Members kuniklo Posted October 25, 2007 Members Share Posted October 25, 2007 but also for mixing multiple electronic sounds together that would compete in the low and low-midrange of the frequency spectrum......... Good point. I use HP for this all the time too. I could EQ instead but it's very handy to have built-in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mrcpro Posted October 25, 2007 Members Share Posted October 25, 2007 I could EQ instead but it's very handy to have built-in. Plus you can key track on HP filter for more fine tuning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members asynchro_nous Posted October 25, 2007 Members Share Posted October 25, 2007 and tie cutoff to LFO for subtle or drastic animated effects that EQ typically can't give you, especially when combined with varying the degree of resonance around the cutoff point........... It will be interesting to hear examples of the workarounds for this sort of stuff that people are doing on the P'08. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mate_stubb Posted October 25, 2007 Members Share Posted October 25, 2007 So pop quiz, hotshot: what poly analogs have BP and HP filters? (No, really, I don't know. VA's and modulars don't count.) Ahem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members carbon111 Posted October 25, 2007 Members Share Posted October 25, 2007 It will be interesting to hear examples of the workarounds for this sort of stuff that people are doing on the P'08. Like Puppy mentioned, you can use narrow pulsewidth waves to sort of simulate HP filtering but, in the end, there's still plenty to do on the P'08! - its easy to focus on what something dosen't do but better to use a machine's strengths. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ElectricPuppy Posted October 25, 2007 Members Share Posted October 25, 2007 Ahem. My envy knows no bounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Purity_Control Posted October 25, 2007 Members Share Posted October 25, 2007 If it had HP and BP, would it still be a Prophet though? And would people really want to pay more for those features? Or would they moan then that it's too expensive? Or that it doesn't have notch too? There ain't no 'perfect' synth:cry: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Purity_Control Posted October 25, 2007 Members Share Posted October 25, 2007 My envy knows no bounds. likewise. some of the most amazing sounds i've ever heard have come from one of those beasties:thu: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ElectricPuppy Posted October 25, 2007 Members Share Posted October 25, 2007 Not to scare you or anything, Mate, but... how're your membrane switches holding up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kuniklo Posted October 25, 2007 Members Share Posted October 25, 2007 If it had HP and BP, would it still be a Prophet though? It has a full mod matrix instead of polymod, and that hasn't stopped us from calling it a Prophet. And would people really want to pay more for those features? Or would they moan then that it's too expensive? Or that it doesn't have notch too? I certainly would. I'd probably be making room for a P08 right now if it had a multimode filter. I'd be willing to pay a couple hundred extra for it. There ain't no 'perfect' synth:cry: Honestly a P08 with a MM filter would cover 95% of what I want in a synth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MuzikB Posted October 25, 2007 Members Share Posted October 25, 2007 How so? I'm sure it's great otherwise but I'm not sure how you fake out an HP filter. DAW's with filter plug-ins, maybe? Not a deal breaker at all here. I mean, how many folks here are going to actually gig with this $2500 synth or at least have a laptop along with them running a DAW? (Live soon to be 7 here) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mrcpro Posted October 26, 2007 Members Share Posted October 26, 2007 The lack of multimodes on this synth doesn't faze me either. To me, it's a traditionally designed polysynth along the lines of a Prophet 5, OB X/Xa/8, Jupiter 8 (yes I know it has highpass, but the way it's implemented can be done outboard), and built for guys like me who want a modern equivalent. From what I've heard, I'm in agreement with the recent Keyboard mag review. It may be the best sounding general purpose analog polysynth ever made. I can't wait to get my hands on one. So Carbon 111, looking over your modulation page... no osc 2 source, like on a Prophet. But... it's available for filter FM at the filter, right? And from the looks of it, you can (if you want) get an LFO to track the keyboard...? And LFOs go way into the audio range...? Any sounds missing from Poly-Mod then? (If this has already been covered in this very long thread, my apologies....) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members raffor Posted October 26, 2007 Members Share Posted October 26, 2007 AndromedaJ6SE Omega 8 & I think CodeProbably others. I'm not really that much of an analog guy. If I had to choose one I'd take a VA with a multimode filter over an analog with only lowpass. Other synths with MultiMode filter are: Matrix-12 / XpanderElka SynthexChroma (as mentioned before)StudioElectronics ATC w/SEM filterMoog VoyagerJomox Sunsyn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members raffor Posted October 26, 2007 Members Share Posted October 26, 2007 So Carbon 111, looking over your modulation page... no osc 2 source, like on a Prophet. But... it's available for filter FM at the filter, right? And from the looks of it, you can (if you want) get an LFO to track the keyboard...? And LFOs go way into the audio range...? Any sounds missing from Poly-Mod then?(If this has already been covered in this very long thread, my apologies....) I tried to tack the LFO on my ION to modulate the Filter (filter FM) but with very unsatisfying results. Not sure if this is replacing pure cross modulation. What is missing?? Where is the audio modulation of the pulse width or do you use a tracking LFO for that too? Also the LFO goes up to approx. 