Members Ibebucked Posted March 9, 2009 Members Share Posted March 9, 2009 bottom line is that even if he lied....the only person that can prove that he lied is too irresponsible to be able to prove it.APO owes the money. Bingo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jnurp Posted March 9, 2009 Members Share Posted March 9, 2009 I think its pretty safe to say that Apor really came out looking really bad here and is probably going to lose a huge portion of the business he was looking to do seeing as he only frequents the forums to peddle pedals. what a horrible miscalculation on his part. Dont run away when your transactions go bad...this couldnt have turned out worse for the dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Foulacy Posted March 9, 2009 Members Share Posted March 9, 2009 any chance that the buyer lied about not getting the {censored}? (playing devils advocate) why would he? as the story has unfolded so far, he gains nothing from doing that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Tube_Tone Posted March 9, 2009 Members Share Posted March 9, 2009 Its possible that APO and Hives have had good deals but maybe its because if he ripped Hives off and hives started flaming him more people would side with hives because he has more posts and more time here, but in ripping off a new member Apo knew that more people would side with him and people would just think that this guy is starting trouble cause hes more of a new member Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members b_nehpets Posted March 9, 2009 Members Share Posted March 9, 2009 why would he? as the story has unfolded so far, he gains nothing from doing that. cause i know apo in real life... he's not a liar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members hivedestruction Posted March 9, 2009 Members Share Posted March 9, 2009 why would he? as the story has unfolded so far, he gains nothing from doing that. No... He gains peer pressure for free gear (in the event he did actually receive the item.. I don't know one way or the other and neither does anyone else so stop acting like you do). I've been in a VERY similar situation only involving ebay.. I shipped something out, buyer received it (I had delivery confirmation showing it was delivered). Guy said he never received it and opened a dispute. I even HAD proof of delivery, gave it to paypal. The guy argued that it should have been signed for, and paypal sided with him. Even at the time I thought "Yea, maybe it should have been signed for".. ..Low and behold, I got an email from another member asking me if this had happened to me, and the same guy did it to him as well for another pedal. Now, I'm not saying this is the situation happening, however I can obviously see apor's side a LOT more than the other dudes.. Everything else is just SPECULATION because there's no PROOF of anything other than these guys agreeing that they did a trade with each other.. Also, a question to everyone attacking apor for this.. Have ANY of you had any dealings with the other guy? Or are you just trying to play hero? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members moops Posted March 9, 2009 Members Share Posted March 9, 2009 screw both of em Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members hivedestruction Posted March 9, 2009 Members Share Posted March 9, 2009 Be honest, you may have had a positive transaction with the guy in the past, but you cannot possibly think that the guy has handled his business properly reguarding this transaction. The thing is this.. I don't know either way what happened for sure, and guess what? Neither do you. That's the whole point of my argument. No one knows what happened for sure except apor and putz.. Can you not agree with that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Clonexx Posted March 9, 2009 Members Share Posted March 9, 2009 I think its pretty safe to say that Apor really came out looking really bad here and is probably going to lose a huge portion of the business he was looking to do seeing as he only frequents the forums to peddle pedals. what a horrible miscalculation on his part. Dont run away when your transactions go bad...this couldnt have turned out worse for the dude. Actually it's like you and..uh..3? other people saying that. The rest of us all have said we would deal with him without hesitation. As a matter of fact, I have seen him make several trades/sales/deals since this thread popped up. That sort of blows your theory out of the water man...sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jnurp Posted March 9, 2009 Members Share Posted March 9, 2009 The thing is this.. I don't know either way what happened for sure, and guess what? Neither do you. That's the whole point of my argument. No one knows what happened for sure except apor and putz.. Can you not agree with that? no doubt i agree 100%, but you cannot argue, not for a single momment, that apor has handled this with any dignity or class whatsoever. He has basically told this dude go {censored} yourself. Thats what i cant get past. I actually believe he did send the pedals out based on the testimonials given here in this thread. However, this kid has neglected to act like a responsible and trustworthy seller after the sale and that is what pisses me off about him. His {censored}ing attitude is smug and he declines to even look into the matter. If i send an item to a person here and they say they never got it, i would press the {censored} out of every single avenue possible to rectify the situation as im sure you would and probably 99% of us here. This kid has done nothing to help resolve the situation and has left the buyer in gear purgatory. I find that reprehensible and completely unacceptable as do countless others as seen by the myriad of negative replies. I trade an awful lot here on HC, i dont want this {censored} to happen to me or any other forumite. so the best thing to do when there is a weed is to spray some {censored} on it and make it go away which is what this thread is doing. The weed is not neccesarily apor persay, but bad traders in general. Cmon man, the dude is not a quality