Members MellowMateo Posted January 28, 2011 Members Share Posted January 28, 2011 I cannot for the life of me understand the appeal of Taylor Swift. I could ignore her teenybopper lyrics and songs if she could actually sing well, but she can't. The fact that she is a multiple Grammy winner is embarrassing to both the Grammy's and the music industry as a whole imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sventvkg Posted January 28, 2011 Members Share Posted January 28, 2011 "...how much of a songwriter she is..."Exactly. Love it or hate, she's got great craft. She has a tremendous ability to syncopate lyrics and come up with some very creative catch phrases. Million dollar phrases at that. She's a natural and works hard to be even better. Really. If she doesn't get too distracted by E! Hollywood Etc she'll be writing adult minded themes soon enough. Weak but passable voice with AT (hopefully better with work)Very cute and likableVery talented writer that's hits her target mark way better and naturally than most I disagree that she has much craft. Everyone just about on music row has more craft. Her songs speak to a particular demographic not unlike that Dashboard Confessional guy some years ago. Taylor Swift is Candy and is a product but she's got a sunset. Good for her for taking it much further that almost anyone else on her limited Talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Vito Corleone Posted January 28, 2011 Members Share Posted January 28, 2011 Taylor Swift is Candy and is a product but she's got a sunset.. I think that remains to be seen. Yes she speaks to a particular demographic. Will her songs mature as she and her demographic mature? We'll see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members wardjames Posted January 28, 2011 Members Share Posted January 28, 2011 I cannot for the life of me understand the appeal of Taylor Swift. I could ignore her teenybopper lyrics and songs if she could actually sing well, but she can't. The fact that she is a multiple Grammy winner is embarrassing to both the Grammy's and the music industry as a whole imo. Pretty simple in terms of appeal. There's not a better act who combines (1) putting the emotions of pre-teen and teenage girls down in song that appeals to those audiences and (2) does so in a way that appeals to the satisfaction of their parents, who ultimately cut the check for the CDs and concerts. In the demographic she serves, song content and image are key, having a singing voice is far down the list. I suppose Christina Aguilara has 10x the singing voice and Lady Gaga has 10x the songwriting and composing ability, but given that young kids tend to emulate celebrities, do I want my daughter emulating someone like Taylor Swift or Christina Aguilar/Lady Gaga. Pretty simple choice if you're a responsible parent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MellowMateo Posted January 28, 2011 Members Share Posted January 28, 2011 Pretty simple in terms of appeal. There's not a better act who combines (1) putting the emotions of pre-teen and teenage girls down in song that appeals to those audiences and (2) does so in a way that appeals to the satisfaction of their parents, who ultimately cut the check for the CDs and concerts.In the demographic she serves, song content and image are key, having a singing voice is far down the list. I suppose Christina Aguilara has 10x the singing voice and Lady Gaga has 10x the songwriting and composing ability, but given that young kids tend to emulate celebrities, do I want my daughter emulating someone like Taylor Swift or Christina Aguilar/Lady Gaga. Pretty simple choice if you're a responsible parent. While I do agree with you that she is a better role model for kids than either of your other two examples, she's not exactly a great role model. She obviously sleeps around at a relatively young age, mostly with celebrities who are much older than she is, and then when they drop her like a bad habit (see Gyllenhaal, Mayer, Jonas, etc.) she plays the "woe is me card" and writes another cheesy breakup song that all but names the guy who supposedly did her wrong. It was cute at first, but it has gotten tired. Now, I don't want to even pretend to know what goes on behind closed doors, but the common denominator in all of these situations/breakups is her. Either she's a pain in the ass to be with and that's why she keeps getting dumped, or she needs to stop dating/sleeping with celebrities who take advantage of her. I also think her airing her dirty laundry the way she does is in poor taste, even spiteful. Yes, music is supposed to come from real emotion and real life experiences, but she could do it in a tactful way and not basically come out and say "John Mayer told me he loved me, slept with me, and then dumped me" in her songs. I essentially see her music as tabloid articles that appeal to said preteens who want to know what being in a relationship with a celebrity is like. Well, obviously she hasn't been involved in any healthy relationships, and considering that's all she "writes" about, she could be teaching young girls how to devalue themselves and be taken advantage of. Regardless, I don't think any musician/artist should be a role model for kids; parents should be. Most musicians are quite messed up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Vito Corleone Posted