Members blue2blue Posted December 18, 2005 Members Share Posted December 18, 2005 Originally posted by Beck No, but John Travolta did trade in his tight pants and silk shirts for a cowboy hat and chaps so he could ride the mechanical bull at Gillies in 1980 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blue2blue Posted December 18, 2005 Members Share Posted December 18, 2005 I think, Beck, part of why some people (like me, brother, like me) find your position so very offensive is that you're making a blanket condemnation of a whole style of music without qualification and with some vile insults thrown in on the side. As someone who has actually explored rap and hip hop -- and who has a moderately deep background in jazz, classical, folk, trad country, blues, and 50's and 60's pop -- I feel certain you have not explored hip hop or you simply wouldn't make the statements you make -- which drip ignorance of the very music you condemn. Really a narrow-minded, musically-bigoted point of view, seems [Note: nothing about the phrase "musically-bigoted" implies racism, and I'm absolutely not accusing you of that.] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Rudolf von Hagenwil Posted December 18, 2005 Members Share Posted December 18, 2005 "Charlie Daniels Band" :D Holy conservative white breed, where are you living Beck? Can't read your barcode from satellite, you wear probably a Stetson.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members techristian Posted December 19, 2005 Members Share Posted December 19, 2005 Back when Will Smith did "Parents Just don't understand" rap was at the point where at least the "rapping" was in time. I even like that TUNE. Now the new "rap" has descended to a new low where the only guy , in the band, with any musical ability is the drummer, (or re-mix guy). The rappers can't even TALK in time. There are usually 3 or 4 screaming into a microphone....except for Eminem. I may not agree with all of his lyrics but he IS different.However, I can't stand Snoop. I'm sure that at least 1/2 of the people on this forum have more talent than him. Dan http://musicinit.com/pvideos.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Beck Posted December 19, 2005 Members Share Posted December 19, 2005 Originally posted by blue2blue Wotta crackup.I don't know most of those songs -- I owned a Seger album once and I had a GF into CDB (and saw the Eagles twice -- once in 1972 (the completely ignored opening act for Yes, with Edgar Winter in between) and around '76 with Linda Rondstatd (who I saw a couple of times in '69 or '70, too, at the tiny original Golden Bear) and Jackson Browne (who I also saw in a small club on the relase of his first album around '71).But I DO know that "Lyin' Eyes" was a hit in 1975 (it was me and my GF's "our song")... too early to "kill off" disco by a half decade.As I said, I was there and actively engaged in the music scene.Let me go on... while I don't know many of those specific songs because I'd totally tuned out that top 40 pablum most of those artists represented at the time, I can tell you that there was probably damn precious little crossover between the folks who were into disco and Charlie Daniels, Eddie Rabbit, et al... I suppose among the lamest of the lame who just go wherever the dancing ball of pop culture points them...[Come to think of it -- I saw Charlie Daniels Band, too -- at a banjo & fiddle contest in the mid-late 70s. They were all glitz and not much grit, very show biz, and they were politely received at best. They were trying to keep the B&F Contest alive by adding a 'big name' act... but the people who were there for the bluegrass were, shall we say, extremely disdainful.] Well, since your memory won Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members AJ6stringsting Posted December 19, 2005 Members Share Posted December 19, 2005 Originally posted by Beck Your premise is flawed. This isn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mr. Donovan Posted December 19, 2005 Author Members Share Posted December 19, 2005 I think listening to too much of any one genre can make a person tired of it, and even despise it. RAP stands for Rhythm And Poetry. So the focus is on lyrics and rhythm, as opposed to notes and scales. So Rap does tend to have a more narrow focus. But not always, since Rap can be combined with other Genres, like what Rage Against The Machine did combining Rap and Metal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mr. Donovan Posted December 19, 2005 Author Members Share Posted December 19, 2005 BTW, I like rap, even though I posted this Thread that is critical of some rappers' big egos. The big ego thing is also common in Rock and Roll of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tucktronix Posted December 19, 2005 Members Share Posted December 19, 2005 Okay, here's MY 0.02... While I'm no big fan of the hip-hop of today(much prefer old-school hip-hop), to say that hip hop does not require talent is meritless and downright silly. To be able to annunciate rhymes in rhythmic fashion that is meaningful requires a great deal of knowledge and skill. Doing that just off the top of your head(freestyle) is even more exceptional. A lot of today's hip hop is just plain crap IMO, but listen to images portrayed in some old-school stuff like Grandmaster Flash's "The Message" and Eric B & Rakim's "Paid In Full" and you'll hear lyrics that deal with strife in the inner-city neighborhoods. If you have a personal distaste for this type of music(which I do nowadays), that's your perogative, but to make a blanketed statement about a certain type of music(whatever you may call it) being talentless comes off as sounding like a subjective remark made by someone that knows very little about the music in question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blue2blue Posted December 19, 2005 Members Share Posted December 19, 2005 And the Onion article is pretty funny (in that Onion way). I was glad to have you point out the article, Mr Donovan, like I said. In keeping with what I said earlier, if someone wants to say THEY despise rap or any other style, I have no problem with that whatsoever. If they want to enumerate the ways they despise it, no problem. I can either engage them in dialog or go elsewhere.But when they start treating their own personal taste as though it were an objective standard -- when they say, for instance, not that they don't like a style of music, but that the style is vile garbage (wasn't that a quote or am I conflating insults?) -- then I think they should be prepared to be called on what is an indefensible position. I know, though, that there are those who cannot grasp the fact that they are not the center of the cultural universe. It always seems a ruse or at best a willful obtuseness, but I've come to a realization: in almost all cases, this is not the first time the person caught in the solipsistic fugue has been challenged; he has almost certainly previously been exposed to all the logical arguments but, for whatever reasons, he either cannot comprehend the arguments (seems unlikely) or he will not allow himself to accept what seems obvious to everyone