Members FWAxeIbanez Posted August 23, 2006 Members Share Posted August 23, 2006 Hey guys, I changed strings on my strat which was set up perfectly before, and I tried to get the same gauge I had but I messed up somehow and my action is all out of wack... I lowered the bridge saddles, but they are waaaay low and there is still a ton of room between the strings and the 12th fret... I went from 9's on an unknown brand to 9's from D'dario or whatever they are called, and I know that the other string sizes vary but I thought it'd just call for minimal adjustment. Before I lowered the saddles you could almost put your pinky inbetween the strings and the fretboard without touching either... Is it time to hit up the truss? I've never done this before so I'm not exactly jumping at the opportunity to grab a wrench and let her rip, you know? I did lower the saddles so much that I had to lower the bridge pickup as well because the strings were touching the pole pieces. Something tells me that I shouldn't have had to worry about that... I'm admittedly not a guitar tech in any sense of the word, so any help you seasoned veterans can offer up would be great Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Koz Posted August 23, 2006 Members Share Posted August 23, 2006 Maybe this link the Fender's setup guide may help get your guitar back to normal?http://www.fender.com/support/setup/stratsetup.php Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members FWAxeIbanez Posted August 23, 2006 Author Members Share Posted August 23, 2006 Geeze, I can barely even find the truss rod... normally its where the neck meets the body or its up on the headstock by the nut right?? the hole up by the nut doesn't seem to have anything in it, or at least I can't find the bolt thing... wouldn't it be visible in order to gauge the size needed to work with it?Nothin down on the end of the fretboard either... under the pickgaurd maybe? Seems unlikely because usually you need to dial in the truss with full string resistance right?I'm new to this stuff and it doesn't lend itself well to intuition does it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members FWAxeIbanez Posted August 23, 2006 Author Members Share Posted August 23, 2006 Originally posted by Koz Maybe this link the Fender's setup guide may help get your guitar back to normal?http://www.fender.com/support/setup/stratsetup.php I'll definitely check it out, thanks... and its an American Standard if that helps anyone with further advice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Koz Posted August 23, 2006 Members Share Posted August 23, 2006 A good guitar setup should probably run you in the $30-$40 range I would think. If your strat is that messed up and you're new to setting up guitars it may be time to take it to your local guitar shop. I really can't see how your guitar could get that messed up, especially if you didn't make a huge change in string gauge. Ask the tech if you can sit in as he works on it to pick up a few tips. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members FWAxeIbanez Posted August 23, 2006 Author Members Share Posted August 23, 2006 I think the reason why is because I took all the strings off at once and restrung it that way as opposed to taking one string off at a time and replacing it... pretty sure the saddle pieces slipped or something because my low E was waaay out of whack... I still can't find the truss rod tho, It says it needs an allen wrench in the headstock area, but the typical bolt is not visible so a wrench isn't an option... I put an Allen Driver in there, if that makes sense... I don't know the real terminology but its more of a screw driver with an allen ending than a wrench... Anyway, I used one of those plastic "Swiss Army" looking allen deals with the different sizes and couldn't find anything that would hold or even act like it was interacting with anything at all... I'm only guessing at sizes too because like I said I can't see it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members FWAxeIbanez Posted August 23, 2006 Author Members Share Posted August 23, 2006 http://reviews.ebay.com/SETTING-UP-A-USED-ELECTRIC-GUITAR-YOU-JUST-BOUGHT_W0QQugidZ10000000000948720?ssPageName=BUYGD:CAT:-1:LISTINGS:6 Reading this, it says the truss rod is indeed underneath the pickgaurd... well, I mean the piece you need to get at to adjust it anyway... how are you supposed to know its tension is set right if the strings aren't on?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Blackbelt1 Posted August 23, 2006 Members Share Posted August 23, 2006 Do not touch your truss rod. You're wrecking your guitar right now. FYI you should never have to make monumental adjustments over a simple string change. If you are doing this then something's wrong. And just changing strings up or down a gauge or 2 shouldn't require any adjustments from saddles or truss rods.If you had 9's on the guitar, and you replaced them with 9's, then you did not install the new strings properly if your guitar is this far out of whack. But the last thing you should be doing here is even thinking about adjusting the truss rod. And removing the strings all at once does not generally cause such issues either - I frequently remove all of the strings at once in order to give my guitars a thorough cleaning.Based on what you've done so far, which is counter-productive to a good setup, I'd take the guitar to a tech and let them put it back in shape for you. Then read the Fender setup guide and try gentle adjustments next time.