

 

 

Did you expect anything else?

[shaun126]

Did you expect anything else?

 

 

Well I haven't been rude in the slightest, so he really doesnt have any comeback. Just presenting the ugly truth.

 

Guess he doesn't care for it.

[fusebop]

After seeing the pics in the ED entry everything suddenly seems unfair.

I believe {censored} like this is even beyond the mods' power.

 

How the {censored} do you deal with a troll this large? A troll that laughs

at banhammers! A troll that uses its IRL deformity as a special attack!

I'm... stunned.

[LR Weizel]

Okay guys, I think I was wrong. The guy I was defending from Zvex/Phil's lack of correct action is one of the biggest jerks I've ever met. I felt sorry for the guy after he told me that story about his Dad abusing him but sympathy only goes so far. You can't excuse someone forever just because they have issues...

[CannedHeat]

A twist!

[Phil O'Keefe]

How do someone prove themselves to be a good mod? Again, as far as I can see this place is filled with {censored}heads.

Again with the attacks on the forum community at large, and its members. I really don't understand why else (besides a desire to troll) you'd keep coming back here if that's how you feel.

Yeah, you like to portray yourself as the champion of the Internet. But it's not your site, and it's not your responsibility to change things here. If you don't like blue, you can paint your home's interior some other color... but you have no right to tell your neighbor that they can't paint their home's interior blue if they so desire.

If you go back and read this thread it's full of needless aggression. And it didn't used to be that bad - in fact it's around the time Phil and Co. came in that it took a nose dive. How can I trust your standard for a "good mod"? I've been on enough forums to get an idea. Most mods aren't good, actually, because they're not people who have any qualifications for what they do.

I wouldn't' suggest getting into a qualifications pissing match with me Kitty. I'm a professional engineer / producer / studio owner. I have worked with platinum selling artists. I've contributed to books, done "how to" videos, written magazine articles (how-to as well as product review), had my own monthly column, done beta testing and product development evaluations, played on countless records, etc. I don't get paid a dime for moderating on HCEF. I am paid a small amount monthly for the use of my "name" on my recording forum, but beyond that, I do it in an effort to "give back / pay it forward." I had a lot of help from great pros when I started out, and they told me to pass it on when my time came. Debt of honor stuff that I take seriously, so when I get the opportunity to share what they taught me with others, I try to do so. I don't know everything, but when I feel I can be helpful, I try to offer that help.

Banning people like you - doing the "forum cop" thing, is actually my least favorite part of being a mod / site admin, and it's not the primary reason I was brought aboard. I was brought in to provide helpful content, which I definitely try to do - when I'm not being distracted from that by having to deal with this type of stuff.

[Ponda Boba]

[YOUTUBE][/YOUTUBE]

[d4rk0]

[YOUTUBE][/YOUTUBE]

[Phil O'Keefe]

If I am going to create an alternate account(I probably couldn't be arsed, I don't intend to),

 

Uh, actually Kitty - you already have.

[Bobby D]

phil......that was an awesome post:thu:

[Dr.Picklebottom]

If I am going to create an alternate account(I probably couldn't be arsed, I don't intend to), Uh, actually Kitty - you already have.

why no ban yet?

[d4rk0]

so are you banning this person and locking this thread down, or what?

[yorgatron]

so are you banning this person and locking this thread down, or what?

in before the lock?

[Phil O'Keefe]

why no ban yet?

I have been waiting for Craig - I already emailed and PM'ed him. I'd rather he did the ban, but OTOH, Craig tends to be even busier than I am - for all I know, he's in Asia or Europe working on something at the moment, and hasn't had time to catch up on his emails or whatever.

However, if it goes on much longer, I'll probably do it myself. If he decides my actions constitute an abuse of my authority, he can deal with me as he sees fit.

[IvIark]

Guy I know you like and respect Phil, but please could we stop all the "Great Post Phil" "Epic Stuff Phil" "We Love You Phil" stuff going on. It makes me a little bit sick in my mouth every time. Thanks.

