Members MartinC Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 I've been in a band where when it came time to get paid, the agreed upon amount got cut-according to the band leader. But it's never happened to me when I was doing the business. I can only think of one time when a guy asked to cut the pay of a duo-we played three sets to a mostly empty bar. I said no, and the guy coughed up the two bills. I didn't want to play there again anyway for 100.-the guy had no crowd. I was just reading another thread and two posters talked about being shorted. How often does this happen to your group? And do you accept it as part of the deal if you want another gig there, or do you write off the place? I figure a deal's a deal-you play, you get paid the agreed upon amount, no matter if the place is packed or empty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DevilRaysFan Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 Its happened to me on the rarest of occasions in bands from the past but not in recent history. It has happened to myself, personally, and recently. However, Im hearing from - not only this forum - but in bands in my area that this is becoming a lot more frequent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jwlussow Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 This happened to us once in over 1500 shows. It sucked but it was a weird situation and we learned from it. We got a VERY late call from one of our agents asking if we could do a gig that night at a club about 20 miles away. It turned out that Marshall Crenshaw had to cancel due to the huge snowstorm that was hitting Chicago at that time. We decided to go for it and we hustled to get there on time. We made it there about a hour before the scheduled start and we did the load-in. Great, huge stage, great sound system, great lights with follow spots and the whole works (fog, lasers, etc...). Only problem was the weather. Not a single person showed up. Not one. The storm had killed the night and besides the band there were probably only 6 people in the bar and the music area was a separate room. We played the show and had a great time with the stage and lights but at the end of the night the manager (complete with purple and orange hair) gave us $50.00 instead of the agreed upon $550.00. We argued but all in all, we played the nicest stage of our career to that point and the only people that saw us worked for the club. We had a great experience and we learned a few lessons. That was the only time we were ever shorted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Austincowbell Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 We had an attempted short one time but we got our money. All of it. This club booked us for a Superbowl night where we were supposed to play after the game as Sunday nights were really big for them... except this one wasn't. There couldn't have been more than 12-14 people in the entire venue and those people asked us to turn down as they couldn't talk because we were too loud (their table, one long bench table, was 5-6 feet from the stage). But I explained to the club owner that I was sympathetic to his situation but we had an agreement and we had performed our portion of it. We all would have much rather been at superbowl parties but we were stuck at his club so we needed our money. We got paid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members GCDEF Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 I don't recall it ever happening successfully. There has been the occasional attempt, but we've never let the manager get away with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members eyebanez333 Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 I don't recall it ever happening successfully. There has been the occasional attempt, but we've never let the manager get away with it. +1 They've tried...it usually comes with an excuse. Like the bar didn't have the expected crowd, or didn't sell enough booze. We stood our ground and got paid. Haven't been back to the club since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members TrickyBoy Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 We got stiffed $100 a while back. It got really ugly. Turns out it's this club's MO, they do it quite often. Fair to say we, nor any other decent bands from what I hear, will ever be back there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members flanc Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 In 12 years of gigging, It has happened 3 times. Once, in the band that I was not the leader. Our band was one of the top few in the area and a restaraunt/club was under new mgmt and was hoping make a bang by brining in a "good" band. The place was laid out really band and we had maybe a dozen people show up and we were getting a grand. They cried poor and our leader was firm and even loud and intimidating. The place paid us begrudgingly and they soon went out of business. Another time a few years later, my wife and I are now running the band and we are working through an agent. We get booked in December at a far away club that none of our crowd would travel to. On top of that, there are Christmas parties galore and the turnout is very light...maybe 15 people all night. The manager comes to us after the second of three sets and want to make a deal. We had one more gig booked for March in there and he says..."if you cut the third set and take $500 instead of the $700 you are owed, we'll definitely make it up to you at the next gig". We were not having much fun with the low turnout and thought we would play nice and took the deal. Later that week we got an email from the agent telling us the rest of the gigs at that club were cancelled. We didn't really mind because we accepted less for doing less and the club wasn't promising for us anyway. Another time was very similar with a gig an agent booked. It was a good room but 100 miles from our town/following. It was the night before Easter and no one showed up. The manager waited till the end of the night and told us he had to cut our pay because the crowd was so light. We argued that we did what we were asked and he said he wouldn't budge. We new we weren't coming back and it wasn't worth our time to take him to small claims over the $200 missing portion. We took the reduced pay and have never gone