How to start out with electronics?

[jrcorp]

I want to learn to work with electronics to the point where hopefully I could look at the layout of an amp or pedal and have a decent understanding of what each component or part of a circuit does. My experience so far has included a bad experience in a physics class in high school, wiring up a guitar, and replacing some pots on an amp. With the amount of money spent on amps and effects pedals already, I feel like I could potentially save myself some cash by either messing with what I have or building something from scratch.

 

I wonder if you guys have any resources or tips on how to get started? I have a very basic understanding of how some components work, but I know it's not at all enough to put it to use. I'm confident enough in my learning ability and intelligence that I know I could figure it out. Right now I figure I could either try reading on the subject, getting hands-on, or a combination of both (seems best). I don't mind either - I enjoy reading as long as I can stay at all interested, and I enjoy tinkering as long as I don't feel overwhelmed by a project. I know there's math involved too, which I usually do well with and think I should be able to handle... though in high school I struggled with it for some reason.

 

Let me know what you think?

[Longhair]

How is your soldering skills? Check out Elenco Electronics for some soldering kits. The manuals are very good at covering the basics. I wish all manuals were written to educate like these have been.

 

Make: Electronics book - be sure to get the component kits because it makes doing the experiments a lot easier.

 

Afrotech Tutorials - does a great job at explaining stuff and makes you want to learn more on your own afterwards.

 

Circuit Wizard Standard / Professional Software - best schematic simulation software for someone who does not have the formal training for the more advanced stuff.

 

Also download and print schematics from DIY effect sites (BYOC for example), get some different color highlighter makers and follow the circuits in the schematic. The highlighters help speed up the process of reading schematics easier.

[isaac42]

This is a good place to start: U.S. Navy NEETS Modules.

[jrcorp]

Thanks, I remember skimming the NEETS awhile back for some reason.

 

I want to read and tinker, but I have an aversion to buying kits because I'm afraid of being ripped off for the parts that may cost much less if I bought them elsewhere. I don't think I have the understanding to buy the right parts separately either though. I like the idea of tracing schematics to understand.

 

Thanks again for the links and tips.

[Belva]

 

Thanks, I remember skimming the NEETS awhile back for some reason. I want to read and tinker, but I have an aversion to buying kits because I'm afraid of being ripped off for the parts that may cost much less if I bought them elsewhere. I don't think I have the understanding to buy the right parts separately either though. I like the idea of tracing schematics to understand. Thanks again for the links and tips.

 

I'm in a similar situation as you are. I did complete A&P school which is shorthand for airplane mech training. Electronic principals are taught at this level.

I've considered building from scratch by buying parts separately. Go ahead and do this experiment. Get a list of parts for any given kit. Now add up the cost of buying everything separately. You'll find that most of the time the kits are cheaper because the kit makers get volume discounts and can pass them on while still making money. A quick frinstance: I'm redoing a tele right now and needed knobs and a control plate. I found it cheaper to buy a pre wired plate with knobs, switch and pots rather than just getting the plate and knobs. This same principal applies. Once you've done a bunch of builds your true DIY nature will show itself. Tha means you'll keep every single little thing you swapped out for better quality or sound. Then you'll have this, that and the other thing for a given project. Only then will you find buying individual parts cheaper. But not always.

[Longhair]

 

Thanks, I remember skimming the NEETS awhile back for some reason. I want to read and tinker, but I have an aversion to buying kits because I'm afraid of being ripped off for the parts that may cost much less if I bought them elsewhere. I don't think I have the understanding to buy the right parts separately either though. I like the idea of tracing schematics to understand. Thanks again for the links and tips.

 

 

Buying kits vs. parts separately is not always cheaper. There are those times where one would have to order from 2 or 3 different places and that means more money in shipping charges. What I try to do is plan for a few projects a head of time before ordering parts and I will make sure that I order spares of the most common things (capacitors, resistors, etc.).

 

No name ebay parts are good for doing experiments on the breadboard and making protypes but when it comes to repairing gear and modifying stuff, always go with well known, proven parts.