trader/forumite if he cant be bothered to even look into the matter, thats just wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jnurp Posted March 9, 2009 Members Share Posted March 9, 2009 Actually it's like you and..uh..3? other people saying that. The rest of us all have said we would deal with him without hesitation. As a matter of fact, I have seen him make several trades/sales/deals since this thread popped up. That sort of blows your theory out of the water man...sorry. read the entire thread, its a lot more than 3 others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members hivedestruction Posted March 9, 2009 Members Share Posted March 9, 2009 no doubt i agree 100%, but you cannot argue, not for a single momment, that apor has handled this with any dignity or class whatsoever. He has basically told this dude go {censored} yourself. Thats what i cant get past. I actually believe he did send the pedals out based on the testimonials given here in this thread. However, this kid has neglected to act like a responsible and trustworthy seller after the sale and that is what pisses me off about him. His {censored}ing attitude is smug and he declines to even look into the matter. If i send an item to a person here and they say they never got it, i would press the {censored} out of every single avenue possible to rectify the situation as im sure you would and probably 99% of us here. This kid has done nothing to help resolve the situation and has left the buyer in gear purgatory. I find that reprehensible and completely unacceptable as do countless others as seen by the myriad of negative replies. I trade an awful lot here on HC, i dont want this {censored} to happen to me or any other forumite. so the best thing to do when there is a weed is to spray some {censored} on it and make it go away which is what this thread is doing. The weed is not neccesarily apor persay, but bad traders in general. Cmon man, the dude is not a quality trader/forumite if he cant be bothered to even look into the matter, thats just wrong. Fair enough.. I can agree with most of this. I guess I'll just leave it at that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Lonely Tourist Posted March 9, 2009 Members Share Posted March 9, 2009 Can somone recap this thread for me? i don't want to read the whole thing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BoredGuitarist7 Posted March 9, 2009 Members Share Posted March 9, 2009 Can somone recap this thread for me? i don't want to read the whole thing...Puntz says Porecelain didn't send him pedals he promised. Porcelain says he shipped out the pedals weeks before the guitar was sent, as it was sent very late. The guitar was also damaged, and Porcelain was not told about it. Porcelain cannot find the tracking number to prove the pedals were shipped to Puntz, but he does have a Paypal receipt to verify that the money that was supposed to be sent on Porcelain's end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Clonexx Posted March 9, 2009 Members Share Posted March 9, 2009 no doubt i agree 100%, but you cannot argue, not for a single momment, that apor has handled this with any dignity or class whatsoever. He has basically told this dude go {censored} yourself. Thats what i cant get past. I actually believe he did send the pedals out based on the testimonials given here in this thread. However, this kid has neglected to act like a responsible and trustworthy seller after the sale and that is what pisses me off about him. His {censored}ing attitude is smug and he declines to even look into the matter. If i send an item to a person here and they say they never got it, i would press the {censored} out of every single avenue possible to rectify the situation as im sure you would and probably 99% of us here. This kid has done nothing to help resolve the situation and has left the buyer in gear purgatory. I find that reprehensible and completely unacceptable as do countless others as seen by the myriad of negative replies. I trade an awful lot here on HC, i dont want this {censored} to happen to me or any other forumite. so the best thing to do when there is a weed is to spray some {censored} on it and make it go away which is what this thread is doing. The weed is not neccesarily apor persay, but bad traders in general. Cmon man, the dude is not a quality trader/forumite if he cant be bothered to even look into the matter, thats just wrong. If you read back, Apo went to the USPS looking for confirmation and they told him they couldn't help him, which I can believe because they have done the same thing to me. If you don't use delivery confirmation and/or signature required, the USPS pretty much has zero tracking, they will blow you off if you ask for any sort of tracking or delivery info. That being the case, what else can he do? He did look into it as far as the USPS let him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ibebucked Posted March 9, 2009 Members Share Posted March 9, 2009 what else can he do? He did look into it as far as the USPS let him. He can pay Putz is what he can do, as he didn't do what he should have in the beginning. Your position if I am hearing you right is that he screwed up by not getting a signature confirmation and because he can't correct that screw up now with USPS then he should just be allowed to throw his hands in the air and say "oh well"? It's Apo's problem that he was too cheap to pay for the confirmation and insurance. Most of the time it probably works out okay to not pay for insurance or shipping confirmation (which Putz claims he paid for by the way when he shipped his guitar to Apo) but this time it didnt work out so Apo needs to pay up - that's what he can do! It's kinda like not having car insurance which you only need if there's a wreck, and under your theory if you don't have it then you can just tell the other guy "sorry"...no, you pony up. Pay to play! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Clonexx Posted March 9, 2009 Members Share Posted March 9, 2009 He can pay Putz is what he can do, as he didn't do what he should have in the beginning. Your position if I am hearing you right is that he screwed up by not getting a signature confirmation and because he can't correct that screw up now with USPS then he should just be allowed to throw his hands in the air and say "oh well"? It's Apo's problem that he was too cheap to pay for the confirmation and insurance. Most of the time it probably works out okay to not pay for insurance or shipping confirmation (which Putz claims he paid for by the way when he shipped his guitar to Apo) but this time it didnt work out so Apo needs to pay up - that's what he can do! It's kinda like not having car insurance which you only need if there's a wreck, and under your theory if you don't have it then you can't just tell the other guy "sorry"...no, you pony up. Pay to play!No..my position is not only did Apo screw up, but so did Putz as well. My position is also that I do not fully believe Putz that he didn't actually get the pedals, so any money or restitution sent by Apo would just be extra icing for him.Like I've said before, I just don't get why people believe Putz at face value but not Apo, who has many many references including a face to face transaction that say he's an honest guy. I personally believe he did send the pedals, but I have no way of knowing that for sure just like I have no way of knowing Putz did or didn't get them.They BOTH need to meet in the middle and come up with a compromise where they BOTH lose out a little instead of just Apo or Putz losing out a lot. However, that is up to them and not us. Putz went about this in such a horrible way that Apo just doesn't even want to talk to the guy anymore. There's nothing I can do about that, or anyone else for that matter.Neither of them have come out of this smelling rosey. I will tell you this though, I would trade with Apo in a heartbeat and feel fine doing it. I would not trade with Putz at all. Only they can come up a middle ground and no one in this thread can make them. No one can make Apo respond to Putz. At this point, Putz should leave his complaint in the Good/Bad trade thread up above and this thread should be locked and left to die. It's become nothing but the same arguments hashed over and over again with everyone except the 2 people affected arguing...ya know? Let the Good/Bad thread tell the tale of Putz and Apo and let this thread die already Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Foulacy Posted March 9, 2009 Members Share Posted March 9, 2009 If you read back, Apo went to the USPS looking for confirmation and they told him they couldn't help him, which I can believe because they have done the same thing to me. If you don't use delivery confirmation and/or signature required, the USPS pretty much has zero tracking, they will blow you off if you ask for any sort of tracking or delivery info. That being the case, what else can he do? He did look into it as far as the USPS let him. i swear you can get confirmation that a package was sent on a date, to an address. that's all he needs to prove he sent the pedals, not tracking or delivery confirmation. apo is still avoiding this thread and putz PM's like the plague. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Clonexx Posted March 9, 2009 Members Share Posted March 9, 2009 i swear you can get confirmation that a package was sent on a date, to an address. that's all he needs to prove he sent the pedals, not tracking or delivery confirmation. apo is still avoiding this thread and putz PM's like the plague. I thought you were talking about getting delivery confirmation or tracking. I've never asked for that from the USPS but I guess they could say something was shipped from wherever to wherever on what day...maybe. I don't know how far back they keep records. I also don't know if they can actually print anything to give you proof of that since it really isn't saying much except someone shipped something somewhere. It can't specify who did what on either end though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members wrathchild1 Posted March 11, 2009 Members Share Posted March 11, 2009 ttt:thu: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Foulacy Posted March 11, 2009 Members Share Posted March 11, 2009 I thought you were talking about getting delivery confirmation or tracking.I've never asked for that from the USPS but I guess they could say something was shipped from wherever to wherever on what day...maybe. I don't know how far back they keep records. I also don't know if they can actually print anything to give you proof of that since it really isn't saying much except someone shipped something somewhere. It can't specify who did what on either end though. he could just ask for another copy of the receipt they should have printed him the day he sent the package. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members CrystalLake Posted March 11, 2009 Members Share Posted March 11, 2009 he could just ask for another copy of the receipt they should have printed him the day he sent the package. Ive actually got my receipt re-printed at the local USPS once. It wasnt anything to "prove" anything like in this matter, as it was just something I needed for my records. Lesson to be learned: Keep your receipts! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members putz1337 Posted March 15, 2009 Author Members Share Posted March 15, 2009 bump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cenoch Posted March 15, 2009 Members Share Posted March 15, 2009 Now you are just being childish. You've made your point, and none of us can do anything for you if you don't try to resolve this with aporcelainsky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members 02-fatboy Posted March 15, 2009 Members Share Posted March 15, 2009 Just in case anyone out there really wants to know Apo seems to be a pretty honest guy. He just sent me a pedal last week and I have not had any issues with it at all. To be honest it was actually in better condition than what I thought it was gonna be. I say good deals with Apo. Never dealt with Putz so I have no input there sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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