old school style gigging. mic on stage for acoustic. no plugging in direct.

[Stella Joop]

i think stackabones maybe said he did this? i play in duos, and am somewhat interested in ditching the plugging in direct concept and doing it like dylan and havens did it in the day...miced up on stage. anyone else do this?

[Stackabones]

Search out threads by min7b5 (Eric Skye) -- he does it all the time and really knows the ropes.

 

I've done it for a couple of months ... one mic for both the acoustic and vox. It was great, but it took some getting used to. And you've got to change your expectations about how things sound. It's still the go-to sound I want to get.

 

Here's a good, no-nonsense one page primer on it ...

http://www.crownaudio.com/mic_web/onemic2.htm

 

Currently, I have a gig where it is 100% acoustic. No mic, no amp. Very different and liberating experience. In a trio that is just getting off the ground, we're going to try the one-mic approach to see if it works for us. I'd like to avoid the ducks for the rest of my acoustic carreer ...

 

[Stella Joop]

thanks for the response stack.

 

instead of using just one mic like the old bluegrassers though, im thinking more like this...

 

[Stackabones]

thanks for the response stack. instead of using just one mic like the old bluegrassers though, im thinking more like this...

 

That's a really good way to do it. The two-mic solution is a bit more versatile -- especially in noisy rooms.

 

The main thing you have to work out is amp placement. It seems like it's just easier to have it sit out in front of your mics (and off to the side a bit) -- controls feedback. Monitors can create all kinds of problems, but the basic idea is acoustic sound so you really don't need monitors ime.

[Stella Joop]

 

That's a really good way to do it. The two-mic solution is a bit more versatile -- especially in noisy rooms. The main thing you have to work out is amp placement. It seems like it's just easier to have it sit out in front of your mics (and off to the side a bit) -- controls feedback. Monitors can create all kinds of problems, but the basic idea is acoustic sound so you really don't need monitors ime.

 

 

amps?

 

if monitors are a problem i could do without them, unless its a particularily loud club. but i mean...those dudes had monitors and it worked out ok.

 

im all about the natural thing. id get an old gibson hummingbird, and a pitch pipe.

[Stackabones]

im all about the natural thing. id get an old gibson hummingbird, and a pitch pipe.

 

You can still smoke while using one of these, ergo cooler than a pitch pipe.

[Stella Joop]

You can still smoke while using one of these, ergo cooler than a pitch pipe.

 

 

good call.

[Gary Blanchard]

I don't plugin.I play both guitar and banjo at gigs, so having an instrument mic works best for me. Here is a picture of my setup. I have one stand with an attached short boom for the instrument mic.

[Grant Harding]

I've experimented with a couple of nice condenser mics (panned slightly L/R to just "livening up" my brother and I in a quiet, but amplified setting and it works really well. As mentioned before, you need to get the speakers out front to avoid feedback. Wouldn't attempt it in a loud room or for party stuff (I want to be moving around anyway).

[Terry Allan Hall]

thanks for the response stack. instead of using just one mic like the old bluegrassers though, im thinking more like this...

 

This was back in '69, at Woodstock...nowdays, Havens does plug in, as well as using a guitar mic (I've heard he goes approx. 66% pickup to 33% mic, as a rule). You'll also notice that his lead player (I forget his name) was plugged in.

 

In a club or other small venue, particularily when running the sound, yourself, from the stage, "mic only" set-ups are often a logistical nightmare...otoh, if you have a really great soundguy, it's really cool.

[Stackabones]

 

I don't enhance my acoustics with preamps and gadgetry and implants and augmentation. All natural like Scarlett. No silicon.

[Melodeous]

Nope. I use a loud amp. It keeps the fleas off the patrons.

[Stella Joop]

You'll also notice that his lead player (I forget his name) was plugged in.

 

 

it looks like there is a mic on his guitar to me.

[Chordchunker]

 

i think stackabones maybe said he did this? i play in duos, and am somewhat interested in ditching the plugging in direct concept and doing it like dylan and havens did it in the day...miced up on stage. anyone else do this?

 

 

I do it several different ways. My bluegrass band sometimes uses the one mic approach (bluegrass ballet) and sometimes we plug-in. Our fiddle player always plays through a mic unless it is an extra noisy club, or if there are drums involved. Same with me. If I`m trying to sound sweet and get the most natural tone I can from my instrument I use a 2 mic setup, but if I don`t want to be glued to a mic/stuck in one position, or I need volume I plug-in. My brother and I had an acoustic blues duo for 15 years and played alot of large festivals. In that situation I almost always used a mic.

 

Also I also like to stand during gigs mainly because I can sing with more projection, it is much easier to plug-in than stand like a statue in front of a mic.

[fingerpicker]

Baggs IMix vs $4000 NEUMANN Mic

 

I just put a B=Band dual source pickup in the Larrivee. I am getting a BETTER sound recording using the pickup than I am with one of those MXL condensor mics and less hassle.

