Members UstadKhanAli Posted October 29, 2008 Members Share Posted October 29, 2008 I was in the OC, going to Knott's Scary Farm this weekend. Some people were saying that in their neck of the woods, they were saying almost all "Yes On 8" stickers, while others were saying that it was about 50/50. So some places were definitely pink while others seemed blazing red, yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members fetishfrog Posted October 29, 2008 Members Share Posted October 29, 2008 Strong supporter of No on 8. Don't sell out equal protection under the law. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BlueStrat Posted October 29, 2008 Members Share Posted October 29, 2008 I think Obama's intention to, among other things, get us to start developing alternative fuel sources and becoming a leader in that sounds far more pragmatic to me. It's also several decades away from being a viable reality, and in any event we'll never be totally free from oil because of all the other things we use it for besides gasoline and heating oil: Air travel (no electric or coal fired airliners out there) plasticsengine and machinery lubricantsynthetic fabric and fibers for clothing, rope, rain gear, and a zillion other things rubbing alcoholcertain fertilizerscertain insecticidesadhesives and a zillion other things Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Rudolf von Hagenwil Posted October 29, 2008 Members Share Posted October 29, 2008 I voted for... well, I forgot her name, but every word which came over her lips sounded like manna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members nerol1st Posted October 30, 2008 Members Share Posted October 30, 2008 Yeah NY is gonna go yourmommabama so whatever. Won't keep me from voting anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Monkey Mouse Posted October 30, 2008 Members Share Posted October 30, 2008 I'm from NJ, a notoriously Democratic state; feel your pain... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Rabid Posted October 30, 2008 Members Share Posted October 30, 2008 Well, actually, the last Democratic administration oversaw a period of rising economic fundamentals and increasing prosperity for most US citizens --... Actually, the past Democratic administration pushed the "spend into debt and abandon savings" method of accelerating the economy. It was a very shortsighted plan that had to run out of steam when people ran out of credit. Unfortunately 90 percent of the public was happy to live in the present and mortgage their future. The present administration was no better, preferring to ride the popularity of a spend-accelerated economy until it finally crashed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members UstadKhanAli Posted October 30, 2008 Members Share Posted October 30, 2008 Actually, the past Democratic administration pushed the "spend into debt and abandon savings" method of accelerating the economy. Did they increase spending, increase debt to historical proportions, and swell the size of government to three times the size in the past eight years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MichaelSaulnier Posted October 30, 2008 Author Members Share Posted October 30, 2008 I'm just mad that old people in Pennsylvania, Ohio, and Florida are going to decide this election. It just doesn't seem fair. It will probably be decided well before the polls close in CA. M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators MrKnobs Posted October 30, 2008 Moderators Share Posted October 30, 2008 It's also several decades away from being a viable reality, and in any event we'll never be totally free from oil because of all the other things we use it for besides gasoline and heating oil: Air travel (no electric or coal fired airliners out there) plasticsengine and machinery lubricantsynthetic fabric and fibers for clothing, rope, rain gear, and a zillion other things rubbing alcoholcertain fertilizerscertain insecticidesadhesivesand a zillion other things All of these things can be made from coal, though it's more expensive. Terry D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Lucky #9 Posted October 30, 2008 Members Share Posted October 30, 2008 I am of the opinion that "W" will go down in history as one of the the least intelligent, absolute worst presidents we have had to date. In many ways, a puppet who was the facade for deception, greed and manipulation that made the extremely rich even far richer with the rest of us left to fend for ourselves. How are the folk down in New Orleans doing, by the way? I'm sure the Chinese are extremely pleased that we are becoming more and more indebted to them each day as well. It's a good thing the Republicans have selected a Maverick rocket scientist as their VP candidate to save us, isn't it? The only Maverick I've seen in recent memory was the character James Garner used to play on TV. Hey, maybe "Joe the Plumber" can save us! Talk about your lowest common denominator. Maybe we truly are a nation of the brain dead. How is it, by the way, that whenever an election comes about the price of gas drops steadily before polling day? Supply and Demand is a lot of bull{censored}. Other forces are certainly at work and you can bet they are not on your side. An "Honest Politician?" Somehow those two words do not belong in the same sentence. I live in NJ. If you were in office here and you are not collecting at least 3 pensions by the time you depart, and half your relatives are on a free ride somewhere, something must be wrong with you. It ain't the '60s anymore: -We are a Nation of Sheep- -Pass me the Soma- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Super 8 Posted October 30, 2008 Members Share Posted October 30, 2008 We Californians don't take kindly to being ignored. How about you and your state? I actually just missed Obama by maybe 5-10 minutes when he was campaigning for senator against Allen Keyes. I didn't really know who he was at the time. He was holding a rally on the bike path I regularly use to walk to the Y. Missed him by that much.One thing I like about Obama, he can find Rockford, Illinois on a map.Can't wait to vote him into office! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members 7sickstrings Posted October 30, 2008 Members Share Posted October 30, 2008 It's also several decades away from being a viable reality, and in any event we'll never be totally free from oil because of all the other things we use it for besides gasoline and heating oil: Air travel (no electric or coal fired airliners out there) NASA, AirBus, Boeing, and Shell oil are working on aircraft using alternative fuels. There has also been development of electric aircraft for quite some time. plastics Plastics have been developed that are made from plastic, and a number of plastics available NOW use natural gas rather than petroleum. engine and machinery lubricant Full synthetic lubricants have been around for AGES. Yes, they're slightly more expensive, but also offer better performance. synthetic fabric and fibers for clothing, rope, rain gear, and a zillion other things You can make all those things from silk, cotton, hemp, natural rubber, etc. rubbing alcohol Bacardi 151 or grain alcohol. Not only a great disinfectant, but also a potent anesthetic! certain fertilizerscertain insecticides Buy organic? adhesives They were making adhesives LONG before oil was first refined. Not that I disagree with the fact that we can't very well just up and stop using oil, but the foundation is definitely there to reduce our dependence quite a bit. We have the ability right now to begin using available alternatives while continuing and accelerating research into alternatives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BlueStrat Posted October 30, 2008 Members Share Posted October 30, 2008 All of these things can be made from coal, though it's more expensive.Terry D. But if you can make them from oil, it's cheaper and you have a sizable supply of your own, why wouldn't you? Just the cost of converting transportation and manufacturing from oil to other sources alone is staggering, let alone the continued expense of substituting higher cost alternatives in an ongoing basis. There will likely come a time when alternatives are affordable and practical but until that time comes, oil is still a necessity and not to exploit our own resources is reckless, shortsighted and stupid. Besides, I've been around long enough to have seen the principle of unintended consequences more than a few times. Many things that seem like great ideas at the time turn out to have worse consequences than the problems they were intended to fix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BlueStrat Posted October 30, 2008 Members Share Posted October 30, 2008 I am of the opinion that "W" will go down in history as one of the the least intelligent, absolute worst presidents we have had to date.You should read the bio of Abe Lincoln. Almost exactly the same things were said about him as have been said about Bush-he was a rube a dunce, he looked like a chimp, he was a tool of Northern industry who started an illegal war to enrich his cronies, he was trampling the Constitution etc etc etc. In fact he was hated so much that John Wilkes Booth thought he would be regaled as a hero for assassinating Lincoln. Don't miss my point. I'm NOT saying Bush is Lincoln by any means. I'm just saying that the perspective of history has a way of defining presidencies that the immediacy of the present does not afford. Harry Truman had a lower approval rating than Bush, but history has been pretty kind to him. Kennedy was nearly a disaster but he's been elevated to minor diety status. We'll probably mostly be dead when history renders it's judgment. I'm just sayin'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blue2blue Posted October 30, 2008 Members Share Posted October 30, 2008 Actually, the past Democratic administration pushed the "spend into debt and abandon savings" method of accelerating the economy. It was a very shortsighted plan that had to run out of steam when people ran out of credit. Unfortunately 90 percent of the public was happy to live in the present and mortgage their future. The present administration was no better, preferring to ride the popularity of a spend-accelerated economy until it finally crashed. Let me get this straight... The Clinton administration presided over a budget that finally eliminated the extravagant deficit spending that had fueled the massive expansion of national debt under Reagan -- who tripled the national debt -- and GHW Bush -- who trumped that by doubling the national debt in just one term -- but then -- according to you -- somehow hypnotized and conned Americans into spending their savings and engaging in personal debt? And you're basing that assertion on just exactly what? Maybe you're simply confused about who was who? After all, the Bush administration, aided by Republicans in Congress, had a novel and interesting reaction to the 9/11 attacks -- at a time when the US was preparing to plunge a large oil-producing area into regional war, likely driving up oil prices -- he encouraged the wealthy to buy large luxury vehicles by pushing a big tax credit for trucks and SUVs. This was often derisively called the "SUV tax credit." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jeff da Weasel Posted October 30, 2008 Members Share Posted October 30, 2008 I'm just mad that old people in Pennsylvania, Ohio, and Florida are going to decide this election. This is almost always the case, in any presidential election. And yes, while they need our 55 electoral votes, the contest is pretty much over by the time California weighs in. That doesn't make us any less important... just more committed on an earlier basis, and more homogenous in our voting position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members doug osborne Posted October 30, 2008 Members Share Posted October 30, 2008 So, in 2012, the election will be on the first Saturday in November. From 10:00 AM EST to 6 PM PST. Proportional Electoral Vote in every state? Mandatory voting (or face a fine)? National primary on the first Saturday in May? Federal funding, with mandatory monthly debates and weekly 1/2 hour candidate messages in prime time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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