[goosefartfan]

One other cost of not buying kits is the time lost doing comparison shopping for parts when you might spend two hours saving five bucks. Also, buying from multiple suppliers means multiple minimum shipping costs.

[jrcorp]

Alright, well does anyone have suggestions for places with good kits? I had a few bookmarked before I had to reinstall Windows on my computer. I remember one site that had a first project called the Confidence Booster, which I thought seemed like a good place to start.

 

Hope I don't seem stubborn, all the points made were good and I agree. I'm just super cheap, I guess.

[goosefartfan]

I'm just super cheap, I guess.

 

you're not alone

[Longhair]

BYOC

GEOFEX

Tonepad

MEK UK-Electronic

 

That should get you started.

 

What I normally do is "window shop" - download the schematics of all the different ones I want to make, then figure out if it is cheaper to buy the kit or a bunch of parts. Normally with multiple projects lined up, this seems to be cheaper.

[Casey4s]

I just built one of these lasst week and was really pleased with the outcome. This is an excellent kit with great illustrated instructions, and a great price $215.00. You will need to provide a speaker cabinet of some kind. This is a great kit for the beginner/newbie who has a lump in his throat over a first amp kit selection.

 

http://www.amplifiedparts.com/products/amp_parts/K-MOD102

 

I will post a build write up soon.

[Casey4s]

 

This is a good place to start: U.S. Navy NEETS Modules .

 

 

Nice link, I have a bunch of Army, Navy and Airforce traing manuals, and the Navy's are by far the most comprehensive. (NAVPRS)

 

Thanks

[Oly]

Here's another good link using arduino board.

 

[Wayne2]

 

I want to learn to work with electronics to the point where hopefully I could look at the layout of an amp or pedal and have a decent understanding of what each component or part of a circuit does. My experience so far has included a bad experience in a physics class in high school, wiring up a guitar, and replacing some pots on an amp. With the amount of money spent on amps and effects pedals already, I feel like I could potentially save myself some cash by either messing with what I have or building something from scratch. I wonder if you guys have any resources or tips on how to get started? I have a very basic understanding of how some components work, but I know it's not at all enough to put it to use. I'm confident enough in my learning ability and intelligence that I know I could figure it out. Right now I figure I could either try reading on the subject, getting hands-on, or a combination of both (seems best). I don't mind either - I enjoy reading as long as I can stay at all interested, and I enjoy tinkering as long as I don't feel overwhelmed by a project. I know there's math involved too, which I usually do well with and think I should be able to handle... though in high school I struggled with it for some reason. Let me know what you think?

 

 

If you have some time on your hands, try getting a ham radio license. The theory is similar and you'll meet people. http://www.arrl.org/getting-your-technician-license

[Dekker500]

I found http://sound.westhost.com/ to be very educational and informative for electronics, particularly audio-based projects. It does require some "basics" though.

 

If you want really basic, and don't want it free, play around at http://www.falstad.com/circuit/. It's a browser-based circuit simulator. You can pretty much simulate any circuit you can imagine, but once you get more than a certain complexity, it gets more difficult!

 

Dekker

[Alan Roberts]

A few classes at a local community college might also be a good way to go. Heck, it might come in handy someday in your career, too.

[jrcorp]

Thanks guys. I enjoy working with the electronics even if I tend to mess them up. Right now I'm wiring a guitar and getting it all wrong, ha. But I'm attending the local CC too, and I've thought about trying a class in the field.

[jrcorp]

An update and a question... I'm modding a Crate V5, diving in on a PCB for the first time. The work hasn't been professional and I've had a little trouble, but I haven't messed up anything. I ordered some parts to continue there, and I've had a book out from the library on electronics, but I still don't understand it all very well. I'm trudging along.

 

I looked through BYOC's site a few days ago, and though I don't know if I want to spend that much I may order a kit. Does anyone have any experience? I would love any suggestions on which kit to buy based on difficulty and sound or quality. They all look pretty cool to me.

[WRGKMC]

Theres little chance you can get to a level of actually designing your own circuits without taking some kind of formal classes.