~Blackbelt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members _pete_ Posted August 23, 2006 Members Share Posted August 23, 2006 Originally posted by Blackbelt1 Do not touch your truss rod. You're wrecking your guitar right now. FYI you should never have to make monumental adjustments over a simple string change. If you are doing this then something's wrong. And just changing strings up or down a gauge or 2 shouldn't require any adjustments from saddles or truss rods. If you had 9's on the guitar, and you replaced them with 9's, then you did not install the new strings properly if your guitar is this far out of whack. But the last thing you should be doing here is even thinking about adjusting the truss rod. And removing the strings all at once does not generally cause such issues either - I frequently remove all of the strings at once in order to give my guitars a thorough cleaning. Based on what you've done so far, which is counter-productive to a good setup, I'd take the guitar to a tech and let them put it back in shape for you. Then read the Fender setup guide and try gentle adjustments next time. ~Blackbelt +100 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members madgrinder7 Posted August 23, 2006 Members Share Posted August 23, 2006 Put the tools down, and s-l-o-w-l-y back AWAY from the guitar. I'm not being an asshole, but the steps you are about to take need a little more tool-and-guitar knowledge than you possess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Kace Posted August 23, 2006 Members Share Posted August 23, 2006 Sounds like the trem dropped back when he unstrung it, and then he restrung with it like that. There another thread on this floating around the last couple days too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members t_e_l_e Posted August 23, 2006 Members Share Posted August 23, 2006 don't touch the truss rod... you need to setup your tremolo, the instructions on the fender homepage show you how to do it, and then your guitar will be fine again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members donnie_combat Posted August 23, 2006 Members Share Posted August 23, 2006 the trem is the definate prob! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members FWAxeIbanez Posted August 23, 2006 Author Members Share Posted August 23, 2006 Originally posted by donnie_combat the trem is the definate prob! except that its a hardtail Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members FWAxeIbanez Posted August 23, 2006 Author Members Share Posted August 23, 2006 What could it be besides the trem? any common hardtail issues with this? if the truss is absolutely the last thing I should touch and most definitely can't be the problem, then what should I be looking for??? taking it in to the tech just isn't an option as its bill season for me right now. So I gotta suck it up and take care of business and figure it out. It had to happen, I've wanted to handle my own small repairs in guitars and amps for a while now, so this is a good opportunity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BlackHatHunter Posted August 23, 2006 Members Share Posted August 23, 2006 Originally posted by FWAxeIbanez except that its a hardtail so much for that theory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lowbrow Posted August 23, 2006 Members Share Posted August 23, 2006 post good clear close-up pics Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members FWAxeIbanez Posted August 23, 2006 Author Members Share Posted August 23, 2006 will do, I'm goin to work tho, so it will be tonight the action is just too high to be comfortable, I'm thinking you guys are expecting to be able to shoot arrows with my neck or something. It IS just out of reach for bridge saddle adjustment tho. thanks for the help guys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sixthsense Posted August 24, 2006 Members Share Posted August 24, 2006 ask Donny to do it again dude. The guy that actually did my set up was Rick's tech lol...because he couldn't get it right neither. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members FWAxeIbanez Posted August 24, 2006 Author Members Share Posted August 24, 2006 Originally posted by sixthsense ask Donny to do it again dude. The guy that actually did my set up was Rick's tech lol...because he couldn't get it right neither. I hate it because lately I have only called him when I need something... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members StratAttackJack Posted August 24, 2006 Members Share Posted August 24, 2006 Take it to a pro, I'm sure your nut needs to be filed down a touch or two. Fender nuts are, in my experince, cut way to high from the factory. An experienced eye would tell you for sure, but in my own case, my strats play so much better after taking care of the {censored}ty factory nut job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members FWAxeIbanez Posted August 24, 2006 Author Members Share Posted August 24, 2006 Ok, so pics are below now... If it's not the truss rod I should be paying attention to, then by all means, help me along my way please... Don't tell me to take it to a tech because it's not really an option, although I am fully able to understand if you don't have any advice due to not being able to hold the guitar in hand... If I had the cash to go to a tech, I'd be there already No time like the present to learn right??! thanks in advance guys for any help you might be able to throw my way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members FWAxeIbanez Posted August 24, 2006 Author Members Share Posted August 24, 2006 These pictures are largely crap as they were taken on a cell phone in artificial light, so for that I apologize and I'm not positive they will be any helphttp://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d47/BitBaXeMan/IMAGE_00019.jpg The action... never used to be that high, I don't really want this thing set up like a shredder, but this