powered speakers vs powerd mixer

[Vito Corleone]

 

Some people see a problem with dragging out extra AC for the powered speaker.

 

 

This is the most commonly stated problem, it seems. And one that is easily overcome in any number of ways with a small amount of thought and effort. Yes, you've got to figure out a way to work within this new paradigm of either coming up with new cables to run alongside the audio cables, or making sure you can run power cables to locations near the speakers. But then once you've done that, you're going to set everything up pretty much the same way every time and the increased time spent running cables in negligible.

 

It only seems to be a problem for those who've never REALLY dealt with powered speakers. I don't really know anyone who owns them and uses them regularly who complains about running power to them.

[tlbonehead]

This is the most commonly stated problem, it seems. And one that is easily overcome in any number of ways with a small amount of thought and effort. Yes, you've got to figure out a way to work within this new paradigm of either coming up with new cables to run alongside the audio cables, or making sure you can run power cables to locations near the speakers. But then once you've done that, you're going to set everything up pretty much the same way every time and the increased time spent running cables in negligible. It only seems to be a problem for those who've never REALLY dealt with powered speakers. I don't really know anyone who owns them and uses them regularly who complains about running power to them.

besides me, and a number of others!

[Vito Corleone]

besides me, and a number of others!

 

Really? How hard is it to run a few extension cords?

[tlbonehead]

Really? How hard is it to run a few extension cords?

not hard at all. But when it seems like we are already running a hundred cables, it is nice to cut down whenever possible. I have both but I still much prefer the simplicity of passive speakers.

[Vito Corleone]

 

not hard at all. But when it seems like we are already running a hundred cables, it is nice to cut down whenever possible. I have both but I still much prefer the simplicity of passive speakers.

 

 

I dunno. I just don't see where it makes THAT much of a difference if once you put any sort of plan behind it.

 

We come into a room. Check out the power situation. "There's a circuit on this outlet here, and another circuit on this outlet there". Fine. Run a power cable from one outlet and drop a 4-way near the left-front corner of the stage and another one over on the right-front. Set up the mains and lights right over the 4-way and plug-em in. Done. If there are outlets on the stage, the backline can plug into that stuff, if not, run another cable or two from the 4-way to the backline. Lights on the truss (hopefully) get a 3rd circuit.

 

Doesn't take much longer to do all that than it took me to type about it. I mean....passive or active, you gotta run extensions cords from SOMEWHERE to SOMEWHERE. We're gonna have power up front anyway to accomodate the front lighting. And power across the back for the back line. It's not a ton of extra work to run power to the cabs, and plus there's no power amps to deal with and haul around.

 

I just don't see the big deal, really.

[Miko Man]

It might take marginally longer to go to each speaker and turn them on and off individually (last on, first off) rather than going to one or two amp racks, but that's not a big issue for me (at the scale I do things). Mark C.

[Vito Corleone]

 

It might take marginally longer to go to each speaker and turn them on and off individually (last on, first off) rather than going to one or two amp racks, but that's not a big issue for me (at the scale I do things). Mark C.

 

 

All in all, we're talking a few extra MINUTES at most if you have any sort of a regular plan to your setup. But to hear some people talk they act as if having to run power to the active cabs is going to cost them another hour.

[tlbonehead]

 

I dunno. I just don't see where it makes THAT much of a difference if once you put any sort of plan behind it. We come into a room. Check out the power situation. "There's a circuit on this outlet here, and another circuit on this outlet there". Fine. Run a power cable from one outlet and drop a 4-way near the left-front corner of the stage and another one over on the right-front. Set up the mains and lights right over the 4-way and plug-em in. Done. If there are outlets on the stage, the backline can plug into that stuff, if not, run another cable or two from the 4-way to the backline. Lights on the truss (hopefully) get a 3rd circuit. Doesn't take much longer to do all that than it took me to type about it. I mean....passive or active, you gotta run extensions cords from SOMEWHERE to SOMEWHERE. We're gonna have power up front anyway to accomodate the front lighting. And power across the back for the back line. It's not a ton of extra work to run power to the cabs, and plus there's no power amps to deal with and haul around. I just don't see the big deal, really.

