Members Bajazz Posted May 15, 2011 Members Share Posted May 15, 2011 Well, I'd say that there is big difference in volume amongst vocalists and most of it lies in projection. Read: Resonance. I've been a loud speaker (and talker) all my life, but even then I was able to notch up the volume from a vocal coach who thaught me to alter the room in my moth, project the sound upwards in the soft palate and forward + doing small adjustments regarding vowel production. All this leading to the effect that I am able to outsing a acoustic drumset played by a drummer who can play drums without killing them. I've performed several times as a band (without PA) singing pure unplugged and had no problems projecting the voice clear without yelling my lungs out. Opera and classical trained singers are often much better at using their body for resonance. So While I won't rule out playing with the mixer knobs: If the singer is very silent as the OP says, then she has much potential technique-wise. Guaranteed. But this will take some time, although results are shown in days, IME as a vocal trainer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted May 16, 2011 CMS Author Share Posted May 16, 2011 I think it's funny that the bulk of the answers whenever there is a question like this are "get some lessons". Well maybe they've had lessons ... or ... maybe they want the exact tone they currently get. Anyone here ever work with Michael McDonald or Tom Petty? They sing so f%*king quiet it's amazing anyone ever hears them. Maybe they need lessons. I think the OP is asking what can be done with the sound system to make the improvement he wants. Obviously there gets to a point whene you can no longer simply turn up because you run into feedback. Here's what I do when in this situation. Have the singer eat the mic. The difference in the output of the mic between 2" and 1" is 4x the output and between 2" and 1/2" is 8x. There increases do not change the feedback threshold. A device like a Fatso Jr (or others) can increase the apparent loudness by adding a little harmonic distortion. An exciter( like an Aphex or BBE) can help bring the vocal out to the front of the mix without causing feedback Just because they're famous doesn't mean they aren't a PITA. Someone who's never had lessons should get lessons unless they're amazing right out of the gate. It makes no sense to NOT maximize whatever gifts a singer has. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members StratGuy22 Posted May 16, 2011 Members Share Posted May 16, 2011 Thought the singer was some guy's wife? wonder how that would go over firing some guy's wife from the band. Ahhh ok, one of those kinds of bands. Well, good luck!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members abzurd Posted May 16, 2011 Members Share Posted May 16, 2011 Voice is unique as you are both the instrument and the player (very Zen). Any time you mess with one you affect the other, sometimes in a good way and sometimes not. It's impossible to know where the issue is without knowing the person and working with them. Lessons may be warranted, and you don't know unless you try, but they may prove fruitless, or even destructive.... I can hear an overly or improperly trained voice a mile away. In this case they don't want to alter the characteristics of the sound, just make it louder. That's much easier said than done. The tone will have a tendancy to change when the instrument is played differently. The same is true of most instruments. In cases where the same notes can be sung in full voice or falsetto there are additional complexities. It's kind of like changing pickups, or sound patches while playing guitar. Sometimes you want the whole song to be seamless and sometimes you want a distinct tonal differences throughout the tune. Not hearing the person I don't know if the material is out of range for her "full voice", if it's a confidence issue, or if her voice is just simply meek. The easiest solution is something like an Audix OM5 or OM7 and eating the mic, a technique that can be taught. If you can't get enough gain out of that, then the person has no business performing live until they can come to a volume that's acceptable to the limitations of the live performance situation they're in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members dboomer Posted May 16, 2011 Members Share Posted May 16, 2011 Just because they're famous doesn't mean they aren't a PITA. Someone who's never had lessons should get lessons unless they're amazing right out of the gate. It makes no sense to NOT maximize whatever gifts a singer has. I remember TP discussing the vocal lessons he was taking way back in the early 70's (when I worked with them). It might have helped, but he still is so low in power that the backline is often as loud in his mic as he is. That's Scovill's problem now;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted May 16, 2011 CMS Author Share Posted May 16, 2011 I remember TP discussing the vocal lessons he was taking way back in the early 70's (when I worked with them). It might have helped, but he still is so low in power that the backline is often as loud in his mic as he is. That's Scovill's problem now;) My point was that it's worth discovering whether there's a great *and* powerful voice lurking inside the singer. Lessons are not expensive, and even if volume and projection are 'fixed assets', learning how to breathe, and pitch control, can't be bad things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members W. M. Hellinger Posted May 17, 2011 Members Share Posted May 17, 2011 I agree that lesson(s) could well be in order. I suspect that marriage counselors exist for a reason... and it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lifeloverwg Posted May 17, 2011 Members Share Posted May 17, 2011 I agree that lesson(s) could well be in order. I suspect that marriage counselors exist for a reason... and it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted May 17, 2011 CMS Author Share Posted May 17, 2011 I feel as if the state has been transported to the Pacific Northwest...seems like it has rained 4 out of 5 days for the past several weeks, and before that it was just cold. No spring for you!!!! We'll go straight from cold to wet to hot and humid. I've got a couple of construction projects that I can't get off the ground...you can't build a raised floor (pier and beam) building and insulate the floor without at least a week of dry weather. I can tarp the floor deck after it's built, but once the walls go up, the roof has to be framed and at least sheathed in order to keep the decking dry....tarping the floor when only walls are up would only result in an above-ground pool! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted May 17, 2011 Members Share Posted May 17, 2011 Yeah, what is with the rain? I have a large outdoor event to load into tomorrow and there's snow in the near vicinity. What's up with that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ryan. Posted May 17, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 17, 2011 Tell me about it. I'm just trying to break out the BBQ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members W. M. Hellinger Posted May 18, 2011 Members Share Posted May 18, 2011 We're 5 degrees warmer so the snow will only be in the mountains. Mountain forecast is for 12"-18" this week of additional snowpack. Alta ski area still has 150" on the ground and eventually it will suddenly be 90 degrees here, then look out in the flood areas. My gardens still too wet, but I'm putting my tomatoes out tomorrow anyway. As I understand it, our April was the second coldest on record (going back to the mid 1800's). May is following suit. Since Feb. I think we've had a few days that were in the neighborhood of season normal temps... typically our daytime highs are consistantly 10 to 20 degrees below seasonal normals... and stupid amounts of rain. The trees around here are just starting to bud... which should have happened about this time LAST month. Anyhoo: Typically we are garden planting in earnest about the time of "Good Friday". I attempted to rotortill our garden Easter weekend (being one of the latest Easter weekends that can be).... and it was hopeless... basically Liz (driving our Tahoe) pulling our garden tractor through the garden plot with a 150ft. chain... and I was just chruning soup. We planted last weekend... basically resorting to planting stuff that stands some chance of making it while being planted in a complete mud bog. We just planted onion sets, spuds, corn, beans & peas... My theory is that if it's planted... it stands a better chance of growing than if it isn't planted. As far as putting the tomatoes out... I think that would still be rushing the season here (this year) as here's what my helper Brian's bike looked like yesterday... mid day after we pushed it inside: For crying-out-loud: The 8th of May was a week ago... and a week ago, if we'd attempted any sort of May 8th activities, she'd have thought I was a great lover, when the reality of the situation would have been that I'd have been frozen stiff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Coaster Posted May 18, 2011 Members Share Posted May 18, 2011 its all the barium and aluminum they are dispersing in the atmosphere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Tburn Posted May 18, 2011 Members Share Posted May 18, 2011 Put her in a totally sound proof box,turn her a*s up, and yaaaaaa no feedback. I'd pay to see that live. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jlb Posted May 18, 2011 Members Share Posted May 18, 2011 its all the barium and aluminum they are dispersing in the atmosphere. Build yourself a "Chembuster" and watch the weather improve before your eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted May 18, 2011 CMS Author Share Posted May 18, 2011 Mark, Few things sadder than snow on a scooter. How did you score Home Depot racks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members srp72ee Posted May 18, 2011 Members Share Posted May 18, 2011 Weather here in Ohio is pretty screwed up too. 35 Out of the last 42 days have seen some rain, cold too (but at least no snow [knock on wood]). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members W. M. Hellinger Posted May 18, 2011 Members Share Posted May 18, 2011 How did you score Home Depot racks? I went to the local scrap iron yard to pick up some supplies to build a couple new benches with (as part of the project that involved the previously discussed drywall work)... the scrap yard had a mountain of ex-Home Depot pallet racks... and that's what I came home with. I'm just putting the finishing touches on the benches... the rack erector-set seems to be working out well for the project. The goal was square, level, solid, reasonably cost effective benches... and by my standards, the goal is being fairly well met. It baffles me why HD scrapped out those racks... most of them looked to me like they were all-but new, with the exception of quite a few stickers on some of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RoadRanger Posted May 18, 2011 Members Share Posted May 18, 2011 HD was phasing out orange in favor of a more "female friendly" color. I trucked quite a bit of the orange to a used equipment vendor's warehouse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members W. M. Hellinger Posted May 18, 2011 Members Share Posted May 18, 2011 Where the racks orange? HD was phasing those out in favor of a more "female friendly" color. I trucked quite a bit of the orange to a used equipment vendor's warehouse. About 50/50 mix of orange beams (the cross bars) and white beams. The towers were all forest green. So what's the new fem friendly color? Seems like most of the gals I know... their favorite color is chrome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RoadRanger Posted May 19, 2011 Members Share Posted May 19, 2011 I think at the time (a few years back) they were going to the green. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rodclement Posted May 19, 2011 Members Share Posted May 19, 2011 About 50/50 mix of orange beams (the cross bars) and white beams. The towers were all forest green.So what's the new fem friendly color?Seems like most of the gals I know... their favorite color is chrome. Most of the ones I know love green..as in $$$ green! Rod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members IsildursBane Posted May 19, 2011 Members Share Posted May 19, 2011 It baffles me why HD scrapped out those racks... most of them looked to me like they were all-but new, with the exception of quite a few stickers on some of them. I have two guesses: the first is that a particular Home Depot store was liquidated and either no one bought the shelves or whomever did ultimately scrapped them. I've been to a couple of these auctions and shelving is typically sold off in large lots - maybe the buyer didn't want or need the whole lot. My second guess is that somebody backed a forklift into the corner of a long row of shelves and did a bit of damage to it. Rather than just replace one section and pray to the liability gods that the rest of it was ok, they scrapped the whole thing. ETA: or I could have read the thread and seen that they were changing color schemes. -Dan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dogoth Posted May 19, 2011 Members Share Posted May 19, 2011 HD was phasing out orange in favor of a more "female friendly" color. Ya but at the current cost of steel.....has anyone heard of paint? We all know that labor is cheap these days. I guess that's corporate thinking for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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