My Stereo Mix, Computer speakers don't sound the same as headphones why?

[Walters9515]

My Stereo Mixes sound really bad when using External computer speakers

 

What process or piece of gear do I need to resolve this problem?

 

The Problem is my stereo mixes have "No Bass" or Body when using Exterenal Computer speakers. The Stereo Mixes sound better when using Headphones, but I also tried using different headphones will make the stereo mix on the song sound different. The Spread of the panning of tracks also sounds different when played with the external computer speakers VS headphones.

 

So How can I make my stereo mixes sound the "same" on any external computer speaker and Professional?

 

My Headphones I use are Audio Technica ATH-M20

The mixes sound Really good out of them

 

My Little Headphones for my MP3

The mixes sound Ok not to bad

I have tried different little headphones and they all make the stereo mixes sound very different

 

What can I do to make this the "Same" for every headphones and exterenal computer speakers?

 

My External Computer Speakers

The Stereo mixes sound really bad out of them

The Spreads of panning is different

No bass or body

 

What can I do to make these better?

[Cirrus]

The headphone speakers is seperate. No "Crosstalk" from left or right. Brain (if have) processes seperate left right information from left ear and from right ear.

 

Panning hard left sound strange in headphones. Panning hard right sound strange in headphones. Opposite ear get no sound at all. Strange sensation.

 

Headphones are "enclosed". No room resonance so no standing waves, no high frequency flutter echo, and no "reverb". No reverb ambience very important - makes mixer add too much reverb ambience delay. Makes mixer pan too narrow when hard pan sounds wierd in headphones.

 

Then switch from headphone to speakers and oh calamity! Room ambience added! Room acoustics change mix! Right ear can hear left speaker! Left ear can hear right speaker!

 

Best solution: Don't mix with "headphones" for "perfect" mix. Use headphones as reference "not" for important mix descisions. Mix on speakers transfers to headphones better than mix on headphones transfers to speaker.

 

Heaphone has no natural ambience

Too much ambience added by mixer

No crosstalk between left ear and right ear

Gives unnatural sounding panning

[TimOBrien]

Whad'ya Mean I Can't Mix With Headphones????

[Phil O'Keefe]

Walters! Long time, no see! How have you been?

 

Read the link Tim posted and let us know if you have any questions. Mixing with headphones as the primary monitoring method isn't really recommended - in part because the sound, and the stereo imaging is quite a bit different on headphones compared to speakers.

[Walters9515]

I have to make two different mixes/Mastering I mean , one mix for stereo computer speakers and another mix for MP3 size headphones

 

For a stereo computer speakers mix

I have to change the EQ settings and Add A Compressor on the stereo 2 track master

 

For a MP3 size headphone mix

I just use no mastering just straight out of the board mix

 

The External computer speakers are very different to the MP3 size headphones so i have to add EQ and compression when mixing for external computer speakers

 

My MP3 size headphones mixes of my demos sound good with only MP3 size headphones but not when played back on externeal computer speakers

 

I made another set of mixes of my demos for external computer speakers

 

How can i make one mix sound good on both external computer speakers and for MP3 size headphones?

 

Cause right now i have two different masterings for each type for each demo song

 

How I master tracks is take the 2 track stereo mix and add EQ and compression on the 2 track stereo mix

 

The external computer speakers are very hard to master EQ for because they sound thin and distort the BASS

 

The MP3 size headphones has no mastering EQ or compression on the demos

 

Thats why i have two different Masters for each demo song

1.) One for the external computer speakers

2.) Another for MP3 size headphones

 

How can I make one mix that will playback on any both and sound the SAME

 

Even When I play the demo songs in my CAR is sounds different or on a different stereo system

 

Is this a Mastering problem?

 

Is there any kind of software program that will import an audio 2 track stereo mix straight out of a DAW, that has a presets that can process it so it can be played back on any home stereo system, MP3 player, CAR stereo's, Exterenal computer speakers that will sound good and professional?

