Members V-man Posted July 25, 2010 Members Share Posted July 25, 2010 The root tone of Marshall is there going all the way back to the JTM45 in what, '65? That's my point. No "real" innovation or changes since then...just more gain here and there...a minor change in the tone stack (56K resistor to a 33K resistor), changes in the power supply section...I mean, Gibson at least stopped making les pauls and made SG's for a while. Yeah, since the only guitar thats generated any long-standing interest is the firebird made 2 years after the SG, what do you have? Boomerang pickups, MDF bodies, robot technology, and holy abominations. None of it was successful. What would you have Marshall waste tens of thousands of dollars if not hundreds for R&D, tooling, and distribution, so that the purists can {censored} on it and you can gawk at before buying something else? What has anybody done with a tube that's revolutionary in the past 30 years? Newsflash, it's old technology. Marshall has done its fair share of tweaking the tube tone with the JMP-1, & Mode Four... they released pedals and even solid state amps. The only thing that makes sense to them is that they make Marshall modelling for digital recording. Again, if they haven't been revolutionary enough for your liking, buy something else. I'm sure nobody will worry about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jenksdrummer Posted July 25, 2010 Members Share Posted July 25, 2010 Yeah, since the only guitar thats generated any long-standing interest is the firebird made 2 years after the SG, what do you have? Boomerang pickups, MDF bodies, robot technology, and holy abominations. None of it was successful. What would you have Marshall waste tens of thousands of dollars if not hundreds for R&D, tooling, and distribution, so that the purists can {censored} on it and you can gawk at before buying something else? What has anybody done with a tube that's revolutionary in the past 30 years? Newsflash, it's old technology. Marshall has done its fair share of tweaking the tube tone with the JMP-1, & Mode Four... they released pedals and even solid state amps. The only thing that makes sense to them is that they make Marshall modelling for digital recording. Again, if they haven't been revolutionary enough for your liking, buy something else. I'm sure nobody will worry about it. You went right passed everything I said and regurgitated the same crap that was said ealier... I'll again spell it out for you... Mesa (and a few others) offer different series of amps that offer different sets of tones. Marshall offers one. I'd like to see Marshall do more, but, they don't. Is that really that hard to comprehend? Again, I also own Marshall..and have had a couple of their amps and have built a few clones. Maybe I should buy something else...wtf kind of bull{censored} answer is that... Holy {censored}, that was difficult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members V-man Posted July 25, 2010 Members Share Posted July 25, 2010 You went right passed everything I said and regurgitated the same crap that was said ealier... I'll again spell it out for you... Apparently passing through what you said the first time was a good idea since your little spelling bee was as you put it, nothing more than a regurgitation of your initial rant Mesa (and a few others) offer different series of amps that offer different sets of tones. Marshall offers one. I'd like to see Marshall do more, but, they don't. Is that really that hard to comprehend? Yes, it's devestating. And you have answered your own query. Mesa and a bunch of other outfuts offer different series of amps that offer different tones. There is no sense arguing with you about Marshall's pallate since from your previous answers, you're obviously deaf to it, so stipulating they have but one set of tone... Everybody who likes Marshall keeps them busy demanding "that one set of tone". Moreover, multiple hats have been thrown into the "multi-tone" ring, so there is no incentive for marshall to compete in the saturated market. So get ready for it... Want "different tones?" BUY... ANOTHER...AMP. How's your comprehension there? Again, I also own Marshall..and have had a couple of their amps and have built a few clones. Maybe I should buy something else...wtf kind of bull{censored} answer is that... Holy {censored}, that was difficult. Oh dear... I just thought you owned a Peavey XXX and were ranting about Marshalls. I didn't know actually owned marshalls and clones. Well, that changes everything. I retract everything I said and feel that Marshall should change their entire business model because you, the paying customer and clone builder, want a Marshall that is not a Marshall. I think they should stop selling amps all together and re-tool so they can serve your every whim and prepare you some "Vintage Wooley" feety pajamas, and 100 watts of all-tube fellatio. Bull{censored} answer, my ass. How about "bull{censored} expectation?" Yes, it would be cool that we all see our special suggestion noted by a company we've supported, but a 3 post criticism of the company pursuing what made it successful in an over-competitive, over saturated market? Complaining about Marshall sucessfully pursuing its Marshall heritage, is as stupid as buying a plexi and complaining it's too loud. If you like Marshall for what they are, support them. If you don't, take your money and complaints elsewhere. There's plenty out there who will take both from you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Neilrocks25 Posted July 25, 2010 Members Share Posted July 25, 2010 Kidding aside mesa and specifically randall smith refers to vintage marshalls in every interview for how much he loves them and their tone. Stilletto etc, is mesa's "tribute" to the british thing with a twist and the whole package of features that you usually expect out of mesa.Would one expect a similar move from marshall? Nope. Thats because Marshall are far better than Mesa's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Neilrocks25 Posted July 25, 2010 Members Share Posted July 25, 2010 You went right passed everything I said and regurgitated the same crap that was said ealier... I'll again spell it out for you... Mesa (and a few others) offer different series of amps that offer different sets of tones. Marshall offers one. I'd like to see Marshall do more, but, they don't. Is that really that hard to comprehend? Again, I also own Marshall..and have had a couple of their amps and have built a few clones. Maybe I should buy something else...wtf kind of bull{censored} answer is that... Holy {censored}, that was difficult. I have owned a lot of Marshall's all sounding different to each other, I trust your advise like I would trust one of your diets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Badside Posted July 25, 2010 Members Share Posted July 25, 2010 The thing about Marshall is that, although they all share a similar tone, it is a sound that can be morphed for so many contexts. I regularly gig with a cover band and I