Tuners

[mbengs1]

I use the tuner on my Boss BR-800 to tune my guitar before i record. It does an ok job,chords sound in tune but i find when I play octaves on the D and B and the G and E string, it is not in tune. I have to make the B and E a little flat so I can do ocatves on those strings. Does anyone else have a similar problem with their tuner?

[mrbrown49]

Sounds like you have more of an issue with intonation or playing technique.

[WRGKMC]

Yup. You have a setup issue. It can be a combination of fret wear, string height, Nut height, relief and or intonation.

it can even be the type of strings you use because different brands will flex differently.

 

Keep in mind however, even with proper intonation you may still have some sharpness above the 12th fret. Guitars are not perfect pitch instruments. The frets are flat and the best you can expect is the instrument to play relatively in/out of tune over the entire fret board. Its not uncommon to have to tweak the tuning to get different chords to play in tune, so you compromise.

 

One trick that can help. When doing intonation, instead of holding down a single string at the 12th fret, barre the entire 12th fret with your first finger.

What this does is add the same string tension you'd get when you play chords. You'll likely find your strings a tad sharper compared to holding the strings down with a single finger so when you adjust intonation you'll correct the strings that are sharp when playing chords.

[1001gear]

For the third time:

 

 

 

Use a strobe tuner. At least the tuning indicator is precise. Also The Peterson has the Buzz Feiten offsets as well as custom offsets and tunings. The cheaper pedal sized ones as well as other brands may have similar features - I forget.

 

[Bucksstudent]

Well, you see, if your guitar doesn't have perfect pitch anymore, it never will again. If you have to have it perfect, might as well throw it out and buy a new one. Soon, it won't even let you tune to standard anymore. Your strings will melt off like the dude from that one Indiana Jones movie.

[1001gear]

 

 

 

 

 

[WRGKMC]

Both Buzz Fieten and Earvana nut systems are both scams for a couple of reasons.

 

I used them for 2 years and even had Buzz Feiten contact me asking if I wanted to certify as being an installer.

 

The systems are only going to work for open strings. Once you fret a note you're dealing with a straight frets so the nut no longer is being used.

 

Buzz Feiten is the worst of the two because its an irreversible mod. If you don't like the results or discover its flaws like I did, you're stuck with it. You'd have to replace the fret board that was shortened during the installation process to go back to using a standard nut.

 

The only system that gets rid of the tuning variances between frets is to abandon using straight frets and use a True temperament fret system.

http://www.truetemperament.com/

 

Both the nut and fret systems will get you closer to the tuning a piano uses. That's fine if you only perform along with a piano, or multitrack your instrument with itself.

 

The BIG problem I discovered is trying to get one of these compensated systems to play in tune with a standard guitar or bass.

Sure you can say you have perfect intonation, but how the hell do you get the other musicians you perform with you in the same tuning?

 

You see there is a tuning/intonation standard issues involved here. Unless everyone adopts these systems so everyone uses a Buzz, Earvana or True temperament system, it doesn't matter if your instrument is in perfect itch because you'll still be out of pitch with every other guitarist using a standard setup. It doesn't matter if the string beating is caused by the perfect pitch or the standard pitch, the string beating that occurs when two string on two different instruments are off by several cents will still occur.

 

Every recording you play along with when using these systems will be out of tune because you're using perfect pitch and those recordings weren't.

Every other player you play with will be slightly out of pitch and clash no matter how hard you try and tune them to unison.

 

Again, you could multitrack OK (been there and done it) You can match the pitches of a keyboard. Bass is a problem however because it will have a flat fret straight nut system.

 

Believe me I jacked with those nuts for years and I eventually got fed up. I pulled them off the 4 guitars I had them on, installed brass nuts and have never been happier. Yes the instruments are slightly out here and there but one guitar can match another and also match the bass. Having slight variances in pitch aren't that big a deal, and besides human ears are trained to expect that.

 

I've been cursed with the perfect pitch I developed playing fretless Violins. As a young guitarist I could ignore the minor variances but as I became more experienced the variances drove me crazy. I still to this day pull on my strings lengthwise to bring them into pitch when playing certain chords and leads. I don't even think about it half the time, its just something you do as a player. I also use super jumbo frets and lighter strings which makes this easier to accomplish.

 

Back in the day I thought it was an instrument problem so I learned to tweak instruments to perfection. Having a good tuner does help. Those new TC Polytune tuners are one of the best I've come across lately. I have a strobe tuner which I also use but it can be tough to use because it picks up everything and getting a steady reading can be very difficult. The polytune does a great job focusing on the note and ignoring oddball harmonics and resonance that can throw the tuning off. Its also got extreme accuracy - Compare the specs. Most budget tuners can be off by u to 1 cent or more. The Polytune is 1/1000 accuracy which is as good as my strobe tuner.

 

Unfortunately its a dead end focusing on perfect pitch from the instrument and no matter how good the setup is you have to compromise. Heck even the temperature of the strings going from room temperature to the temp of your skin can be 20 degrees and throw the strings off two or three cents, so it becomes a futile effort trying to obtain perfection beyond a certain point because the instruments design is flawed and there isn't anything you can do about it. If you have a hard time dealing with it then he only option is to find a different instrument with fixed pitches to play.

[badpenguin]

It's NOT the tuner.

it's NOT the tuners on the guitars.

it's your INTONATION.

 

how hard was that? :drops mic:

[Chris Loeffler]

Everything above is true.

 

Even with a properly intonated guitar and a Strobostomp, I found myself cringing whenever I played with my friends, because THEY were out of tune/intonation, and it was actually easier to match their "imperfection" than it was to try to get their improperly setup guitars (and heavy-handed technique) to get "right".

 

Music isn't perfect :-)