 

Cause Right now one song will of mine will sound different on each system EQ wize mostly and stereo imaging

 

I live in an appt build so my mixes for my demos are on headphones, so my stereo imaging is going to have a problem

 

But mostly It's an EQ problem for different playback devices and speakers used or headphones

 

A Professional CD record you can playback on any device and it will sound good out of computer speakers or headphones

 

How Can I do this like they do it?

[TBush]

 

How I master tracks is take the 2 track stereo mix and add EQ and compression on the 2 track stereo mix

 

 

Yup- that's pretty much it.

 

And "what Phil said", too.

[Walters9515]

But When I add EQ or a Compressor on the 2 track stereo mixdown, The EQ will mostly distort the vocal tracks or the Compressor will too

 

So It's a Battle to sit there and adjust the knobs on the EQ and compressor to not distort the vocals so it comes out clear out of the external computer speakers cause they are so small in size

 

If i turn up the bass frequency on the EQ it will distort the vocals or if i turn the compressors knobs it will distort the vocals

 

Mastering was easier back in the days when speakers were bigger

 

Do you guys have the same problem? or am I doing something wrong?

 

Please when I add a compressor on the 2 track stereo mixdown it changes how you hear the tracks, it will bring out some tracks in front or in your face and others not a loud or in the background

 

But when i master a demo song, it will song good out of the external computer speakers because i added "Bass frequencys"

 

But when i play it back on headphones it's very muddy sounding

 

So for my demos that you want to hear out of headphones would have no mastering at all , I don't add anything

If i add an EQ and compressor it just distorts the vocals or other instrument tracks. It sounds more clear without any mastering at all on the 2 track mixdown when playing back using headphones but to hear it out of computer speakers its really bad because it needs mastering, EQ, compression.

 

So its hard for me to have my demo song be able to play out of an external computer speakers and be able to listen out of headphones too or your car also

[WRGKMC]

Thats why god made reference monitors. You mix to a flat responce. headphones and earbuds all have different sensitivity levels. you dont mix to make one set sound well because the sound will suck when you play it back through another source. you mix and master to high quality reference monitors. The if you listen to the playback through headphones or ear buds you use the playback volume and tone controls of your playback unit to the sound quality. Thats why god put tone controlls on stereo systems.

 

The main reason why its so hard to mix on headphones is you have no aural depth preception like you would with speakers. Speakers use the air in the room and the acoustic reflection to add depth to the music. You need to use that to create depth mixing. Headphones will allow you to adjust things within a stereo field pretty good and hear small details. Trying to get a good mix usually winds up sounding two dimensional, Its more luck than anything else getting something that sounds good played back through speakers. (I mixed with headphones for many years because I had no options with small kids, It sucks in comparison to good monitors)

 

They pretty much suck for EQ adjustments too because a small element doesnt generate a good flat responce close to the ear like that.

 

If you're in doubt download a sweep generator and connect it to the headphones and sweep it from 20hz to 20Khz. Youll hear some tones that pierce the ears and others that can barely be heard. Do the same with a good set of reference monitors and the percieved loudness of the sweep will pretty much be the same from one end of the spectrum to the other.

 

if all you have are headphones and computer monitors your basically guessing at what a good sound because the elements do not produce a flat frequency responce. Computer speakers especiallyn hype frequencies to make the speakers sound bigger than they are and few have frequency reproduction below 50hz. you need a sub to recreate those bass frequencies so you will tend to overhype bass mixing with them.

 

I suggest you download a free frequency analizer like Voxengo Span and use it as a visual aid when EQing. I'd also use it to A/B comparisons of commercial music frequently and try to target the instrument frequencies to simular levels.

 

If the speakers or bones dont produce certain frequencies well, over hyping the missing frequencies or lowering the hyped responces will make the mix incompatible with another system that has different responces. If one speaker has no bass respobce because the speaker sucks and you boost that bass, it will wind up sounding boomy on a speaker that has the preoper bass responce. You want to mix on a system with a flat responce. If you play the mix back on suckey speakers, well, they are just suckey sounding speakers. If they have a playback EQ bass and trebble and that gets you close thats all you do. you dont warp a good mix to play back on bad speakers.