Designing is all math and formulas making parts work together and knowing each and every factor involved.

 

It takes two years formal training for a technical degree where you can competantly troubbleshoot circuits using test tools properly,

and another 2 years to reach an engineering degree which allows you to actually design your own circuits, that is if you have the gift.

(By then you probibly wouldnt bother because you could earn enough to buy anything you want)

 

Designing circuits is like learning to play music and then write your own songs. You could hack around learning to play for decades and never be

good enough to write your own stuff. Same goes for electronics.

 

If you want to do it on your own, the best you can expect to be is a knowlegable hack, who can solder, build kits or copy circuits by the numbers.

You may develop some ideas of how things work, but truthfully, having a half assed understanding of electronics can be a bigger hinderance

to reaching a higher plane of understanding. This is especially true for design. Reading a map is one thing. Seeing the complete picture in your

mind from above then drawing a map is a whole different story.

[jrcorp]

Thanks for the advice. I'm at work so I'll keep it short, but I'm almost 25 and have yet to finish school mostly because I haven't found anything that I want to do for a living. So I tend to dabble in stuff like this. But I have gone back and forth on engineering since high school, as I've always done well with math and science. Electronics is a challenge for some reason, I did poorly in high school with it and even by this book I'm kind of struggling. It's frustrating but I want to learn it the best I can for now. If I get stuck or sick of it, I'll try and be satisfied having tried. Yeah, designing stuff would be amazing, but if I can learn enough to tinker successfully I'll be good for now.

[WRGKMC]

 

Thanks for the advice. I'm at work so I'll keep it short, but I'm almost 25 and have yet to finish school mostly because I haven't found anything that I want to do for a living. So I tend to dabble in stuff like this. But I have gone back and forth on engineering since high school, as I've always done well with math and science. Electronics is a challenge for some reason, I did poorly in high school with it and even by this book I'm kind of struggling. It's frustrating but I want to learn it the best I can for now. If I get stuck or sick of it, I'll try and be satisfied having tried. Yeah, designing stuff would be amazing, but if I can learn enough to tinker successfully I'll be good for now.

 

 

Dont worry, I sucked at algebra in HS. I had nothing hands on to apply it to and it seemed like a complete waste.

Once I took electronic cources, it all made sence and I aced all my classes. The key is, you need someone whose been in the business

teaching to keep your interest at a peak. My instructor was an ex military teacher who really knew his stuff.

He would first make you do things the hard way figuring them out the hard way in detail till you understood the theory.

Then he'd show you how to get the answers in a simple shortcut practical method to verify what you just learned.

An example might be an intricate LRC circuit. You would use all your formulas to figure what the ideal output value might be.

He would teach you to quickly gestimate the math, then he'd just connect test equipment and find the value.

 

The difference here is anyone can be told to test this and test that. It takes an experienced mind to know when values

are off enough to warrent further investigation and troubbleshoot a circuit. You wind up being a detective, like a Sherlock Holmes

using deductive reasoning to rule out whats not wrong and what is, use the facts to come to a correct conclusion.

If you dont enjoy puzzles, abstract reasoning and mind games like that, then electronics surely arent you bag.

 

In fact there are abstract reasoning tests out there employers used to use to see if a technician has the aptitude to troubleshoot.

i actually had to take them to get a job in the industry. Thay have been made illegal since which is a shame. I work with techs all

day and a good 90% couldnt troubbleshoot them selves out of cardboard box with a flap open and instructions written on it.

 

When I taught manufacturer releted electronics I'd say I met maybe 10 out of 2000 certified technicians who had what I consider to

be compitant trouble shooting skills. The rest were parts pushers/tube swappers, They would swap parts till they find the part that was bad.

Thet is not only expensive, its a huge time waster. A typical tech costs a company $150 an hour to have them visit a customer. If thet tech isnt

producing results, he's a loss to a company. All that stuff is figured into what a tech needs to earn vs what he gets paid and having something

left over that profits a company.

 

Its still a good career to get into though. I know I dorked around doing bull{censored} jobs after high school playing rock star with bands.