is ridiculoushttp://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d47/BitBaXeMan/IMAGE_00020.jpg I've never seen what a neck with too much relief looks like, but I can see a bit of bow there... I have nothing to reference this to, so I'm not entirely sure how apparent a poorly adjusted neck would be, you know?http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d47/BitBaXeMan/IMAGE_00021.jpg another angle, although admittedly almost worthless (whoa, unintentional alliteration, do I get points?)http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d47/BitBaXeMan/IMAGE_00022.jpg Here's what the saddles look like... much lower and my palm gets stabbed, much higher and I feel like I'm playing bass I tried to post pictures originally, but they were far too big, so feel free to click on them to see exactly what you are wanting to look at... if you have any angles or specific things you want to look at, I will try my best to get it for you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ibanezman06 Posted August 24, 2006 Members Share Posted August 24, 2006 Originally posted by Blackbelt1 Do not touch your truss rod. You're wrecking your guitar right now. FYI you should never have to make monumental adjustments over a simple string change. If you are doing this then something's wrong. And just changing strings up or down a gauge or 2 shouldn't require any adjustments from saddles or truss rods. If you had 9's on the guitar, and you replaced them with 9's, then you did not install the new strings properly if your guitar is this far out of whack. But the last thing you should be doing here is even thinking about adjusting the truss rod. And removing the strings all at once does not generally cause such issues either - I frequently remove all of the strings at once in order to give my guitars a thorough cleaning. Based on what you've done so far, which is counter-productive to a good setup, I'd take the guitar to a tech and let them put it back in shape for you. Then read the Fender setup guide and try gentle adjustments next time. ~Blackbelt whoa! no wayit sounds to me like even though the new strings might have been the same guage, there was more tention. if the action seems higher at the twelvth fret and there's a huge difference between the action there and at like the third fret (there should always be a little difference) then the truss rod needs to be tightened. You can't really mess up your guitar unless you turn the truss rod too wide. make small incriments of turns, tune and wait a bit for it to settle. I like my action to be semi consistant throughout the neck so that means streightening the neckif the action is WAY higher at the 12th, then you have a front neck bow. I like to have just a little relief for the best action with minimal fret buzz but you shouldn't have that much. don't be afraid to play around but don't be gettin' twist happy:D If you turn it to the right, you will be tightening the truss rod which will end up lowering your action. keep in mind, the truss rod is not a tool to lower or higher your action. Simply to adjust the amound of relief or tighness you want on your neck. I would say, try tightening it untill you get the action pretty consistant throughout the neck but leave a tiny bit of relief (the action should be just a bit higher at the 12th fret). It should not be completely streight as there will be a lot of buzzing and you will have to have the saddles WAY up to eliminate this.also, from my experience, you WILL have to adjust the truss rod on a guitar if you switch guages. if you put tens on the guitar from nines, you will have to tighten it a bit but not as drastic as you are talking about. also completly removing all strings will not hurt the guitar. however, it will take a little longer to tune to pitch and stay in tune for like the first day. just a bit though.hope this helps! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members FWAxeIbanez Posted August 24, 2006 Author Members Share Posted August 24, 2006 Originally posted by Ibanezman06 whoa! no way it sounds to me like even though the new strings might have been the same guage, there was more tention. ...snip... also completly removing all strings will not hurt the guitar. however, it will take a little longer to tune to pitch and stay in tune for like the first day. just a bit though. hope this helps! Yeah, the strings I had on before didn't say what they were made of and were purchased at target... The only reason I bought them was because I was involved in ebay drama and needed to make sure the guitar was completely functional asap... They might have been 9's but they were basically like "Toy Strings"as far as the taking all the strings off... I know it won't hurt anything, but you are always asking for trouble doing it that way... action, intonation, something usually gets thrown out when you do it like that...also, about the truss rod not being a tool for lowering action... thats a good point and to be honest I was hoping someone could look at the pictures and see if my action is a result of a poorly adjusted neck or something else altogether... Cranking the truss rod to fix your action is like treating the symptoms instead of the cold or flu in a way... I understand that bad action is a byproduct of a poorly adjusted neck, and that fixing the neck can fix the action, although it shouldn't be the first thing you turn to if your action sucks... is my understanding correct?Gawd I hate being a noob... I sound like I just started playing guitar yesterday or something. Target strings, inability to find the truss rod, it all adds up but trust me I'm not completely stupid :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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