will setup handle 1000 people outside for multiple bands

[agedhorse]

Yeah, pretty much so Mark. It's kind of like a surgeon asking how to do something probably isn't the guy that should be leading the operation

[Unalaska]

I've got a system with the jbl sp225/128s 2 over 2 powered with Yamaha p7ks. It's enough but I could see I being an issue if you're going for crazy loud. I think it's about perfect and I'd happily replace the tops with 722s. 2/3 the weight.

[RoadRanger]

Kinda funny - the sound provider of choice by the town for this town's 1000(+?) cap venue a couple miles from me uses a pair of original Eon's pointed straight out (no angle between) separated by a single Mackie powered sub (yes, those "wonderful" old bandpass ones) on each side. Guess them Eons don't comb . Perhaps this will explain why I'm not particularly concerned when providing there myself . OTOH this guy has a bunch of them Eons that have long ago paid for themselves so the jokes on me I guess. It really is about who you (kn)ow .

 

The stage is the real deal, full size and covered with a backstage area w/bathroom, 200 amp service with two portable distros plus plenty of 110 outlets and range outlets if you need more . They even have power out at the FOH position! Too bad it's not fenced in - so it's only used a half dozen times a year as it only allows free events and requires police to direct traffic, it's right on a main street and the majority of the parking is across that street .

[jahman]

Hi guys,

thanks to everyone for there inputs so far.

let me add few things, we have done( large) outdoor shows with this setup, but not at this particular venue.

the last show we did outdoors was about 600 people and I had nothing but complements on how the system sound.

when I put this system together, the idea was to get good tops, good powered subs and arguably the best power amps made for mids and highs. (Lab Gruppen)

 

as far as reggae music I've played it all my life.

I used to play in a reggae band that opened for the Wailers, Third World, Toots& the Maytals , steel pulse, Inner Circle, Yellow man and many more. we opened for these bands many times, so I know quite a lot about the music.

 

I decided to run the JBLSRX722 off the fp+4000 which would be 1600 watts @ 4 ohms stereo and use the fp6400 to run the SRX715 which 1300 watts @ 8 ohm stereo. that how I normally run them for large shows.

[Axisplayer]

The system mentioned here is iffy but sort of what my system was like when I still had the business. I had four QRX212 tops (EV equivalent of the SRX722) powered by 2x XTI4000 amps. I had four Yorkville LS1208 subs (bigger brother to the LS800s he has) powered by an ITech 6000. I often worked crowds this size outdoors with a modern country band. I center clustered the subs (Four 1208s together is a nice thump) and the tops sat on the outside edges of a large elevated stage (permanent structure where the stage was 7' high.) With tops high enough, and subs clustered, we did a number of shows for 1000+.

 

It was not crushing loud, unless you were near the stage. It was clearly audible, and only slightly louder than what a normal conversation might be at the distance the covered seating was at. These were family event country fairs, not concerts. Not everyone was expecting to hear concert levels. In most ways, it was more background music to people walking around shopping than sitting for a show. A few hundred came up close to listen and dance. The rest wandered aimlessly buying trinkets and hotdogs.

 

If this is the sort of event you are working, you will be on the edge of adequate, and maybe below depending on the reggae bands expectations. You might be able to pull it off, but remember I had twice the tops you have, plenty of elevation on the tops, and an easier genre of music. I also had 50 years experience and judgement. I don't know your experience, but based on the questions, I assume it to be less.

 

You need at least one more pair of SRX722s, scaffolding or some other mechanism for elevation, reasonable expectations, and a dose of good luck. And after you have all of these things, it will still be marginal. Much of the odds either way will depend on you as much as anything. Don't push the system beyond what it does safely, expect to get complaints from the bands if not enough, and don't listen to the punters that keep saying "turn it up!" If you get control of these things, you might be ok. Remember, a soft 2 hour show is much better than a loud 15 minute show followed by 115 minutes of silence and complaints while you assess damage.

[jahman]

Axis player you forget the pair of SRX715, properly powered they get almost as loud as your qrx 212 only a few db lower.