[LR Weizel]

 

You're a moron. It's equally likely I baited him and he bit, especially as I was able to call him on his method of "trolling".

 

 

I said it was equally likely, I didn't say it's what I did. Really I was just playing along to show that he was a jerk. You should have dealth with him first.

 

Also, it's still impossibly childish to loom a permaban over me like this just so you can bully me. Why don't you get it over with? And why not just make it the FX forum? I have caused no trouble in the other forums. Make it less likely I'll come back ever.

 

 

I'd say bringing in independent, experienced moderators with extensive "real world" music industry and journalism experience,

 

 

That has nothing to do with being able to defend your actions logically in an argument, which you regularly fail to do. "Real World" means corporate. Deal with it.

 

 

I took it to a higher up out of fairness, and because my credibility / fairness were being called into question. You had the opportunity to take up the issue of your temp ban to me, or to Craig, but you didn't until now - and instead of doing it that way, you instead decided to create more forum drama.

 

 

No, you did it to be a jerk. Since you know I was going to be banned anyway, you were going to laugh in my face about it. I already dealth with this in a post you ignored - the "Higher ups" are probably where most of the corruption lies. Does taking it to another guy who can't keep this forum under control prove you right? No.

 

 

Let's make it a bit more realistic... if a company was selling a fake Fender headstock decal and posting about it on HC, would I take the thread down? Yes. As far as Marshall amps - early ones - being based on Fender amps, yeah, they were. But you apparently don't know a lot about amp design or early amp history. Those designs were not really Leo's - he based his amps off of circuits that were published by tube manufacturers, and freely available to just about anyone who wanted the info. IOW, RCA and GE tube application guides. Therefore, Jim Marshall wasn't ripping him off. Furthermore, they weren't sticking a Fender-esque logo on them and trying to pass them off as originals, or make them "look" like original Fenders to the casual observer. That's a significant difference.

 

 

Then make this clear in the rules. End of discussion. You're still leaving landmines around for new members or idiots like me to set off.

 

Also, the Marshall amps was one example. There's still a VICIOUS amount of cloning, and you know it. All I wanted was you to make it clear instead of telling me this now. Put it in the rules. Save other people.

 

 

I wouldn't' suggest getting into a qualifications pissing match with me Kitty. I'm a professional engineer / producer / studio owner.

 

 

All of which have everything to do with your ego and nothing to do with your ability to run a forum. This forum turned to {censored} when you and the new mods came in. That's why the ILF and Haunting Mids splinter groups exist. Fact.

 

 

I don't get paid a dime for moderating on HCEF.

 

 

Why would you need to? You get to bully autistic people and have half the forum back you up! Hell that's the most awesome volunteer work ever. That's like bitching that you don't get paid to having superpowers. {censored} that.

 

Ever hear "With Great Power, Comes Great Responsibility"? Spider-man didn't bitch about not being paid, and he didn't act like a jerk. Your inconsistant moderation has created a breeding ground for trolls which have ended up spilling over to other forums.

 

 

Banning people like you - doing the "forum cop" thing, is actually my least favorite part of being a mod / site admin,

 

 

I'm beginning to see that maybe that's the case. Taunting them before you ban them is your favourite bit - banning them puts an end to it.

 

You don't "Have" to ban me. I've offered you other solutions and you've turned me down. You WANT to ban me. And bring it to a higher up who's even more stern than you means I can't reason you out of the decision.

 

This forum has much deeper problems than my presence here. Nobody will notice when I'm gone, there'll be 2 or 3 less threads like this, that's it. But if you actually started doing a good job? Man.

 

 

I gave you the opportunity to correct your own post. It was a courtesy, not something I was required to do. If you went to bed, that's not my problem. The infraction was already committed.

 

 

You know, I did what you said for once and went back and editted pretty much all my posts in this thread. I didn't get a single brownie point for that. If banning is your least favourite part, why do you seem to enjoy it so much?

 

If you're telling the truth, don't ban me. I'll tell you what will happen. The trolls on this forum who've harassed me for god knows how long will be shaken up, they will know they don't have any power. I've pretty much lost interest in this fight since Tom, the guy I was defending, has decided to call me a mental patient(I'm autistic, by the way), so there'll be no more supposed "Troll" threads. I've lost faith in human beings. Great for you.