 

 

not a huge deal, no. But if you have that same approach to everything, a lot of "not that big of a deal(s)" adds up. Especially for a 3-piece band where each individual's rig is pretty extensive, and the are only 3 people to do everything, lights, sound, backdrop, personal gear.

[tlbonehead]

All in all, we're talking a few extra MINUTES at most if you have any sort of a regular plan to your setup. But to hear some people talk they act as if having to run power to the active cabs is going to cost them another hour.

who are you quoting on the "extra hour" thing?

[Vito Corleone]

 

not a huge deal, no. But if you have that same approach to everything, a lot of "not that big of a deal(s)" adds up. Especially for a 3-piece band where each individual's rig is pretty extensive, and the are only 3 people to do everything, lights, sound, backdrop, personal gear.

 

 

Yeah, having only 3 people makes some stuff harder. Then again, bigger band=more stuff.

 

I just don't see it being the deal breaker and hate to give the impression to anyone considering actives vs. passives that it might be.

 

I remember when we first switched to actives setting stuff up and trying to find power and thinking "what a pain in the ass!". But it was really just a matter of getting the right cables and figuring out the most efficient way to set wire up everything.

[Vito Corleone]

 

who are you quoting on the "extra hour" thing?

 

 

I said "act as if". My impression. Not an actual quote.

[tlbonehead]

I said "act as if". My impression. Not an actual quote.

ahh. I've never gotten that impression. I just understand that time is limited for setting up. Whatever you can do to simplify w/o compromising sound is a plus.

[tlbonehead]

Yeah, having only 3 people makes some stuff harder. Then again, bigger band=more stuff. I just don't see it being the deal breaker and hate to give the impression to anyone considering actives vs. passives that it might be. I remember when we first switched to actives setting stuff up and trying to find power and thinking "what a pain in the ass!". But it was really just a matter of getting the right cables and figuring out the most efficient way to set wire up everything.

Sure, after using my active stuff for a couple hundred gigs it was 2nd nature. But when I would go back to the passives it would be like, wow, this is so simple!

[Vito Corleone]

 

ahh. I've never gotten that impression. I just understand that time is limited for setting up. Whatever you can do to simplify w/o compromising sound is a plus.

 

 

Yes. Of course. I think the extra time we spend running power to actives we made up by dumping the heavy amp rack and processors. Sound check became quicker as well.

 

And---especially in a 3 piece---where exactly are you running power to with actives where there isn't power already? You have to run power to the front corners of the stage for your light trees, right? Isn't that where your mains are? And your individual monitor---you have power in that area for your pedal board, right?

 

For us the biggest pain was usually running power to monitors up front and center. But then we eliminated all of that stuff by switching to IEMs. Talk about a time saver! Not dealing with setting up monitors, EQing them, sound checking them.....THAT cut a HUGE chunk of time out of set up.

[Miko Man]

Although somewhat OT for the solo and duo forum, I like the scaleabilty of active speakers, including the ability to quickly add fills or another monitor on short notice. Not everybody has that need or desire. Mark C.

[tlbonehead]

Although somewhat OT for the solo and duo forum, I like the scaleabilty of active speakers, including the ability to quickly add fills or another monitor on short notice. Not everybody has that need or desire. Mark C.

all my power amps are 2 ohm capable so it is usually as simple as daisy-chaining speakers.

[Miko Man]

 

all my power amps are 2 ohm capable so it is usually as simple as daisy-chaining speakers.

 

 

No disrespect intended of your choice/perspective/preference. I'm a bit giddy with all of the output options I now have with my (new) MixWiz3. Again, somewhat OT in this forum. My apologies to the solo performers. Mark C.

[TIMKEYS]

 

I am in the camp that there are pros and cons with powered and passive speakers, and that it depends on the application and personal preferences which is preferable. This being said... I was willing to go either way, passive or powered speakers, as I determined either could meet my needs, but all I found used and local that was of decent quality was the former. So I went with a powered mixer and passive speakers because I was able to find what I consider to be good quality components local, used, and VERY inexpensive. I have yet to see many decent quality powered speakers for sale in my area. Harbinger, Behringer, and the like abound...