I eventually saw all my friends get real jobs and was left hanging out with all the loosers and decided I wanted something out of life

so I went back and got my degrees in electronics. I havent been without a great paying job since then in the past 35 years.

 

So the choice is yours. Eat crow and bust major balls for 2 years, get a degree you can use the rest of your life enjoying super cool jobs

that earn enough cash to support a family and home of your own, or you can be the guy on the outside looking in

wishing he had done it the rest of your life. to me 25 is way to old to be goofing around. Get your ass in gear and do

something now while you still got a chance.

[ggm1960]

 

I feel like I could potentially save myself some cash by either messing with what I have or building something from scratch. I wonder if you guys have any resources or tips on how to get started?

 

 

Without a doubt the best thing I ever did for myself was to get an AA degree in electronics, it's lead to a 20+ year financially rewarding, and physically comfortable, career. Formal training was the only way for me to learn properly but at our school we'd already learned many of the most critical skills needed for circuit analysis within the first year.

 

In any case, like you, I was quite interested in understanding, experimenting with and designing guitar effects. You can certainly learn some things about electronics by drawing up schematics and bread-boarding the circuits and it's awesome (and potentially lucrative) to be able to fix amps and other devices but when it comes to building your own stuff it's a different story. Parts like resistors, caps, diodes, transistors and op amps can be bought cheaply and in bulk but you'll run into real expense trying to come up with cases. Switches and pots can get expensive and designing, etching and drilling circuit boards can be a real hassle.

 

For example let's say you want to make a distortion pedal. Designing a working circuit is really the least of it! To have anything that will last more than a couple weeks you've got to have a metal housing. This requires a casting and some machining work, right off the bat a real hassle for a one-off project. Then you'll need a little bit of drafting skill to design, etch and drill a circuit board. If you've gone that far it would be worth your while to spend the extra money on the two or three pots you'll need. For a foot switchable unit the only switch that will work is a heavy duty Carling which will run as much as $30. You see what I'm gettin' at?

[spentron]

I have mixed feelings about formal education, although some schools may get to it faster than a university. I was doing some design before even starting college and it took a while for the classes to catch up with me. Some classes did fill out knowledge in a way I would not have sought myself, but a lot of it was just cramming my brain with a wide variety of information. Most of this has never been used but you never know what you'll need to know. It's a great background. Nevertheless, it was AFTER college that that I really felt like I started learning a lot. Some of this was making use of what I learned, part of it was "OK that was that now continue", and part was that it was 4 years later.

[jrcorp]

Brief update to this post... I'm still grinding away at school, slowly but surely. Anyone have any suggestions for books? That link to the NEETS modules is long gone, but I can look around for them. I ask because I stopped in at a store yesterday and saw a few cool books on working with amps. They're expensive for me now, but I figure if I look on Amazon I could get some used. I love reading, and if it's anything I have interest in I'll breeze through it or force myself to get through if the material is tough.

 

How to Hot Rod Your Fender Amp and Guitar Amplifier Handbook are the books I glanced through. I recognize the name Dave Hunter from some threads here and elsewhere... I would assume he's worth reading? I know Craig Anderton has a few older books as well, and I think Wampler did too? But IIRC, they're out of print and can be a pain to find.

[tedmich]

for tube amps there are few resources better than Merlin Blencowe's books

http://www.freewebs.co.uk/valvewizard/index.html

 

 

also AX84.com for a very helpful bunch of people , including Merlin.

http://www.ax84.com/

 

Also Sloclone forums!

http://www.slocloneforums.com/

 

 

Amp*ge is great too! (Amp*ge link / mention removed by Phil 10-3-12)

 

 

I'd avoid "amp mod" type books (Gerald Weber notably) as they are all like this:

"Solder the 1.5k resistor between pin 2 and the orange capacitor in your Fender Deluxe" and you end up learning very little about why you are doing these things...

 

Many gigs of older books here on tube stuff

http://www.freewebs.co.uk/valvewizard/index.html

 

and NEETS still here

http://jricher.com/NEETS/