500 Hz only. The ION makes 1000Hz and even that is not sufficient to do real audio modulations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mrcpro Posted October 26, 2007 Members Share Posted October 26, 2007 The review says that there's an Audio Mod knob in the filter section that governs the amount of filter FM, with oscillator 1 the source. I don't think you need an LFO for that one if the LFO doesn't cut it for what you are doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kuniklo Posted October 26, 2007 Members Share Posted October 26, 2007 DAW's with filter plug-ins, maybe? Not really a substitute, since you can't keytrack or modulate. Again though, the lack of an MM filter on this thing isn't a *dealbreaker* for me, but definitely a large minus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MuzikB Posted October 26, 2007 Members Share Posted October 26, 2007 Not really a substitute, since you can't keytrack or modulate.Again though, the lack of an MM filter on this thing isn't a *dealbreaker* for me, but definitely a large minus. But you can automate, which in itself gives you more control than what your 2 hands can handle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kuniklo Posted October 26, 2007 Members Share Posted October 26, 2007 But you can automate, which in itself gives you more control than what your 2 hands can handle. Have we had this conversation before or am I just having a deja vu? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MuzikB Posted October 26, 2007 Members Share Posted October 26, 2007 Have we had this conversation before or am I just having a deja vu? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mate_stubb Posted October 26, 2007 Members Share Posted October 26, 2007 Not to scare you or anything, Mate, but... how're your membrane switches holding up? Fine actually. The Chroma has seen a lot harder use than the Expander, and the switches continue to work fine. I would be more worried about brittle ribbons like you experienced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ElectricPuppy Posted October 26, 2007 Members Share Posted October 26, 2007 Fine actually. The Chroma has seen a lot harder use than the Expander, and the switches continue to work fine. I would be more worried about brittle ribbons like you experienced. That would be my fear, too. Don't move the thing unless you absolutely have to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members raffor Posted October 26, 2007 Members Share Posted October 26, 2007 The review says that there's an Audio Mod knob in the filter section that governs the amount of filter FM, with oscillator 1 the source. I don't think you need an LFO for that one if the LFO doesn't cut it for what you are doing. I compared only using an LFO with tracking to immitate real audio modulation. The ION doesn't have filter FM, the Prohpet doesn't have cross modulation. Matter of the fact is that you cannot replace a real oscillator with an LFO, track it and expect the same results. Neither you cannot just use a thin pulse wave and say that this is replacing a resonant HP filter. It is fact that Dave brought us a budget synth build that can do copy some of the classics. It is not a modern instrument in the way the Andromeda, Omega8, or SunSyn is. These offer specific features that sets them apart from the masses. But then, these synths do not reach the $2k price point either. Still, in this time of age I cannot believe it doesn't even offer midi-multi-mode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members droolmaster0 Posted October 26, 2007 Members Share Posted October 26, 2007 However, the Sunsyn multimode implementation has been complained about for years - it works better than it did originally, but I think you'd find that few use it. In addition, you cannot edit an individual sound completely from multimode, and sounds cannot be saved from multimode. The Omega sounds great, but I'm not sure how it comes out ahead feature wise against the prophet. The multimode is working with the latest os, but hardly worked before that. The mod routings don't compare with the prophet... Even the Sunsyn, while it has a very cool mod matrix with audio rate modulations, doesn't have many of these modulations...one could easily claim that the prophet's mod routings are by far the most complete of these 3 synths. I've never played the prophet, and I can't comment on the sound, but in terms of features, your comments seem rather inaccurate. The Andromeda, of course, has amazing mod routings, but (imo) doesn't have the world's best user interface. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members raffor Posted October 26, 2007 Members Share Posted October 26, 2007 I've never played the prophet, and I can't comment on the sound, but in terms of features, your comments seem rather inaccurate. Not sure what is inaccurate. You just said that all of these synths do have a midi-multi-mode that is - at least at this stage - working. And all of the synths listed above have a something special as well, and a multi-mode filter. If you want to, the Omega8 is the most simple design and probably compares to the Prophet the most. Even you can add different filter types and it has two filter to begin with already. The SunSyn is a very special beast with 4 oscillators, multimode filter with addressing the different poles, hardware envelopes, and audio signals in the mod matrix. The Andromeda has a two filter design with very flexible pre- and post-(filter)mixing and very deep envelope settings besides the 16 voices. I did not say that the feature set of the Prophet08 is something bad, but it has nothing special. Even worse, it lost the Prophet trademark features. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members carbon111 Posted October 26, 2007 Members Share Posted October 26, 2007 I did not say that the feature set of the Prophet08 is something bad, but it has nothing special. Even worse, it lost the Prophet trademark features. LOL! Thanks for the chuckle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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