At best you can do is mix on reference monitors so it plays back equally bad on all the various bad playback systems.

 

It kind of like tuning a guitar. You cant tune all notes to perfect pitch. Guitars use tempered tuning an have straight frets, so you tune it so all the notes are off a tad, so the guitar as a whole sounds in tune.

[Walters9515]

When I mix to reference monitors and play it back on external computer speakers it doesn't work at all

 

Cause most people will play back your demo songs on their computer using external computer speakers and it just distorts the vocals and other instrumentals

 

Cause the computer speakers are very Narrow and have no bass at all so you have to mix it to those kinds of small speakers

 

When I mix to regular monitor speakers it sounds good out of them but when played back on my computer speakers forget it

 

So I'm really confused on how to get a good mix coming out of computer speakers

 

Cause most of the frequencys and vocals will distort out of them

 

I have been using external computer speakers for my reference monitors instead of my 10" inch tannoys cheap model ones

 

I use the external computer speakers for my reference monitors because thats what most listeners are going to be hearing music out of

[Cirrus]

You should spend some time listening to your favourite albums through your external computer speakers, your reference monitors, and your headphones, and work out how you need your music to sound on reference monitors so it doesn't sound bad on external computer speakers.

[WRGKMC]

 

When I mix to reference monitors and play it back on external computer speakers it doesn't work at all Cause most people will play back your demo songs on their computer using external computer speakers and it just distorts the vocals and other instrumentals Cause the computer speakers are very Narrow and have no bass at all so you have to mix it to those kinds of small speakers When I mix to regular monitor speakers it sounds good out of them but when played back on my computer speakers forget it So I'm really confused on how to get a good mix coming out of computer speakers Cause most of the frequencys and vocals will distort out of them I have been using external computer speakers for my reference monitors instead of my 10" inch tannoys cheap model ones I use the external computer speakers for my reference monitors because thats what most listeners are going to be hearing music out of

 

 

Your reasoning here is flawed. There are thousands upon thousands of different computer speakers and they all have different responces.

You're assuming, because you get a good mix on your computer speakers, it would sound as good on other computer speaker.

I assure you this does not work. They will all have different frequency responce curves.

If you get a good mix on "studio reference monitors" and it doesnt reasonable good on computer monitors or any other playback system,

it means one of two things.

 

Your computor monitors suck, or you dont know how to mix/master right on studio monitors to make the music sound "as good as" other commercial music does on computer monitors.

[Walters9515]

But my studio monitors speakers are 10" inches

my computer speakers are 1" inch

my MP3 headphones are the size of a dime

 

If you mix/master to studio monitors speakers that are 10" inches , the mix,mastering is not going to sound good with speakers that are 1" inch or a size of a dime

[CME]

But my studio monitors speakers are 10" inches my computer speakers are 1" inch my MP3 headphones are the size of a dime If you mix/master to studio monitors speakers that are 10" inches , the mix,mastering is not going to sound good with speakers that are 1" inch or a size of a dime

 

Yes but you're never going to hear much below 100 hz on computer speakers, and that's being optimistic. And just because you can't hear something doesn't mean it's not there. Earbuds are a different deal but mixing on either one of these options isn't gonna get consistent results (with maybe the exception of the $999 Ultimate Ears Reference Monitors). Also just having a nice set of monitors is only part of the issue. You also need the room they're in to be treated to really get a good picture of what's going on in your mix. However you can train yourself to overcome some of this.