else. In either case, I believe extended discourse with those so afflicted is essentially pointless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Beck Posted December 19, 2005 Members Share Posted December 19, 2005 Originally posted by tucktronix ...but to make a blanketed statement about a certain type of music(whatever you may call it) being talentless comes off as sounding like a subjective remark made by someone that knows very little about the music in question. Nope, sorry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Beck Posted December 19, 2005 Members Share Posted December 19, 2005 I know, though, that there are those who cannot grasp the fact that they are not the center of the cultural universe. It always seems a ruse or at best a willful obtuseness, but I've come to a realization: in almost all cases, this is not the first time the person caught in the solipsistic fugue has been challenged; he has almost certainly previously been exposed to all the logical arguments but, for whatever reasons, he either cannot comprehend the arguments (seems unlikely) or he will not allow himself to accept what seems obvious to everyone else. In either case, I believe extended discourse with those so afflicted is essentially pointless. Ok, I accept your surrender... and you can even keep your sword, seeing as it's not really sharp enough to hurt anyone anyway... ok then, friends? PS: There were logical arguments? I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Rudolf von Hagenwil Posted December 19, 2005 Members Share Posted December 19, 2005 Make noodles, not music. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Will Chen Posted December 19, 2005 Members Share Posted December 19, 2005 Originally posted by blue2blue In either case, I believe extended discourse with those so afflicted is essentially pointless. You, sir, are correct. We see it in all walks of life from the congressional floor and the Whitehouse to the art gallery and indie record store. Essentially it all boils down to the following quote: "There are 2 types of people in the world: Those who come into a room and say, 'Here I am!' and those who come in and say, 'Ah, there you are!' " -Frederick L Collins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Will Chen Posted December 19, 2005 Members Share Posted December 19, 2005 Originally posted by Beck Nope, sorry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tucktronix Posted December 19, 2005 Members Share Posted December 19, 2005 Originally posted by Beck Nope, sorry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blue2blue Posted December 19, 2005 Members Share Posted December 19, 2005 Originally posted by Beck Ok, I accept your surrender... and you can even keep your sword, seeing as it's not really sharp enough to hurt anyone anyway... ok then, friends? PS: There were logical arguments? I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Beck Posted December 19, 2005 Members Share Posted December 19, 2005 Originally posted by blue2blue And here -- folks -- we have prime evidence that Beck has very serious problems comprehending assertions written in straightforward English... I recommend that you consider that before you engage in further extended "dialog" with him. Cheerio. So let get this staright... you're unsurrendering?Ok... Keep me posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Beck Posted December 19, 2005 Members Share Posted December 19, 2005 Originally posted by tucktronix WTF:confused: Well, let me see... you go off making snap, unsubstantiated judgements about a genre of music that, judging from your posts, you know very little about. Doesn't sound like a well-informed opinion to me. Gee, I can always sit here and make a statement that folk music is crap and talentless after listening to some songs ? It's so very easy to make unmerited claims about rap music while you're sitting in your suburban home. What makes this type of music talentless? Can you give examples? Do yourself a favor, do some research before coming across as a dumbass. I have a suburban home? Well, this is news. Would it be too much to ask for you to post a map quest so I can find it? Is the key under the mat? And all this time I thought you guys were a bunch of clueless stoners who sleep in your clothes (judging from your posts). And then you go and buy me a home in suburbia. There is truly good in all men.Not that I want to appear ungrateful about the new house and all, but I must bring something to your attention Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members the stranger Posted December 20, 2005 Members Share Posted December 20, 2005 Originally posted by Beck Your premise is flawed. This isn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Beck Posted December 20, 2005 Members Share Posted December 20, 2005 Originally posted by the stranger Culture Club? If it wasn't for rap, I wouldn't be listening to all the jazz/funk/soul that I do. And I listen to all kinds of stuff. EW&F, NWA, Napalm Death Two kinds of music, good music and good music. Just depends on what you think is good. Seriously, you need to lose that pre-fab image of rap you have. There is good stuff out there that is everything but what you mention. And that stench is the smell of success. Oppressed people taking what the have and making it work. I bet "stench" was exactly the word they used for the blues, jazz, rock and roll, and every other new thing that pissed off the relics of the past. You must be a Harvard man... Bravo!But please elaborate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tucktronix Posted December 20, 2005 Members Share Posted December 20, 2005 Originally posted by Beck I have a suburban home? Well, this is news. Would it be too much to ask for you to post a map quest so I can find it? Is the key under the mat? And all this time I thought you guys were a bunch of clueless stoners who sleep in your clothes (judging from your posts). And then you go and buy me a home in suburbia. There is truly good in all men.Not that I want to appear ungrateful about the new house and all, but I must bring something to your attention Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members AJ6stringsting Posted December 25, 2005 Members Share Posted December 25, 2005 People are going to want to hear Music again, performed by real musicians with talent not some hack with dillutions of talent, looking stupid with a head phone set on his head, "scratching" records, sampling other peoples music, that's not talent that's stupid...........what next playing air guitar with brooms !I'm serious!.....is that the next fad ?????...that would be one step lower than Rap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members John S. Shinal Posted December 27, 2005 Members Share Posted December 27, 2005 Originally posted by Beck Motown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members feloniuspunk1 Posted December 27, 2005 Members Share Posted December 27, 2005 Many humans may suffer from unrealistically high self images. Don't overestimate your own charisma. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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