January 28, 2011 Members Share Posted January 28, 2011 While I do agree with you she is a better role model for kids than either of your other two examples, she's not exactly a great role model. She obviously sleeps around at a relatively young, mostly with celebrities who are much older, and then when they drop her like a bad habit (see Gyllenhaal, Mayer, Jonas, etc.) she plays the "woe is me/heartbroken card" and writes another cheesy breakup song that all but names the guy who supposedly "did her wrong". It was cute at first, but it has gotten tired. Now, I don't want to even pretend to know what goes on behind closed doors, but the common denominator in all of these situations/breakups is her. Either she's a pain in the ass to be with and that's why she keeps getting dumped, or she needs to stop dating/sleeping with celebrities who take advantage of her. I also think her airing her dirty laundry the way she does is in poor taste, even spiteful. Yes, music is supposed to come from real emotion and real life experiences, but she could do it in a tactful way and not basically come out and say "John Mayer told me he loved me, slept with me, and then dumped me" in her songs. I essentially see her music as tabloid articles. Regardless, I don't think any musician/artist should be a role model for kids; parents should be. Most musicians are quite messed up. Role-model issues aside, if John Mayer or any other male writes a "you bitch!" song about a girl who did them wrong it's considered cool. If Taylor Swift does it it's considered spiteful and in poor taste? Hmmm and hmmmm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MellowMateo Posted January 28, 2011 Members Share Posted January 28, 2011 Role-model issues aside, if John Mayer or any other male writes a "you bitch!" song about a girl who did them wrong it's considered cool. If Taylor Swift does it it's considered spiteful and in poor taste? Hmmm and hmmmm. Let's be careful now as that seems to be an overly general statement. I'll certainly admit that overall the relationships of men and women (especially celebrities) are viewed differently, and usually women are unfairly ridiculed. (i.e. The old cliche that a guy who sleeps around is a pimp and a girl who sleeps around is a slut.) However, for the most part Mayer hasn't been as explicit about which songs are about who and a lot of the time the lyrics are much more vague than Swift's. Taylor on the other hand has a song called "Dear John"...not hard to connect the dots. I'm not saying this is the rule, as Mayer has obviously run his mouth at length about his sexual encounters, but even he came out and admitted it was in poor taste. It just seems to me that her entire career is based on sympathy. Hell, look at how her career blew up after the Kanye West encounter. Don't get me wrong, what he did was ridiculous, but does she deserve to win multiple Grammy's and receive all of these accolades simply for being embarrassed? If that were the case, we'd all be famous. Then add the fact that it seems every breakup she's ever had has been broadcast in a song and I just think it's tired and formulaic. It doesn't feel genuine anymore. More like..."uh oh, Swift just had another breakup, so and so better look out 'cause I'm sure a new song about him is coming." Maybe that's the media's fault for their incessant coverage of celebrity social lives. Maybe I'm just bitter that someone with such an obvious talent deficiency (imo) can win the music industry's highest honor. I have nothing against Swift as a person. She seems very genuine and downright nice, but I guess I just can't stand how huge she has gotten from truly mediocre music (imo), which I guess is more of a commentary on the music industry than Swift herself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Vito Corleone Posted January 28, 2011 Members Share Posted January 28, 2011 It just seems to me that her entire career is based on sympathy. Hell, look at how her career blew up after the Kanye West encounter. Yeah, that's her schtick, basically. Her audience is young girls who relate to her lyrics---girls who are heartbroken and lying on their bed in their room and want to play something that makes them feel better because somebody else gets and expresses what they are going through. How is that any different than what Hank Williams or George Jones or any other of the dozens/hundreds of "woe is me" songwriters over the years? Don't get me wrong, what he did was ridiculous, but does she deserve to win multiple Grammy's and receive all of these accolades simply for being embarrassed? If that were the case, we'd all be famous. Put your embarrassment into a song and make it a hit and you might deserve to be famous too. She seems very genuine and downright nice, but I guess I just can't stand how huge she has gotten from truly (imo) mediocre music, which I guess is more of a commentary on the music industry and not Swift herself. When has music aimed at teens NOT be mediocre on a compositional level? By definition, it pretty much NEEDS to be mediocre to be successful, doesn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MellowMateo Posted January 28, 2011 Members Share Posted January 28, 2011 Yeah, that's her schtick, basically. Her audience is young girls who relate to her lyrics---girls who are heartbroken and lying on their bed in their room