back (not that they wanted us). All of this was over 5 years ago, so we have been much wiser since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jeff42 Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 Since the band has been together (8 years now) this has happened to us maybe 4times. Not including when we played for door money. Sometimes those figures were questionable. This is for flat fee gigs. In early December after a decent night the bar owner tried to cry poverty to me. It didn't work and we got full pay. Once we get a hard time about pay we really have to think hard about going back. It is not worth arguing over at the end of the night. Last year was the last time it happened to us... They had us doomed from the start. Here is the thread: http://acapella.harmony-central.com/showthread.php?2617487-I-JUST-NEED-TO-VENT We are not unreasonable though. a couple years ago we played right after our area was hit with a big storm. Almost No one showed and the manager asked us to quit early and take a cut. We did. It is a place we still play and they always take care of us every other time we play there. Comp'd drinks, some bar food occasionally and sometimes a tip at the end of the night. In that situation, yeah, we understand. We didn't take much of a cut but we took one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members paste Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 Never been really shorted, but bands I've been in have been screwed by taking the door. In my first real working band back in the early 90s, there was one club that seemed to really like us, we were usually the first call when they had a cancellation. Towards the end of our run there, they started pulling crap, like having the asst. manager trying to pay us less than our guarantee because he was supposedly told a different amount than the one he told us. We got our money, but it put a bad taste in our mouths. Not long after that, they wanted to ditch the guarantee and pay us the door, but with their door guy work the door. Our last gigs there were the same weekend as my college graduation and I had lots of friends and family in town and they all came out to the gig. The door guy tried to get my 70 something grandmother to pay even though she was on the list, but he was letting in people he knew left and right for free. At one of the breaks, the door guy came up to us and to tell us how great we were playing and how we had a great crowd, but when it was time to settle up, the numbers were way off and we got hosed. That was the last straw and we never played there again. Turns out they were doing it to other bands and by the end of the summer, the place was closed. A few years later in another band, we played the Sat. after Thanksgiving at a club's anniversary party. The two bands were supposed to get all of the door money, which would have been great if that had been the case. It was a large club and it was packed the whole night, with a line out the door. When it came time to get paid, the club said they were only giving us the door for the first two hundred people, after that they kept the door. We still made a decent amount of money, but we should have made a lot more. Since then, there haven't been many problems, but the biggest one that seems to prop up every now and then is when a club takes money out of the band's fund to cover the sound guy, which is kind of understandable, but also the door guys, which isn't. In one case, the club was understaffed and took the door guy off the door about an hour or so early. Since a good portion of our pay was supposed to be from the door and most of the crowd there was ours, we were a little ticked off that a bunch of people got in for free. To top it off, we went to get paid, we were told the manager with the checkbook went home sick early in the night, so we had to come back on Monday to get our check. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members paste Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 Last year was the last time it happened to us... They had us doomed from the start. Here is the thread: http://acapella.harmony-central.com/showthread.php?2617487-I-JUST-NEED-TO-VENT I just re-read that thread and was wondering if they ever contacted you guys again for another gig and if so, what happened? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Kramerguy Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 So far only once did a venue attempt to short us. They claimed it was a poor night, and we didn't bring the crowd that was expected. And they were right, but I argued that it was pre-agreed and that every other time we played there, we DID fill the place, so he consented and paid us. We still play there regularly, but all our new gigs are for the door. We have the option of having someone we know collect, or them. All in all, this owner really isn't a bad guy- I stop in occasionally on business and social (beer) visits. He buys me beers even when I'm just there to drink or see other bands.. I think the issue is that there are so many bands around here that all claim to be the "best party band in the area" but can't get anyone to show up at gigs.. he tries to weed them out and only book regular bands that pull crowds, but we are fickle, bands break up, etc.. so there's always a revolving door of new bands. I know I myself have been at the front lines of being against working for the door, and the band bringing the crowds, but in todays market, there's reality and there's fantasy. I don't like the way things are, but it's still better to be complaining and gigging than complaining and not gigging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Rezrover Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 Not very often and if we do; that's the last time we play there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bish0p34 Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 We got stiffed for about $400 at a club we played regularly for about a year and a half. We had a less than spectacular draw, and they told us there wasn't enough cash. They asked us to call on Mon or Tues for the rest. We did, trusting them after a decent run there. They never returned our calls. Our singer actually took them to court, and even though we had a contract they won. Still trying to figure that one out... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jeff42 Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 We got stiffed for about $400 at a club we played regularly for about a year and a half. We had a less than spectacular draw, and they told us there wasn't enough cash. They asked us to call on Mon or Tues for the rest. We did, trusting them after a decent run there. They never returned our calls. Our singer actually took them to court, and even though we had a contract they won. Still trying to figure that one out... I figured you guys would never get shorted because of your agency. That sucks. BTW If you ever see me posting about an upcoming show and it is at this place... please warn me! I just re-read that thread and was wondering if they ever contacted you guys again for another gig and if so, what happened? I was contacted once by someone else running the place and I gave them a polite no and thats it. Then I was contacted by a fan to do a benefit there for a very sick family member... I said no, sorry anywhere but there and told them why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members wheresgrant3 Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 In this band after 700+ shows and 8 years we've had 2-3 attempts... but we have always been paid. Strength in numbers... there are 6-7 of us standing behind our manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Christhee68 Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 I work in a club that has bands (mostly regional acts) every night. They always get paid a guarantee (usually $1,500-$2,000). One time we had this relatively new band in on one of our busiest nights (every year this is one of our biggest nights) and the crowd was huge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jeff42 Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 I work in a club that has bands (mostly regional acts) every night. They always get paid a guarantee (usually $1,500-$2,000). One time we had this relatively new band in on one of our busiest nights (every year this is one of our biggest nights) and the crowd was huge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members wheresgrant3 Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 I work in a club that has bands (mostly regional acts) every night. They always get paid a guarantee (usually $1,500-$2,000). One time we had this relatively new band in on one of our busiest nights (every year this is one of our biggest nights) and the crowd was huge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jeff42 Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 we very rarely play for the door anymore. I think the last time was when we got screwed. (see other thread link) When we started out it was almost always for the door (there was no way around it) and we almost always had our guy there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members maxnew40 Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 I have not been shorted any pay since back in the 80s. Max Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Hegmatronicon Posted January 13, 2011 Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 I have only been playing 6 years or so - but we have an agency/manager that takes care of pay and invoicing and collecting for us. We will pick up cash or a cheque on the night at some places, others will just direct deposit it to our agent. But if we have issues at a venue (not paying etc) we just get the management involved and they have contracts with all the clubs etc so it gets taken care of - or they pay us out of their own pocket and chase it up themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MartinC Posted January 14, 2011 Author Members Share Posted January 14, 2011 I went back and read the old thread. IMO, you guys should have told the bar everybody pays as soon as you saw the ladies night sign, or we aren't playing. And pony up the three bills too, since we got off on the wrong foot. Leverage. How would the party have gone with no band? Since the band has been together (8 years now) this has happened to us maybe 4times. Not including when we played for door money. Sometimes those figures were questionable. This is for flat fee gigs. In early December after a decent night the bar owner tried to cry poverty to me. It didn't work and we got full pay. Once we get a hard time about pay we really have to think hard about going back. It is not worth arguing over at the end of the night. Last year was the last time it happened to us... They had us doomed from the start. Here is the thread: http://acapella.harmony-central.com/showthread.php?2617487-I-JUST-NEED-TO-VENTWe are not unreasonable though. a couple years ago we played right after our area was hit with a big storm. Almost No one showed and the manager asked us to quit early and take a cut. We did. It is a place we still play and they always take care of us every other time we play there. Comp'd drinks, some bar food occasionally and sometimes a tip at the end of the night. In that situation, yeah, we understand. We didn't take much of a cut but we took one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SpaceNorman Posted January 14, 2011 Members Share Posted January 14, 2011 I can't ever recall any of my "regular" acts being shorted. I did get handed a check that was returned NSF - but a quick trip to small claims court turned into an instant judgement which in turn became pretty much an instant payment. I do recall (it was just this past summer in fact!) playing a sub job in where the band was shorted - however, I personally got my agreed upon rate. I'm sure my good luck is precisely that - luck. I'd like to think that our business accumen has helped us "make our luck" to a large degree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members dan88z Posted January 14, 2011 Members Share Posted January 14, 2011 I got shorted a few months ago, for the 1st time in many many years. The mgr gave the bartender the money, who gave it to us, and it was 50 bucks short. I asked about it, they said we had to talk to the mgr. I have a pretty good relationship with him, so I sent an email the following Monday, and said what had happened. Turns out he couldn't read his own writing in his book, and had the money for me the next time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.