 

I really dont see any advantage to using mics. The "quack" sound isnt present at all with these dual source pickups--at least on my guit...Check out the link above

[Stackabones]

Baggs IMix vs $4000 NEUMANN Mic I just put a B=Band dual source pickup in the Larrivee. I am getting a BETTER sound recording using the pickup than I am with one of those MXL condensor mics and less hassle. I really dont see any advantage to using mics. The "quack" sound isnt present at all with these dual source pickups--at least on my guit...Check out the link above

 

I hear a world of difference. One sounds like the guitar, the other sounds like an iBeam. Definitely an interesting sound, and pretty quack free. It'd be interesting to see how it compares to a mic that gigging musicians/regular studio hobbyists (ahem, me) could can afford -- something like a Shure SM57.

[Terry Allan Hall]

it looks like there is a mic on his guitar to me.

 

Yes, there was a mic on guitar, but the guitar was also plugged into a Fender SF Twin Reverb, w/ a mic on the amp...the signals from both sources were then sent on to the PA.

 

Still a very common way to get a good "acoustic" sound to this day.

[OldGuitarPlayer]

I have used a Sure SM58 on my guitar as seen in this pic from a few years back.

As long as I am seated this is not a problem.

 

I also use soundhole pickups. This is the same all laminate guitar (a Cort) but at a larger venue with a big stage and PA so we opted to stand. I used an old Dean Markley soundhole pickup at this time.

 

I prefer being plugged in when standing. I could have also used just a microphone there but it's sometimes easier and just as quick to plug into a DI and into the snake on stage. I currently use a Fishman NeoD on an inexpensive all laminate Yamaha guitar at the weekly open mic I host. Both guitar and pickup are very reliable, functional and get the job done for what I need it for....which is to get over the sound of a small yet noisy pub. In this situation I am not too concerned with my acoustic sound as I am also plugged into a real cheap house PA (I use the term PA loosely).

 

I think it depends on your needs and preferences. I think you should at least give it a shot and see if you like using a microphone over a pickup. Either way has it's advantages and disadvantages.

 

If I was playing venues like auditoriums or concert halls I think I'd rather have a combination of pickup and condensor mic on stage.

[Gary Blanchard]

You have to ask yourself what you are looking for. I used acoustic/electric guitars for quite a while when I was in more of a folk/rock phase and they worked, though the sound was not the same as a guitar and mic. My current use of "purely" acoustic instruments is based on two things. One is that I have never heard banjo with a pickup that really sounds like a banjo, so I need the mic for the banjo; therefore why not just mic both instruments. Secondly, I believe, and this is just my personal opinion, that folk music sounds better without the electronic sound of the acoustic/electric. I saw Joan Baez on the Pete Seeger 90th birthday concert. Her voice was, to me, better than ever. Her guitar was too harsh. That is just my opinion and others are allowed to disagree. (But they are not allowed to tell me I'm wrong. )

[OldGuitarPlayer]

I once saw John Hammond perform live and all he brought was his small bodied vintage Martin and a National resonator guitar. He was not plugged in...I stood 8 feet away from him and was mesmerized...I don't think that fella needs any amplification at all.

[boxorox]

Depends on the situation. The greatest things about plugging in are lot's of gain before feedback and the ability to get a consistant sound regardless of the acoustic environment. Straight mike set ups have plusses of better natural tone and dynamics, as well as a cetain amt of visual appeal a la "Bluegrass Ballet" from working the mike. That's hard to learn for folks that grew up plugged in.

Good mons are essential, but I tend to EQ mine on the dry side. Given I can hear the mains somewhat, the mons are boosting a little and adding clarity.

I'm just getting ready to write a treatise on this for my guitar player, who is a gear head, and it's gotten out of hand for some venues. I'll get back if I think of anything to add.

[Stackabones]

 

I'm just getting ready to write a treatise on this for my guitar player, who is a gear head, and it's gotten out of hand for some venues.

 

 

Post it!

[Stackabones]

 

I once saw John Hammond perform live and all he brought was his small bodied vintage Martin and a National resonator guitar. He was not plugged in...I stood 8 feet away from him and was mesmerized...I don't think that fella needs any amplification at all.

 

 

He probably performed under the best of all possible conditions. The audience was very attentive, right?

 

Still, even in noisy situations, the mic can work. I've been changing my head about performing in those situations. If the crowd is loud, they aren't really there for the music anyway. The louder I get, the louder they get. I just play quiet, and guess what ... I've noticed the crowd gets quiet, too. Once that happens, I have a pretty good range for dynamics and expression. If I play a loud song and then a quiet one, the crowd usually considerably (and perhaps considerately) drops the noise level somewhere around the end of the first verse of the quiet one.

[OldGuitarPlayer]

He probably performed under the best of all possible conditions. The audience was very attentive, right ? Still, even in noisy situations, the mic can work. I've been changing my head about performing in those situations. If the crowd is loud, they aren't really there for the music anyway. The louder I get, the louder they get. I just play quiet, and guess what ... I've noticed the crowd gets quiet, too. Once that happens, I have a pretty good range for dynamics and expression. If I play a loud song and then a quiet one, the crowd usually considerably (and perhaps considerately) drops the noise level somewhere around the end of the first verse of the quiet one.

 

Yes..you are correct...although the show was in a bar the audience was of course attentive....almost of to the point of worshipping...

 

I think if you can get away with using a microphone it's fine.

[Stackabones]

I think if you can get away with using a microphone it's fine.

 

Yeah, I'm with you. I think I've just gotten into a space where I don't want to play acoustic music in bars or boisterous rooms. I don't mind taking my Tele to bars and peeling back the wallpaper and knocking out fillings.