 

Essentially it goes like this. Listen to a bunch of music on your monitors. Start to mix your track. Occasionally take a break and listen to the other music again. Compare what your mix has and what the other tracks have. Once your happy make a copy of it to a CD. Go listen on a lot of different systems. Car speakers, boom boxes, ipods, computers, live sound PA's. Now compare what you hear in these systems. Is it bassy in all of them or is there a lack of bass? (and remember some speakers just don't put out much bass). If your mix has too much bass your room may have some nodes that are masking the true mix. Now is the mix dull and lifeless? You have too many highs in your monitoring chain. Or does the mix have too much highs? Then you monitoring chain is too dull. Make adjustments, treat the room more and try again. Eventually your mixes start to translate. Yeah the computer mix sounds boxy and lacks bass, but all the parts are there. The car mix may be a bit boomy, but you do have the bass turned up on don't you. . The bose wave radio really sounds quite nice. Almost too nice somehow, but definitely smooth. You pump it through a PA and it sounds pretty stinking huge. That is a good mix. At least technically. Emotionally is a whole nother story lol.

[Zooey]

IT BEGINS AGAIN.

[Cirrus]

 

IT BEGINS AGAIN.

 

 

exactly

[UstadKhanAli]

Exactly exactly.

[gdoubleyou]

 

Exactly exactly.

 

 

Yep, exactly!!

[chugheshc2]

Exactly X3.

I was hoping for some entertainment today, looks like I won the lottery.

Cheers

C>

[UstadKhanAli]

Walters, my stereo mixes sound different in my car than they do on my MP3 sized headphones.

 

A Professional CD record you can playback on any device and it will sound good out of car stereos or or MP3 sized headphones.

 

How Can I do this like they do it?

[Zooey]

 

What can I do to make this the "Same" for every headphones and exterenal computer speakers? My External Computer Speakers The Stereo mixes sound really bad out of them The Spreads of panning is different No bass or body What can I do to make these better?

 

 

That's a very good question, but it could be a number of things. Could you post a link to one of your mixes so we can hear it?

[EerieDreamZ]

hehehe yes exactly indeed like the zep beatles white album flange during nixon speakers era

[Phil O'Keefe]

But my studio monitors speakers are 10" inches my computer speakers are 1" inch my MP3 headphones are the size of a dime If you mix/master to studio monitors speakers that are 10" inches , the mix,mastering is not going to sound good with speakers that are 1" inch or a size of a dime

 

The idea of getting a mix to "translate" across a variety of playback systems is a good one IMO, and of course, every engineer is going to have their own idea of exactly what that means. To me, it means that the song gets across, regardless of playback system. If it's an essential, main and / or featured element of the song - the lead, the main riff, the vocal, the rhythm and the hook - then that needs to come across, even on a bandwidth limited playback system. If you can get the main elements across on a pair of laptop speakers, you're doing well - you can probably forget about "feeling" any deep bass, but if you EQ your bass right, and your mix right (EQs are often interactive between instruments in a mix) you should still be able to tell what the bass line is, and hear the kick hits, even on those cruddy speakers. The idea is that a "kick" is more than just a 60-80Hz fundamental, it's also got elements above that - especially the attack in the 2.5-4kHz region. If that's there in your mix, your listener will still "hear the kick", but not "feel" the kick. The limitation of the ipod and laptop speakers are the cause of that, and not any flaw in your mix. But if you're relying entirely on the 70Hz range for a "fat kick" sound, then on a system where the speakers died off below 100Hz, you're suddenly not going to "hear" the kick anymore.

 

Don't expect a mix to sound the same on cans as it does on decent studio monitors, or in your car or on your ipod. We've already explained why headphones and speakers sound different (stereo perception, isolation and lack of crosstalk between the ears, etc.), and I won't repeat myself and bore you. The goal isn't to make it sound "the same" on all of those systems; IMO, the goal is to try to make the mix sound consistent from playback system to playback system. You need to take the known characteristics of each of those playback systems into account when making the comparisons. Laptop speakers have no low frequency response. Don't expect any low frequency response in your mixes on laptop speakers. The various speakers and playback systems themselves don't sound the same, so obviously it's impossible to get something to sound identical across all of them. But you want it to come across evenly on a variety of systems, and good and consistent with the limitations (or capabilities) of the particular system and room you're playing it back on and in.