Members wfranklin Posted January 20, 2006 Members Share Posted January 20, 2006 Originally posted by Auggie Doggie 'Passive exercise in white supremacy'? I sincerely hope you don't actually believe that.If you're looking for a 'style vs style' conflict in the movie, it wasn't classical vs blues, but classical vs hard rock. More specifically, it was the discipline of classical vs. the flash and fireworks of hard rock, with the former obviously winning out. i never said i believed it, im just saying the connection could be concocted. i recall reading something about that angle of the movie, certainly something to keep in mind but isn't neccesarily true. just throwing it out there, food for thought you know. i say crossroads is an abomination because it was just a bad movie, hehe. but that's immaterial. the point i was making is that crossroads doesnt really help either side of the shred debate. a previous poster put forth something about a guy starting on a 20 dollar guitar in a world engulfed in racism and used crossroads to butress his point. i was pointing out the unreliability of crossroads as a support for an argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Auggie Doggie Posted January 20, 2006 Members Share Posted January 20, 2006 Originally posted by wfranklin i say crossroads is an abomination because it was just a bad movie, hehe. but that's immaterial. It had some great guitar playing AND Jami Gertz going about indecent in the loft.It wasn't a total loss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Uma Floresta Posted January 20, 2006 Members Share Posted January 20, 2006 Here's a thought: Can shred be properly played without any effects? I mean, you can play an old stones song or a bob dylan song on an acoustic guitar or a clean electric. But what would shred sound like on either of those? If it wouldn't sound good, the comparisons to virtuoso violinists are moot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Alchemist Posted January 20, 2006 Members Share Posted January 20, 2006 Originally posted by Uma Floresta Here's a thought: Can shred be properly played without any effects? I mean, you can play an old stones song or a bob dylan song on an acoustic guitar or a clean electric. But what would shred sound like on either of those? If it wouldn't sound good, the comparisons to virtuoso violinists are moot. I write all my "shred" (though I refer to it as fast neoclassical) songs on acoustic and they sound just fine:wave: I guess it doesnt sound too shabby, theres this one player, hes a nobody really but hes been getting by ok playing pretty fast on acoustic... some guy named Al DiMaeola, thats it I think:rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Uma Floresta Posted January 20, 2006 Members Share Posted January 20, 2006 Originally posted by Alchemist I write all my "shred" (though I refer to it as fast neoclassical) songs on acoustic and they sound just fine:wave: I guess it doesnt sound too shabby, theres this one player, hes a nobody really but hes been getting by ok playing pretty fast on acoustic... some guy named Al DiMaeola, thats it I think:rolleyes: Yeah, but fast isn't necessarily shred. Surf music is fast. I'm not even sure what kind of point I was making. LOL I'm tired. Whatever, listen to what makes you happy, what do I care? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members AJ6stringsting Posted January 21, 2006 Members Share Posted January 21, 2006 Man, it's so great tearing and burning up that fretboard, but it's even just as satisfying as playing those magic melodic phrases that just make your heart go thump thump:love:.......dynamics, feel, soul....what ever you call it, it all speaks equally in my book of playing:thu: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members AJ6stringsting Posted January 21, 2006 Members Share Posted January 21, 2006 Man, it's so great tearing and burning up that fretboard, but it's even just as satisfying as playing those magic melodic phrases that just make your heart go thump thump:love:.......dynamics, feel, soul....what ever you call it, it all speaks equally in my book of playing:thu: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ronaldo Posted January 21, 2006 Members Share Posted January 21, 2006 Originally posted by Alchemist A player that has practiced long and hard enough to shred comfortably, essentialy has no limits to what he can play. Being able to have that much control, speed and accuracy is very beneficial for a player. You can take those skills and use them to play any genre of music, doesnt have to be fast. However if you only focus on simple things you may find your skills lacking if you have to tackle a tougher song. To those that find it necesary to bash shredders; if you only want to play simpler music, thats fine, but dont take it out on those who worked very hard to get to where they are on guitar. As well, dont pretend that you are somehow superior because you are in tune with "tone and more feeling"... because its fairly obvious that those who spent years upon years practicing daily, going through scales, runs, techniques have a great deal of love for guitar and thats why they wanted to take it as far as they could. I spent a good 5 years just shredding, working on techniques, scales etc. Sure at that time I was somewhat stylisticaly limited, but it has helped