 

 

Thats because the people who have powered speakers generally are happy with them. You can use them for so many things , no one gets rid of them. You needed the most PA for the dollar used. No doubt passive was the way to go. We have a couple of passive 15 eons we use as a house system that runs a little crown amp. It sounds great. It also doesnt have to move.

[donkey 12]

 

Thats because the people who have powered speakers generally are happy with them. You can use them for so many things , no one gets rid of them. You needed the most PA for the dollar used. No doubt passive was the way to go. We have a couple of passive 15 eons we use as a house system that runs a little crown amp. It sounds great. It also doesnt have to move.

 

 

I think that satisfaction with powered speakers is probably part of the story. But bands break up and sell gear whether they have powered or passive speakers. In time, I expect more quality, used powered speakers to become available locally.

[tlbonehead]

No disrespect intended of your choice/perspective/preference. I'm a bit giddy with all of the output options I now have with my (new) MixWiz3. Again, somewhat OT in this forum. My apologies to the solo performers. Mark C.

not a problem my friend. We are all just voicing our personal preferences.

[J.Paul]

So (if my thinking is correct) in trying to keep things compact :

 

most people that use powered speakers will use a simple (non-powered) mixer such as http://www.musiciansfriend.com/pro-audio/yamaha-mg82cx-8-input-stereo-mixer-with-compression-and-effects

but these types of mixers don't have a graphic for the room (only shelving for the channel).

 

You don't add a one space graphic to the small non power do you? (that defeats the portability)

 

and you certainly don't gig (w/ vocals) w/out a graphic EQ.

 

What am I missing?

[Terry Allan Hall]

Both are about equally useful and about equally PIA...it's just a matter of what you like.

 

Either will do the job.

[Bob Dey]

 

So (if my thinking is correct) in trying to keep things compact : most people that use powered speakers will use a simple (non-powered) mixer such as http://www.musiciansfriend.com/pro-audio/yamaha-mg82cx-8-input-stereo-mixer-with-compression-and-effects but these types of mixers don't have a graphic for the room (only shelving for the channel). You don't add a one space graphic to the small non power do you? (that defeats the portability) and you certainly don't gig (w/ vocals) w/out a graphic EQ. What am I missing?

 

 

You can get a bigger mixer with graphic EQ built in if you want, but I found graphic eq unnecessary when I started using the Mackies. I know of bands that literally took the EQs out of the rack after switching to mid level powered speakers.

[modulusman]

 

So (if my thinking is correct) in trying to keep things compact : most people that use powered speakers will use a simple (non-powered) mixer such as http://www.musiciansfriend.com/pro-audio/yamaha-mg82cx-8-input-stereo-mixer-with-compression-and-effects but these types of mixers don't have a graphic for the room (only shelving for the channel). You don't add a one space graphic to the small non power do you? (that defeats the portability) and you certainly don't gig (w/ vocals) w/out a graphic EQ. What am I missing?

 

 

The graphic EQs built into most box mixers are a joke IME. Decent powered speakers will sound good without an outboard EQ. That isn't saying a graphic EQ can't make them sound better.

[Howie22]

 

All in all, we're talking a few extra MINUTES at most if you have any sort of a regular plan to your setup. But to hear some people talk they act as if having to run power to the active cabs is going to cost them another hour.

 

 

No, it isn't a huge deal, but it is more hassle.

 

For small gigs, I have a couple of options. I can take my bigger system, which is a passive system with a powered head and two cabs - one for main and one for monitor. The other option is to use my smaller powered monitor as a main, then use my hot spot as a monitor.

 

For the passive setup, there is one power plug for the entire system. No extension cords necessary. Plug that in, then speaker cables to the speakers. Done. With the smaller powered system, I need to add a power strip, potentially two extension cords, the two power cords for the powered speakers, and line level cables to the speakers.

 

You are right, it's minutes worth of work. However, it is extra cables to dig out of my cable box and wrap back up. A big deal? Not really. But, the passive system is definitely easier for small gigs where I can pack up and load out in ten minutes. I'm sure a lot of it is that I'm just used to the passive system - I've probably used it for a couple hundred gigs. The new smaller powered system has only been used for a handful of gigs.