 

I've realised some of my friends were complete jerks after all. In my head, all I was trying to do was make a positive difference. These kind of threads are the least favourite part of my job. It is are utterly thankless. I stand up for people, for principles knowing it will make people hate me. The alternative is that nobody stands up for it, and people who feel the same way I do but are too afraid to say anything are utterly alone. Maybe you don't know what that feels like. You have so much support on this forum. You're a well off producer/engineer and don't have to give a {censored} about the little people who are just trying to get you to think twice before you ban people for dumb reasons, and refuse to deal with people who are causing the real trouble.

 

Just look at all the worship you get! And you bitch about not being paid. I actually put serious thought into what I do. I don't want to just upset people. I want to identify problems, point them out, and show them for what they are. Other people do not do this.

 

And I'm not a troll. I'm a witch. There's a difference. Witches don't rile people up, they plant seeds and people tear themselves apart because they're people. Read Macbeth sometime. At the end of the day though, I'm just opinionated, and arguing my case. Nothing more. That's what gets you banned online, not being a jerk. Jerks end up being cool guys on forums. I am not a "troll". Urinate Forever is a troll. This thread is riddled with trolls. You ban them now and again, but who ends up permabanned? The one person who bitches about them the most.

 

If it's any help, I don't want to hate you, or anyone else here. But you're making it hard when I'm practically telling you how to get me to behave, and you ignore it saying how much you hate to ban me.

[Devi Ever]

I have been waiting for Craig - I already emailed and PM'ed him. I'd rather he did the ban, but OTOH, Craig tends to be even busier than I am - for all I know, he's in Asia or Europe working on something at the moment, and hasn't had time to catch up on his emails or whatever. However, if it goes on much longer, I'll probably do it myself. If he decides my actions constitute an abuse of my authority, he can deal with me as he sees fit.

 

She's sending threatening emails to both me and Fuzz Hugger via multiple alt email addresses to bypass email blocking filters, even going as far as to create dummy subject headers asking for fx advice.

 

She's been banned from ILF and IP banned from my sites.

 

I'll be contacting my local, and irish, authories, as well as reporting her to her ISP later this week.

 

It's gone beyond internet lulz.

[L_Z_nut]

You're such a {censored}ing martyr!!

[murch33]

(I'm autistic, by the way)

That's the least of your problems.

[Phil O'Keefe]

OK, I went ahead and issued another perma-ban.

 

I strongly suspect she'll be back.

 

When she returns, IGNORE HER. No posts at all in reply. Please just "report and ignore".

 

Again, Craig can determine if I've overstepped my bounds and deal with that as he sees fit.

 

And yes, she's banned site-wide. Reason? Beback moniker of a well known troll who was already perma-banned. IOW, she shouldn't have been back here to begin with.

[Anderton]

OK, I went ahead and issued another perma-ban. I strongly suspect she'll be back. When she returns, IGNORE HER. No posts at all in reply. Please just "report and ignore". Again, Craig can determine if I've overstepped my bounds and deal with that as he sees fit. And yes, she's banned site-wide. Reason? Beback moniker of a well known troll who was already perma-banned. IOW, she shouldn't have been back here to begin with.

First of all...sorry, I was indeed in Europe on business, with spotty internet access and an insane travel schedule. Not that I'm complaining...the south of France is nice this time of year.

Second, I haven't seen you overstep your bounds yet. My only possible criticism would be that you didn't ban Weizel sooner. I appreciate your fairness, but it's obviously lost on some people.

Third, I regret not being around to do the banning myself

[Anderton]

It doesn't matter who is 'right'. He has a job to do and can do it how he sees fit.

Just had to quote this so I could agree emphatically. In general, the mods on HC are given a great deal of autonomy; I've monitored how Phil handles forums for several years now, and he's more than earned the right to do as he sees fit. Of course no one's perfect, but he handles a thankless task with style, honesty, and transparency.