me become a better guitar player, and I play all styles now. So do a lot of guys that get pegged only as "shredders", so all this hate that goes towards them, insisting they have "no feeling" is just BS in my book, and quite insulting to those who worked so hard to get to where they are. I am willing to bet that if any of these shredders got a chance to record a pure blues tune, and you heard it without knowing who they are, you would rave about how great it was, and how much feeling the player had. This is such a classic! Shred is not a style of music. It is a thing certain spandex/bad hair cheeseballs do on the guitar and it has always had a very limited appeal (to say the least). Is it hard to do? That's debatable. But it's not debatable that hard can only have meaning in the sense of trained monkey hard. Seriously, who has ever pointed to a guitar shred composition that's in any way noteworthy for it's musical merits?To say you can use shred skills for any genre of music is just preposterous. Take a typical forum shredder, say doggie, and see if he can even play any song in guitar for dummies. The answer is no. He can no more do that than alchemist can use his shred "skills" to play hawaiian slack key. Neither of them can play a classical song if it has two melodies at once because, like almost every last 'highly' 'skilled' shredderators, they have little if any capabilities without a pick.This is so typical. But it doesn't stop them from nearly breaking an arm patting themselves on the back for their so called (... self-proclaimed) musical "talent" and "dedication" ... I love that ! Making good music is a real talent. To even say a shredder is making music at all is highly debatable. You practically have to be an archeologist to find out it still exists in the first place ! I wonder why that could be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ronaldo Posted January 21, 2006 Members Share Posted January 21, 2006 Originally posted by jjpistols it's a fact Steve Vai is the John Stamos of guitar it's a fact john stamos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Alchemist Posted January 21, 2006 Members Share Posted January 21, 2006 Originally posted by Ronaldo This is such a classic! Shred is not a style of music. It is a thing certain spandex/bad hair cheeseballs do on the guitar and it has always had a very limited appeal (to say the least). Is it hard to do? That's debatable. But it's not debatable that hard can only have meaning in the sense of trained monkey hard. Seriously, who has ever pointed to a guitar shred composition that's in any way noteworthy for it's musical merits? To say you can use shred skills for any genre of music is just preposterous. Take a typical forum shredder, say doggie, and see if he can even play any song in guitar for dummies. The answer is no. He can no more do that than alchemist can use his shred "skills" to play hawaiian slack key. Neither of them can play a classical song if it has two melodies at once because, like almost every last 'highly' 'skilled' shredderators, they have little if any capabilities without a pick. This is so typical. But it doesn't stop them from nearly breaking an arm patting themselves on the back for their so called (... self-proclaimed) musical "talent" and "dedication" ... I love that ! Making good music is a real talent. To even say a shredder is making music at all is highly debatable. You practically have to be an archeologist to find out it still exists in the first place ! I wonder why that could be? Wow, not only are you yourself obviously a master songwriter, yet you have psychic abilities which have been able to determine what other people play like and then use that to make big sweeping generalizations and insulting comments about their character. You sir are a true gentleman. Please point me to where I am patting myself on the back? Or to where you would believe I cannot play without a pick (I play a bit of classical guitar, would be hard to do so with a pick I suppose, but I trust your innate insticts and brilliance, so I suppose you are right).I suppose you are also correct, in that the ability to play passages both quickly and cleanly has no use in most genres of music. What a waste of time it has been working on that aspect of playing.Yes making good music is a true talent. Its directly related to how creative you are, which is in no way linked to how fast or slow you play, or how much feel or soul you believe playing within those bounds endows you. Being able to play fast when needed gives you more options when writing your songs, whats wrong with more options? Is it an insult to the songwriting paradigms you have imposed upon yourself? Shred is just a broad term refering to playing fast neoclassical, rock, heck even country. You dont have to like it, thats why there are many genres of music out there, to please everybody. There is also no need to insult it, or those who enjoy it simply because you dont like it. That sir is what makes you a jackass, now stand up and take a bow:wave: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members L6Sguy Posted January 21, 2006 Members Share Posted January 21, 2006 Originally posted by Ronaldo This is such a classic! Shred is not a style of music. It is a thing certain spandex/bad hair cheeseballs do on the guitar and it has always had a very limited appeal (to say the least)........ it was one of the greatest musical moments ever. Alvin Lee & Ten Years After. jamming away at Woodstock, 1969. all wearing hot pink & turquoise spandex, and shiny rhinestone boots. hair piled high in a shiny tower of AquaNet. rouge and eyeshadow applied just right. and god, their mascara rocked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Knottyhed Posted January 21, 2006 Author Members Share Posted January 21, 2006 Originally posted by Ronaldo This is such a classic! Shred is not a style of music. It is a thing certain spandex/bad hair cheeseballs do on the guitar and it has always had a very limited appeal (to say the least). Is it hard to do? That's debatable. But it's not debatable that hard can only have meaning in the sense of trained monkey hard. Seriously, who has ever pointed to a guitar shred composition that's in any way noteworthy for it's musical merits? No shred isn't a style of music, it's the ability to play quickly, cleanly, up and down the fret board. To sweep pick, tap etc. It takes *alot* of practice to master all these techniques and incorporate them into your playing - as regarding noteworthy compositions I think you'll find there's plenty of compositions on these forums that are regularly pointed to. Instrumental guitar music is a niche market, but that doesn't mean it lacks musical merit, anymore than the mass appeal of a manufactured boy band makes their music noteworthy. Originally posted by Ronaldo To say you can use shred skills for any genre of music is just preposterous. Take a typical forum shredder, say doggie, and see if he can even play any song in guitar for dummies. The answer is no. He can no more do that than alchemist can use his shred "skills" to play hawaiian slack key. Neither of them can play a classical song if it has two melodies at once because, like almost every last 'highly' 'skilled' shredderators, they have little if any capabilities without a pick. Why is it preposterous? how can knowing music theory, having a high level of skill and an inate knowledge of the fretboard be detrimental in any style of guitar music. As for not using a pick, most people who shred (myself included) as also very good at rythmn, can chicken pick comfortably and very often dabble in classical guitar. Rhandy Rhodes and Bret Garsed are two well known shredders who studied classical guitar that instantly spring to mind. Originally posted by Ronaldo Making good music is a real talent. To even say a shredder is making music at all is highly debatable. You practically have to be an archeologist to find out it still exists in the first place ! I wonder why that could be? I wonder why the Spice Girls were so popular? Is it because of the quality of the music?! Yes making good music is a real talent - perhaps you should go listen to the likes of Greg Howe, Bret Garsed, Eric Johnson and then come and debate about good instrumental guitar music. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Knottyhed Posted January 21, 2006 Author Members Share Posted January 21, 2006 (Duplicate) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Uma Floresta Posted January 21, 2006 Members Share Posted January 21, 2006 One idea that has been put forth by a lot of artists is that the more technical knowledge you have, the harder it is to be really creative. Like, once you learn all this theory and technique, you're kind of trapped within it, and you'll never do something really unique. Kind of the difference between feeling and thinking. I think there's probably a happy medium there, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Auggie Doggie Posted January 21, 2006 Members Share Posted January 21, 2006 Originally posted by Alchemist That sir is what makes you a jackass, now stand up and take a bow:wave: He doesn't even play guitar. He's just a bitter troll who lost his girlfriend to someone who COULD play guitar, so he's on an anti-skill crusade several years after the fact.A couple years ago, he trolled and cyberstalked me, and he finally challenged me to a little playing contest. I was originally to choose the piece...once I did, he suddenly changed the 'rules' a few times, finally deciding that we should play a piece from 'Guitar for Dummies' (the one and only guitar book he owned that came with a cd, which he planned to pawn off as his own playing). He never did come up with a clip, even though I rattled off about a half dozen Bach pieces and posted them.He disappeared for about 6 months after that. If that episode wasn't enough, he also went on record saying that forumite Scott Jones isn't anything special when it comes to playing guitar. So, as you're already aware, that joker isn't to be taken seriously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lazaraga Posted January 22, 2006 Members Share Posted January 22, 2006 Originally posted by Uma Floresta I mean, you can play an old stones song or a bob dylan song on an acoustic guitar or a clean electric. But what would shred sound like on either of those? uhh, bluegrass? