OT: IT'S TIME... Who are you voting for ... ???

[jasonbmerrill]

Since September of 2000, a number of websites have sprung up encouraging prayer for George W. Bush. Much prayer went into Election 2000 and God responded in mercy by giving us a good, godly President who we do not deserve. We must not forget to thank God for giving us George W. Bush. Many of us also need to repent of our failure to pray for former President Clinton. Pray that the lies of Hillary and Bill be exposed, and pray that their hearts be released from the grip of greed and lust and power. Do not cry out for judgment, but rather for mercy, for surely were you, too, once lost and dead in sin.

..

[jasonbmerrill]

So you already judged me a half-believer? Is there such a thing? Is that like being half pregnant?

 

who said i was talking about you?

 

Matt 26:64 (A part)

[ChristianRock]

..

And what does that have to do with anything? Did I or someone here write that? I could fill this thread with non-related nonsense too, if you'd like.

[Todzilla]

Obama.

The 2000 McCain wouldn't have been so bad, but the cozying up to the most craven elements in the Republican party has drained any respect I once had for him.

[ElectricPuppy]

Obama.

[zoink]

I don't understand how so many can miss so much about Obama. How can one question the inexperience of Palin, who is running for VICE President, yet IGNORE the inexperience of Obama, who is running for PRESIDENT??

That's an easy one. The difference between Obama and Palin has to do with adaptivity and intellectual capacity, and not necessarily directly measurable experience. We need a president who is intelligent. The office is so unique in its rigors and demands as times change and events unfold that NOBODY really has "experience" that ultimately fits the position. It's more about talent and ability.

There are qualities that tend to define someone as presidential material, and probably chief among them is this certain flexible and adaptable intelligence, which also includes the willingness to listen to others, think in non-partisan terms, seek the counsel of experts, and consider multiple points of view in making decisions. In contrast, Republicans have demonstrated a dangerous combination of stubbornness and inability at this. Republican foreign and domestic policy has adhered to the tired philosophy that what is good for corporate America is by default good for the rest of America. Sort of a cross between Reagan's trickle down myth wherein the "free market" always brings the greatest good, and early 20th century corporatism espoused by the likes of Calvin Coolidge.

Yes, McCain is a war hero, and I suppose, a good legislator. But he is out of touch. He went on record not long ago admitting he knew next to nothing about economics, and admitted that he would need to pick a VP who was strong in that area. That person is now Palin (!!??). Moreover, his position on foreign policy is a relic of the Cold War. He still has it in his mind that "winning" is a simple matter of bringing sufficient might to bear. To put it bluntly, he's no TR, and this is not 1898.

Meanwhile, Palin is the everyman (or woman) candidate, which is fine, but we don't need an everyman as vice president. We need exceptional people for this position, and soccer moms don't cut it. Some may find her likable as a person, but that's not really relevant. America has had a problem with this for some time now, this aversion when it comes to electing people smarter than themselves. It should be clear by now that when you elect a wastrel C student with strong corporate ties, it puts you where we are right now, which is not a good place.

On that point, I think it's interesting how the word "elite" has been thrown around and contested in this campaign. The word has two primary connotations in our culture, describing in turn people who are smarter than average, and people who are wealthier than average. Strangely, many seem to prefer a candidate of the latter type over the former. We resent people who are smarter than we are, but admire and envy those who are materially successful.

[rj.phila]

i like rofls with my chicken. sometimes i put honey on my rofls instead of syrup.

[setAI]

Just before the brain isn't yet fully functional, it doesn't mean that it's not a person yet. Like I said, you accept that as being the line divider, to other people it's not that clear.

 

 

people who aren't aware of the line are simply uneducated about the process- it is not subject to opinion

 

before the first action potentials establish the signal trail to lay down guided by the epigenetic programming in the genes- the synaptic map of the brain DOESN'T EXIST and is is a blanc tableu of connectionless neurons- and the nature of the signals are NON-DETERMINISTIC [run the same process of development again and a different person will result each time] like all such complex electrical events: there is no 'destined person' until the signals fire and the pathways laid out there is not specific pattern they will follow- only the loose guidelines of the genes- so you cannot say any specific person will result- there is only a design space of possible human brains- the one that results is laid down and not completed until about 3 months AFTER birth! and all-but-one of the other possible 'people' will never exist anyway- since only one neural mapped personality will be observed after the child is born and develops-

[akliner]

Why do you want to force your beliefs on the rest of us?

This makes a whole lot of sense.

[Yoozer]

How do we really know where he stands on issues??

It says so on his site.

How do you know where McCain stands?

What has he really said? Well, for one, spread the wealth.

McCain's idea of spreading the wealth means bigger tax cuts for people who are already well off.

Do you all really understand what this means?? Look at other countries that are run with this idea.

As far as I know, Sweden isn't a burning pile of ashes yet with rioters in the streets.

The GOVERNMENT takes money from people who have more and give it to the prople who don't have much.

Yes. And? What would Jesus do?

Then everyone is equal.

Nonsense of course.

What about his health care plan?? It would be similar to Canada's. How many know this? How many know that Canada's system has failed terribly. People have to wait MONTHS to get MRI's, surgeries, etc.

It's not like you stumble into the hospital with a broken leg and have to wait a week while you're bleeding to death. It should also mean that you shouldn't have to pay through the nose when you fall ill or lose your job.