[Axisplayer]

The SRX715 has a max of 131db, the SRX722 and the QRX212 are both 135db max. That is a noticeable difference, especially if you are counting on using them combined with the 722 for mains. That 4 db represents dropping the wattage to the 722 by more than half (theoretically.)

[Pro Sound Guy]

Kind of a mismatch in boxes:?...I say! said the old british man...A pile of boxes.

More OUTPUT = MORE boxes.

You are covering square feet no matter how many humans there are.

Have you considered flipping the 2way 15" inch boxes on top of the dual 12 boxes with horn side down? Horns together in a vertical array,

This would give you MUCH better coverage to the back of the coverage area.

Strap them down on top of the dual 12" two way loudspeakers..

Take care you dont heat the coils up to badly with over powering them!

 

 

[Audiopile]

Hi guys,

we have done( large) outdoor shows with this setup, but not at this particular venue.

the last show we did outdoors was about 600 people and I had nothing but complements on how the system sound.

I'll suggest that if your system delivered acceptable results for an outdoor crowd of 600, it will likely cover a crowd of 1000 ok. Of-course much depends on the crowd, venue, genre of music, etc...

 

And SPL is very subjective. There may be some tweaks you can apply to tip the balance of subjective-ness in your favor. In years (decades) gone by I used to pull out about -6dB or more of 120 hz. at an 18dB slope... which on the system I was running at the time reduced "muddiness" while lessening the loads on both the subs and mid-highs. Aux driving the subs also seemed to deliver a cleaner, punchier sound while seemingly increasing the headroom of the system. I'd high pass everything that could be high-passed without throwing the baby out with the bathwater, including keyboards. Running the system in mono seemed to deliver "more" for free. Letting the backline gear (like the bass and keyboard amps) take more of the load helped at times... I'd suggest the bass player "could be a little louder" if the bass rig was capable and sounded good and I didn't have comfortably enough rig for the gig.

 

And remember, you'll probably be more-likely asked back even if it's a little less SPL than "optimum" so-long as everything on your part goes smooth, vs. a stupid loud cluster of a show.

 

I dunno... I just throwing that out there for consideration.

 

 

[Unalaska]

I am less interested in the power handling of than but the output. Why put so much power behind a box of you aren't needing it there? Sub information will take more power. Use it there.

 

 

 

Except I don't see a sub situation that keeps up with the tops. So I'm not sure what to recommend.

 

 

 

ill use all caps if it helps.

 

 

 

BECAUSE YOU ASKED IF IT WAS ENOUG THEN I DONT THINK YOU CAN PULL THIS OFF AS BEING ENOUGH. WE HAVENT EVEN GOTTEN TO GAIN STAGING OR MIXING YET. SO ASK YOURSELF IS IT ENOUGH FOR SOMEONE YOU DONT KNOW TO WALK UP AND MIX. PROBABLY NOT. START THERE. RENT THE REST.

[Unalaska]

Stuff like this will pale in comparison to day of problems you're going to face: how to organize the "helpers" when you load/unload. How to deal with the keyboard player who showed up with 10 inputs. Or the lead singer who hates you. Or the bad power coming from the generator. Or the heat that day. Or the rain that day. If you're asking basic "how the f do I hook up my car stereo" then you're lost.

[Craig Vecchione]

I agree that I used the wrong preposition inadvertently, but find it difficult to believe that, given the context of discussion and your understanding of the difference between "at" and "with", you'd be unsure what I meant..... ;-)

 

 

[jahman]

Unalaska, the subs are powered Yorkville's ls800p and the four subs have no problem keeping up with the top boxes. Again ,we do outdoor shows all the time. we did one last year with six bands , just not at this venue. the venue has more than adequate power, parking, etc.I plan to splay the pair of srx715 wide for coverage and srx722 forward.

I am a musician turned sound guy. I know all the needs of the bands. I usually run the srx722 off the lab GRUPPEN fp+4000 1600 watts @4 ohms and the srx715 lab GRUPPEN FP6400 1300 watts @ 8 ohms.

I've checked with jbl and they informed me the power a little low for those boxes. no generator needed.