and want to play something that makes them feel better because somebody else gets and expresses what they are going through. How is that any different than what Hank Williams or George Jones or any other of the dozens/hundreds of "woe is me" songwriters over the years? Put your embarrassment into a song and make it a hit and you might deserve to be famous too.When has music aimed at teens NOT be mediocre on a compositional level? By definition, it pretty much NEEDS to be mediocre to be successful, doesn't it? Touche, sir. You are right on most of your points. Her music isn't really all that different from the "woe is me" songwriters like Townes Van Zandt, Hank Williams, and the like, just on a slightly less mature level, but again, as you pointed out that's mainly due to the demographic she's targeting. I guess I can't hate on her for that. And yes, music aimed at teens is born from the lowest common denominator and is generally mediocre on a compositional level. However, I think it's a lot more difficult to get famous than just "putting your embarrassment into a song" and hoping to get noticed. Isn't her Dad a big whig in the music industry and basically ponied up a ton of money to get her signed and promoted? And as far as "deserving to be famous", that's pretty subjective. How does one decide who deserves to be famous? Not that I'm insinuating anyone would even want to be famous. I know I wouldn't want the level of fame she has to where her every word and move is scrutinized, but I'll take the success that comes with it, that's for sure. I think this all boils down to my distaste for the music industry in general, and she just seems to be the biggest example right now. So I'll freely admit that my distaste for her may be misguided, but I stand by it! Haha! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Vito Corleone Posted January 28, 2011 Members Share Posted January 28, 2011 However, I think it's a lot more difficult to get famous than just "putting your embarrassment into a song" and hoping to get noticed. I agree it IS more difficult. That was my point, actually. Obviously she's doing something more than just writing a simple song. Isn't her Dad a big whig in the music industry and basically ponied up a ton of money to get her signed and promoted? I don't believe her parents had anything to do with it beyond taking her to Nashville so she could knock on doors when she was young. At least that's the "story". (All I really know about her is a TV "documentary" I saw about her. Who knows how true any of that stuff actually is?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members wardjames Posted January 28, 2011 Members Share Posted January 28, 2011 While I do agree with you that she is a better role model for kids than either of your other two examples, she's not exactly a great role model. She obviously sleeps around at a relatively young age, mostly with celebrities who are much older than she is, and then when they drop her like a bad habit (see Gyllenhaal, Mayer, Jonas, etc.) she plays the "woe is me card" and writes another cheesy breakup song that all but names the guy who supposedly did her wrong. It was cute at first, but it has gotten tired.Now, I don't want to even pretend to know what goes on behind closed doors, but the common denominator in all of these situations/breakups is her. Either she's a pain in the ass to be with and that's why she keeps getting dumped, or she needs to stop dating/sleeping with celebrities who take advantage of her. I also think her airing her dirty laundry the way she does is in poor taste, even spiteful. Yes, music is supposed to come from real emotion and real life experiences, but she could do it in a tactful way and not basically come out and say "John Mayer told me he loved me, slept with me, and then dumped me" in her songs. I essentially see her music as tabloid articles that appeal to said preteens who want to know what being in a relationship with a celebrity is like. Well, obviously she hasn't been involved in any healthy relationships, and considering that's all she "writes" about, she could be teaching young girls how to devalue themselves and be taken advantage of. Regardless, I don't think any musician/artist should be a role model for kids; parents should be. Most musicians are quite messed up. I certainly don't think she's overly promiscious to the point of being a bad role model. But the greater point is that her image in teenage girls minds and in my mind as a father is the key to her success. Hopefully her reaction to her love life struggles will encourage girls to pick up a guitar and write songs instead of turning to drinking, drugs, and all the other possible negative activities out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MellowMateo Posted January 29, 2011 Members Share Posted January 29, 2011 Very good point, ward. Never actually thought of it that way. Putting your troubles into a song is a much healthier reaction to heartache than turning to substance abuse or promiscuity, and it has certainly given us some timeless songs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ido1957 Posted January 29, 2011 Members Share Posted January 29, 2011 Will she be like Avril or like Jessica? Only time will tell..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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