Members gdsmithtx Posted July 3, 2015 Members Share Posted July 3, 2015 After being very taken with the amazing capabilities of my Mustang III v2 for a year or so, I've lately been kind of jonesing for an inexpensive, non-Fender, low output tube amp for some fat blues/classic rock sounds. So I was checking out craigslist and ebay and, somehow, ended up buying one from each in the same day. Only wanted one, somehow ended up with two: a very guitarist type of situation Amp #1 (from ebay) - Ibanez TSA15 1x12 15-watt tube combo with the built in Tubescreamer circuit (should arrive Tuesday) Amp #2 (from craigslist) - Bugera v22, 1x12 30-watt tube combo (sitting right here): After listening to a crapload of videos on both amps yesterday (and playing the v22 -- at lower volume because my son is with me), I'm definitely going to change the tubes and speakers in both. Speakers: I'm an Eminence guy when it comes to speakers; I've been extremely happy with the Ragin Cajun (x2), the Swamp Thang and the Copperhead. I'm pretty sure the Ibanez is getting an Eminence Legend GB128, which sounded absolutely tremendous (equalling the very nice Weber Blue Dog) in a video shootout in this amp: balanced, full and lush, with tight bass and chiming highs (no spike). The Bugera, I'm on the fence about: Eminence Texas Heat, Red White and Blues, Cannabis Rex and Governor are all in the running, and all have their own charms. What are your opinions? Note: I'm aware of the long break-in period for the hemp-based Cannabis Rex, but my plan for any new speaker involves installing it into my Mustang III, putting it in an unused bedroom upstairs and repeating an ipod playlist of recorded guitar music through it at moderate volume for like 12 hours a day. I figure 40-60 hours of that ought to break in any speaker quite well. Meanwhile, the Mustang III's well-broken-in Swamp Thang will be in the eventual transplant recipient. Tubes: This is an area in which I'm a bit of a noob. The TSA15 has (all made in China) two 12AX7 (Pre) and two x 6v6 (Power). Suggestions? I read a guy with this same amp talk about getting great results from two JJ ECC83S High Gain (Pre), one balanced for phase inverter, and two JJ 6v6 (Power). Opinions? The Bugera features (also made in China) three 12ax7s (Pre) and two El84s (Power). I'm leaning toward the Tubestore Premium package for the v22: two matched Preferred Series 7189 (Premium EL84) and three Tung-Sol 12ax7s. Opinions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Floyd Rosenbomb Posted July 3, 2015 Members Share Posted July 3, 2015 Honestly, I'd play it for a bit before I'd think about changing anything. A lot of knobs on that amp and it should have what you need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members gdsmithtx Posted July 3, 2015 Author Members Share Posted July 3, 2015 Good advice generally. Regarding the v22, even at lower volume, I've already heard the things people talk about with the early v22s (this one is apparently from 2009): good shimmery cleans; grainy Black Keys-ish overdrive that's too low-fi for my taste; heat-based reverb anomalies. These can apparently be cured with a retube and with cheap heat sinks installed on two specific parts that sometimes overheat from the nearby tube temps. I may also end up using foamcore aluminum tape to heatshield some areas of the v22's guts. The stock speaker actually seems alright, but not exceptional. Maybe I'll wait till the retube and also try the Swamp Thang in it. In the Ibanez, the tightass Celestion Seventy 80 that's in it apparently won't break up properly before applying overdrive. It's gotta go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members wankdeplank Posted July 3, 2015 Members Share Posted July 3, 2015 Lucky you. Big congrats and enjoy some real tube crunch!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members gardo Posted July 4, 2015 Members Share Posted July 4, 2015 Bugeras seem to be pretty good amps already. Instead of looking at what it's not doing I'd find what it will do . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members speakerjones Posted July 5, 2015 Members Share Posted July 5, 2015 HNAD. I'm curious if the Ibanez turns out to be a good amp. I've not heard much about them. I can tell by your sig that you're into modding stuff. Still, seems like with what you'll spend on both entry-level amps plus new speakers and tubes for each, you probably could have picked up something pretty nice to begin with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DeepEnd Posted July 5, 2015 Members Share Posted July 5, 2015 Congratulations and Happy New Amp Day X 2. I've heard good things about Bugera but Ibanez is not really known as an amp company. I don't doubt they can build one given their experience with pedals but they're not a household name. Still, gotta echo speakerjones. My Fernandes Strat copy wasn't my cup of espresso but I sank good money into trying to make it a guitar I liked and eventually sold it at a loss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members gdsmithtx Posted July 5, 2015 Author Members Share Posted July 5, 2015 Update: Tried out the 12" Eminence Swamp Thang from my Mustang III in the Bugera as a test. It was as big a single sonic upgrade as I've seen, speaker-wise. With the same amp settings, it immediately sounded like 25% better. It's louder, bassier, subtler, livelier and smoother than the stock speaker. Already ordered the Texas Heat (eventually for the v22) and the Legend GB128 (for the Ibanez amp); neither cost more than $60. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members gdsmithtx Posted July 5, 2015 Author Members Share Posted July 5, 2015 I'm curious if the Ibanez turns out to be a good amp. I've not heard much about them. Me too, honestly. But considering every Ibanez piece of equipment I've ever had has been high quality, I'm hopeful. Plus, it's got the damned Tubescreamer built right in! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cbh5150 Posted July 6, 2015 Members Share Posted July 6, 2015 Me too, honestly. But considering every Ibanez piece of equipment I've ever had has been high quality, I'm hopeful. Plus, it's got the damned Tubescreamer built right in! I have one and it's a fantastic amp. Cleans are very Fendery, and the built-in boost adds quite a bit soncially - even before kicking in the TS circuit. I haven't changed tubes, yet, FWIW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members billybilly Posted July 6, 2015 Members Share Posted July 6, 2015 Big congrats on both, I've always wanted to try the Ibanez. I own the newer Bugera and changed nothing, lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members WRGKMC Posted July 6, 2015 Members Share Posted July 6, 2015 Tube wise JJ's are a great durable tube for the outputs with a vintage RCA type tone. You can Google up preamp tube choices. I've done allot of comparisons with 12AX 7's and out of the new ones I found EH preamp tubes superior to many others for power and clarity, It really comes down to personal preference however. You really cant know what will be best without giving them a shot. Differences can be very mild and you may not hear much of a difference, or the differences you do hear can easily be compensated for with mild amp tweaks. If you want a more fender type tone you can try groove tubes for the power amp too. I've had a set of power and preamp tubes in my Bassman for over 10 years now and they still sound as good as they did when I installed them. I'm thinking about changing them out just for a change to either JJ's or EH. I have EH power tubes in my Music Man head and they are doing very well. I had JJ's in that head because they were the only EL34 tubes that could take the high voltage when 6CA7's became obsolete. EH was the first to start making the 6CA7's so I switched to those because they were designed for that amp. JJ recently started making them too so I may switch to them at some later point. Tung Sol are supposed to be decent preamp tubes too but the only experience I have with those are with vintage tubes, not the new ones. You can visit the tube store and read up on them. They do a pretty good job describing the differences. http://www.thetubestore.com/Resources/Product-Reviews/12AX7-Tube-Reviews?gclid=CJSCgN_QxsYCFQYvaQodXj0C8w Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members gdsmithtx Posted July 9, 2015 Author Members Share Posted July 9, 2015 I have EH power tubes in my Music Man head and they are doing very well. I had JJ's in that head because they were the only EL34 tubes that could take the high voltage when 6CA7's became obsolete. EH was the first to start making the 6CA7's so I switched to those because they were designed for that amp. JJ recently started making them too so I may switch to them at some later point. Tung Sol are supposed to be decent preamp tubes too but the only experience I have with those are with vintage tubes, not the new ones. Thanks for the info, but much of was over my head. I'm visiting your link, though, to learn more. Thanks again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members gdsmithtx Posted July 11, 2015 Author Members Share Posted July 11, 2015 After receiving the Texas Heat and installing it into the Bugera, it sounded .... tight, very focused and compressed. It sounds like, even though the speaker was used, it wasn't used enough to really break it in. So the Swamp Thang goes back in the v22 for the time being (it may end up staying there, it sounds so good), while the Texas Heat goes into the Mustang III upstairs for full break-in. The Eminence Legend GB128 speaker for the Ibanez amp arrived today too; it's next in the rotation, even though the amp itself won't arrive till tomorrow due to shipping delays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members billybilly Posted July 11, 2015 Members Share Posted July 11, 2015 After receiving the Texas Heat and installing it into the Bugera, it sounded .... tight, very focused and compressed. It sounds like, even though the speaker was used, it wasn't used enough to really break it in. So the Swamp Thang goes back in the v22 for the time being (it may end up staying there, it sounds so good), while the Texas Heat goes into the Mustang III upstairs for full break-in. The Eminence Legend GB128 speaker for the Ibanez amp arrived today too; it's next in the rotation, even though the amp itself won't arrive till tomorrow due to shipping delays. You sound like an Eminence man gdsmithtx... Have you ever tried the Cannabis Rex, I've been curious about that one, thought you might know. Lastly, how is the Swamp Thing for cleans, compared to the stock? Cheers, Billy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members gdsmithtx Posted July 11, 2015 Author Members Share Posted July 11, 2015 Haven't tried the Cannabis Rex yet, but the Swamp Thang sounds amazingly good in there (and in the Mustang III). The cleans are really warm and open sounding compared to the stock speaker; it's ballsier more dynamic sounding and just straight up louder. The Swamp Thang may end up as my all-time favorite amp speaker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members billybilly Posted July 13, 2015 Members Share Posted July 13, 2015 Thanks for that, always room to tinker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Danhedonia Posted July 20, 2015 Members Share Posted July 20, 2015 Tube differences are overrated, IMO. If you are a tone-chaser, and specifically looking for one single sound, then yes, you can not only hear and appreciate but thoughtfully pursue different sonic palettes offered by different mfrs. But if you are using different guitars / pups, FX, reverb here and there, the slight differences tend to go out the window. Counterpoint: however, power handling is important, and you want to be sure that a) your tubes don't get saggy (you'll probably initially notice a slightly darker, quieter sound) and b) they are reasonably efficient esp. for a lower wattage combo amp. I like JJ's as well as EH and GT. A cork sniffing friend constantly tries things (meaning NOS from boutique vendors online) with his Hiwatt and Plexi (yeah, I know ...) and you can hear those differences, but he's playing loud through a large rig. Me and my little Egnater Rebel 30, we do just fine with GT/EH/JJ. Once tubes start to fade, there's a certain sproing! you can't reach, and you'll know it's time. As you noted, the speakers will have a far, far more significant impact on things. That's a great haul - I love small tube amps. I've heard somewhere that the Ibby's are strongly based on Blackface FMIC circuits - will be interested to see what you think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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