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members crisis Posted January 23, 2006 Members Share Posted January 23, 2006 Originally posted by adamrobertt Do you honestly believe that every guitar player who dislikes shredding is just jealous of guys who can play fast? You sound like Paris Hilton... "Hey Paris, you're a dumb slut!" "You're just jealous!" "No...you're a dumb slut...":freak: No. I honestly think that those who whine about guys who shred are though. And I also feel the same way about those who get on the Paris hating bandwagon too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members crisis Posted January 23, 2006 Members Share Posted January 23, 2006 Originally posted by Rick 381 Troll says,I wasted a lot of time learned how to play some scales as fast as possible and anyone who didn't waste as much time as I did learning to put 9,000 notes where 9 will do will never be any good as a guitar player as I am.Yawn, boring.There's a hundred great non-shredder players for every great shredder you can name.Chet Atkins- never shreddedLes Paul- never shreddedDjango Rienhart- never shreddedJoe Pass - never shreddedOnly a moron or a troll would say you can't be a great player if you can't shred.Which one are you? Yngwie J. MalmsteenShawn LaneFrank GambaleJoe SatrianiJohn PetrucciSteve VaiMichael Angelo BatioChris ImpellitteriPaul GilbertJoe StumpTony MacAlpineMarty FriendmanRandy RhodesGary MooreAlan HoldsworthJoe TaffolaVivian Campbell That would be 1700 non shredders then. Actually by learning how to play as fast as possible meant that you spent a lot of time practicing which has to be a good thing. You can now choose exactly what to play fast or slow. I am jealous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members AJ6stringsting Posted January 23, 2006 Members Share Posted January 23, 2006 Originally posted by Ronaldo This is such a classic! Shred is not a style of music. It is a thing certain spandex/bad hair cheeseballs do on the guitar and it has always had a very limited appeal (to say the least). Is it hard to do? That's debatable. But it's not debatable that hard can only have meaning in the sense of trained monkey hard. Seriously, who has ever pointed to a guitar shred composition that's in any way noteworthy for it's musical merits? To say you can use shred skills for any genre of music is just preposterous. Take a typical forum shredder, say doggie, and see if he can even play any song in guitar for dummies. The answer is no. He can no more do that than alchemist can use his shred "skills" to play hawaiian slack key. Neither of them can play a classical song if it has two melodies at once because, like almost every last 'highly' 'skilled' shredderators, they have little if any capabilities without a pick. This is so typical. But it doesn't stop them from nearly breaking an arm patting themselves on the back for their so called (... self-proclaimed) musical "talent" and "dedication" ... I love that ! Making good music is a real talent. To even say a shredder is making music at all is highly debatable. You practically have to be an archeologist to find out it still exists in the first place ! I wonder why that could be? I play Classical guitar with my fingers and can shred like Yngwie. Seems like people of limited technique feel jealous .......kinda like penis envy.I've studied Classical guitar under Juan Serrano and others. Don't hate us shredders because we can do things you can't....just practice and stop whinning. I bet I can play with more feel than you then play a million notes a second too, i got so many options to use .......do you........get a life inferior idiot! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Uma Floresta Posted January 23, 2006 Members Share Posted January 23, 2006 See, there you go, you said "penis envy." Guitar is not a contest. Guitar is not about whose dick is bigger. It's about music. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Uma Floresta Posted June 21, 2011 Members Share Posted June 21, 2011 Shred basher? I don't even know her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BillyCorgan Posted June 21, 2011 Members Share Posted June 21, 2011 Shred bores me to tears. I'd much rather hear a well written song than some dude wanking his uber pwnage leads all night while his jockstrap gets tighter from the dong swelling.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DaleH Posted June 21, 2011 Members Share Posted June 21, 2011 This thread is older than shred....shred is dead.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members IbanezJon Posted June 21, 2011 Members Share Posted June 21, 2011 Music and different music styles weren't made to win arguements on internet guitar forums. The second you intellectualise it, the magic is lost. It becomes like religion.. "mine is better then yours because of x y and z". Sort of like music politics, you must do this but you can't do this because that's not this or this. I can't explain why I like RHCP but I do. I look at a riff like in Scar Tissue and I can't understand how it can work so well but it does. I can't explain why I like Satriani but I do. I can't explain why it works but it does. Music isn't about styles it's about songs and they either work for you or they don't.. And nothing else matters.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RaVenCAD Posted June 21, 2011 Members Share Posted June 21, 2011 Holy welcome to 2011 Batman! Shred sucks, but good hot guitar solos are awesome.. (solos occur and fit WITHIN the context of a song, shred IS the song.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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