There's a lot of space between RAAARGH EVIL SOCIALISTS and "screw everyone who's off worse than me!". Don't lean to the latter because you're afraid of the former.

[raffor]

So let's get it straight. You think that me voting for a pro-life candidate, is forcing my views upon you. Right or wrong?

So, does pro-life for you mean that you are against death penalty, war, guns? Or are there exceptions to LIFE?

[setAI]

I wonder how long it will be before conservatives acknowledge that based on all the empirical data Socialized Medicine is the most successful political idea in the history of modern Democracy?

 

I mean none of the fruits of Capitalism even come close to the success of Socialized Medicine which is universally supported in every first world country except the US-

 

it is a testament to willful self-ignorance and isolation that most Americans aren't even AWARE that Socialized Medicine has worked completely and has won the debate on how to take care of people in society-

[Cydonia]

It's a train wreck, but I can't turn away. please continue. Isn't it interesting that every politcal thread devolves into a religous debate?

 

It's alright, until someone starts to talk about the Great Pumpkin.

 

OK, I said it. The Great Pumpkin. :facepalm:

 

And about religion... It doesn't matter really, because when the Large Hadron Collider will be fully operational in Early 2009, all religions will be condensed into a single black hole.

[ChristianRock]

So, does pro-life for you mean that you are against death penalty, war, guns? Or are there exceptions to LIFE?

You've asked me this before, and apparently didn't bother to read the answer.

[Yoozer]

Seriously, {censored} those abortion issues. They're smokescreens to make you avoid actual discussion. Nothing's getting overturned and it's like an LSD-laced lollipop and the promise of a unicorn for the christian base who are falling for it every single time.

 

If you want to stop the babykilling, better make sure that none of 'm are produced in the first place. We've seen what good abstinence programs did.

[ChristianRock]

Nothing's getting overturned? Keep thinking that.

[Awake77]

Seriously, {censored} those abortion issues. They're smokescreens to make you avoid actual discussion. Nothing's getting overturned and it's like an LSD-laced lollipop and the promise of a unicorn for the christian base who are falling for it every single time. If you want to stop the babykilling, better make sure that none of 'm are produced in the first place. We've seen what good abstinence programs did.

Did someone say LSD-laced lollipop?

[keybdwizrd]

I can't tell you the last time I even heard the abortion/pro-life question discussed in this election. Any noise made about it seems to have been generally ignored.

[ChristianRock]

I can't tell you the last time I even heard the abortion/pro-life question discussed in this election. Any noise made about it seems to have been generally ignored.

 

Obviously you don't know a lot of christians.

[soundwave106]

Obama has said on record that on the first day in office he wants to sign up the Freedom of Choice act which effectively takes away what little the states have to say about abortion, and it's very clear he will appoint ACLU-linked people to the Supreme Court. So obviously regardless of what Dobson says or doesn't say (I don't have time to read a letter that big when I already made my mind about the subject), I also have an idea of how an Obama administration will set back Christian values in society. I happen to want to vote against such thing, I believe it's my democratic right, isn't it?

It is, but it is also my right to question how opposition to "the ACLU" (whatever that is) and abortion have become "Christian values".

[keybdwizrd]

Obviously you don't know a lot of christians.

Yikes.

I was mainly referring to what I see/read in the media, and hear from the candidates themselves.

That being said, I think most of my friends go through life without thrusting their viewpoints upon others, especially with regard to such personal and emotionally-charged topics. And the vast majority of them are Christians.

[soundwave106]

I mean none of the fruits of Capitalism even come close to the success of Socialized Medicine which is universally supported in every first world country except the US-

Well, we're half-socialized already (Medicare, Medicaid, subsidies to companies for health insurance, government-directed structures, free emergency care). It's basically a matter of covering the gaps and controlling costs now -- a fact lost in the "I don't want a socialist system!" debate.

The word "socialist" is so overdone in this country. I heard an amusing story from someone I know, where an Alaskan inlaw called Obama a "socialist!", and later got antsy because his Alaskan Permanent Fund check hadn't arrived yet.

[ChristianRock]

Radical Islam is a perfect example of what happens when religion gets tied too closely to politics. "Secular humanism" is mostly a marketing term used by religious anti-science types. These folks think logic and reason and religion are incompatible with each other. Therefore, they try and brand logic and reason as a "religion". This is an incorrect viewpoint. That is the first mistake made by today's American evangelicals. Religion (Christianity or others) or other forms of humanizing philosophies, and reason / science, best coexist together. It is, but it is also my right to question how opposition to "the ACLU" (whatever that is) and abortion have become "Christian values".

The American Civil Liberties Union has two things they fight for (and have a lot of money to do it): freedom of expression (which is good) and erradication of religion from anything public-related, even if it was not paid with public funds (which kind of contradicts the first point they defend). This doesn't only extend to government. Their atheist agenda is pretty obvious and quite aggressive in its delivery.

[ElectricPuppy]

It's been 12 whole minutes... somebody argue something!

[ChristianRock]

Yikes. I was mainly referring to what I see/read in the media, and hear from the candidates themselves. That being said, I think most of my friends go through life without thrusting their viewpoints upon others, especially with regard to such personal and emotionally-charged topics. And the vast majority of them are Christians.

I guess you're right, I take that back. People are a lot more open in internet forums than they are in real life. I guarantee you it's a big deal, though, to a lot of people.