[Craig Vecchione]

Returning to this thread and reading the additional details, it sounds like the system should be adequate, but as axisplayer commented, it's a bit "iffy", in that the speakers are likely to be pushed pretty hard. And as Andy noted, those JBL's aren't cheap to recone.

 

Be very aware of the levels you're running the system with, and resist the urge to bump it up as the day progresses and ears fatigue.

 

Do dis, and bamba yay the bashment be irie !

[dboomer]

I'm not "unsure". But "having" a large power amp and running it like crazy are two different things. Just because you can rev your car engine above the red line doesn't mean that you should or do. In any case speakers have a power rating that requires you running at full power continuously for hours. That is never gonna happen running music through a system. In my experience you can run short bursts at 5X rated power and likely experience no failures. It's not the "power" so much that causes failures. It's far,far more likely not using proper HP filtering that is the problem. Bad driving is a much greater problem then over powering. All that said ... if you have to ask the question you would be a lot better off using self powered speakers.

[RoadRanger]

That reminds me, I still have a couple Mark II RCF 310a's that got shook apart but should be easily repairable. One should just need tightening up, the other sounds like a loose connection at higher SPL's. I still can't believe how arfin' loud they can get. I've been running the Mark III's lately - even putting kick and toms in them with no subs for "ear friendly" 7-11pm classic rock / R&B shows for us older folks .

[jahman]

Craig, I've had this setup for years, done many outdoor shows, and have never damaged a driver. all drivers are original. first I do not push those speakers beyond their limit, second those LABS have speaker protection second to none.

I do believe in powering speaker more than their continuous rms rating. I've got lots of advice on reggae, as I've said before, I played in a band that have opened for many of the top reggae artist in the world.

[Pro Sound Guy]

I have to ask why you would ask the group here if your system can handle this show?

You seem to want to challenge the suggestions here and insist you have this locked down tight with all your experience with doing live sound reproduction?

The suggestions here are all very good and yes 1.5X RMS is really a good idea.

Several of the guys here have light years more experience in pro audio with national and regional acts.

Good luck with your show.

 

[jahman]

Pro Sound Guy, please check the wattage in my prior post and you'll see it is about 1.5x rms.

the two things I pushed back on was the notion that i'm going to damage the speakers that I've been running the for years with no issues, and what is needed by reggae acts, a style of music I've playing and been around all my life. several of the opinions were taking to heart.

 

[agedhorse]

Never mind my opinions, or learn from my experience then.

 

I only toured with, and provided PA for several well known national Reggae acts going back as far as the early 1980's, including the first Reggae act ever played on MTV... The band was Afrikan Dreamland, featuring Aashid Himons, the tallest man in Reggae (who sadly passed away a few years ago). I also recorded one of their live albums on one of those tours. They were some of the nicest folks I have ever worked with.

[Axisplayer]

Never mind my opinions' date=' or learn from my experience then[/quote']

 

Andy, he was looking for someone with experience and knowledge. Maybe next time….

[StratGuy22]

Be sure to let us know how the gig goes.

[jahman]

Thank you StratGuy22.

I will let you know how it goes. I have no doubt it will be good. I was born in the islands and have been around reggae and calypso all my life. I started in high school had dreads back in the1978 so it is a life style for me. I cut the dreads when i joined the navy. Did 20 years and then got back to my life style. So everything ire.

[agedhorse]

I cut the dreads when i joined the navy.

I'm sure you did... before the Navy did it for you

 

Did 20 years and then got back to my life style.

And a sincere thank you from the bottom of my heart.

 

 

[OneEng]

Thank you StratGuy22.

I will let you know how it goes. I have no doubt it will be good. I was born in the islands and have been around reggae and calypso all my life. I started in high school had dreads back in the1978 so it is a life style for me. I cut the dreads when i joined the navy. Did 20 years and then got back to my life style. So everything ire.

 

A fellow squid! I did 6.... that was about all I could take on sub duty

 

BTW, the crew that did the hair cutting took maniacal pleasure in shaving those who had more hair, or interesting hair designs. I remember one guy that got a tick-tack-toe shaved into his head before it was then shaved completely off. It is an interesting thing to see a group of say 80 young men out on the "grinder" (slang for pavement) rubbing their razor stubble over their tan-less shaven heads