have to cover a lot of ground, from Pink Floyd to Pantera, and Marshalls are the only amps that allow me to play any style and never be completely out of context. Sure I got push it with a pedal sometimes, but I love doing that.When I was using Mesa gear, it did the metal songs so awesomely, but it couldn't morph into the more dynamic tone required for other songs. There is a technical reason behind that: the "Marshall" tone is basically the simplest form of circuit. You cascade a couple of tubes, run it through a cathode-follower to drive a classic tone-stack and bam you have a Marshall. Put a 0.68uF cathode cap on the first stage, add a 500k/500p treble peaking circuit and you definitely have a Marshall. Mesa amps on the other hand are specifically voiced towards a specific tone. They have a lot more filtering. They have a voice you can't fight. That's why they have so many modes. With a good Marshall, you don't need modes. It just works. Here's a demonstration of what I'm saying: This amp is a textbook Fender Deluxe, except with smaller power tubes so it overdrives like crazy, and I used smaller coupling caps (Marshall value instead of Fender value, incidentally the Marshall value is the usual Mesa vlue). It's running through Greenbacks. What does it sounds like? Very Marshall like... Yet nothing about it's circuit is trying to make it sound that way. It's just the sound of valves overdriving with minimal tone filtering:JASfKMCL6Ag (I've since modded that amp: I've cascaded the bright channel into the normal one and added the 500k/500p treble peaking circuit. It now sounds extremely JCM800 like. I'm about to rebuild it similar to a Tiny Terror to get more gain out of the preamp since this is the amp I use to jam at home at low volume) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members NetStar Posted July 25, 2010 Members Share Posted July 25, 2010 Personally I think the Marshall bashing is a little retarded (Marshall in general, not the AFD bashing). I don't hear anybody giving Fender any {censored} for not making a metal amp, or a SS/tube hybrid. Oh that's right, they do one thing and one thing only super clean with utter impunity... and apparently we're all ok with it. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JesusCrisp Posted July 25, 2010 Members Share Posted July 25, 2010 Everytime I heard this amp it sounded like crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jenksdrummer Posted July 25, 2010 Members Share Posted July 25, 2010 Not only that but the 5153...lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jenksdrummer Posted July 25, 2010 Members Share Posted July 25, 2010 I have owned a lot of Marshall's all sounding different to each other, I trust your advise like I would trust one of your diets. I have results from said diet, so, what does that say? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members syscrusher Posted July 25, 2010 Members Share Posted July 25, 2010 (I've since modded that amp: I've cascaded the bright channel into the normal one and added the 500k/500p treble peaking circuit. It now sounds extremely JCM800 like. I'm about to rebuild it similar to a Tiny Terror to get more gain out of the preamp since this is the amp I use to jam at home at low volume) That's the beauty of those simple amps. I built a modded GA-5 and it gets a nice marshall roar and cleans up really nice with the guitar volume. Sounds huge with a 4x12 cab too. Still to loud to play at home though. Your amp sounds awesome as well. I like that roar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jenksdrummer Posted July 25, 2010 Members Share Posted July 25, 2010 blah-blah-blah I find it funny that you're arguing over my opinion, and think I'm slamming Marshall, when really, I'm not. Again with the Personally I'd like to see Marshall put out a Fender-clean-killer, and a mesa-metal killer amp, or even delve into the bogner kind of direction...In some ways, I think they'd do better (say, in the UK where Mesa/Fender are way more expensive, not to mention their extensive distribution network). Is it wrong to want more from a company? Then again, I guess it's blasphemy to even suggestion that Marshall add more to their lineup... Now for the bashing (more like a slight complaint) No, instead we basically get the same basic sound dating back to 1965...with more gain and channel switching. That's not even touching the signature editions bull{censored}. Marshall is in the process of jumping the shark, and hardly anyone is seeing it...lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Neilrocks25 Posted July 25, 2010 Members Share Posted July 25, 2010 I have results from said diet, so, what does that say? Pics or your eating cake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Neilrocks25 Posted July 25, 2010 Members Share Posted July 25, 2010 (I've since modded that amp: I've cascaded the bright channel into the normal one and added the 500k/500p treble peaking circuit. It now sounds extremely JCM800 like. I'm about to rebuild it similar to a Tiny Terror to get more gain out of the preamp since this is the amp I use to jam at home at low volume) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Neilrocks25 Posted July 25, 2010 Members Share Posted July 25, 2010 That's not even touching the signature editions bull{censored}. Marshall is in the process of jumping the shark, and hardly anyone is seeing it...lol. How old are you, and no I am not being a dick, its just I have been around for a while and Marshall is still as popular as it was. In fact their 800's and plexi amps are more popular. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ron Burgandy Posted July 25, 2010 Members Share Posted July 25, 2010 Kidding aside mesa and specifically randall smith refers to vintage marshalls in every interview for how much he loves them and their tone. Stilletto etc, is mesa's "tribute" to the british thing with a twist and the whole package of features that you usually expect out of mesa.Would one expect a similar move from marshall? Nope. Hell no. Why in the world would Marshall want to copy anything from Mesa? Answer: They wouldn't because Mesas sound like {censored}. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tech21man Posted July 26, 2010 Members Share Posted July 26, 2010 Thats because Marshall are far better than Mesa's. You'd wish but that is another story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tech21man Posted July 26, 2010 Members Share Posted July 26, 2010 Hell no. Why in the world would Marshall want to copy anything from Mesa? Answer: They wouldn't because Mesas sound like {censored}. Out before ricky bobby. Too late. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members PaoloJM Posted July 26, 2010 Members Share Posted July 26, 2010 I can't wait for "how do I get Sweet Chile Of Mine tones with my AFD100 and Slash sig Les Paul?" threads.Guaran{censored}ingtee sume "rich mammy and daddy" little {censored} will ask in all earnestness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators justcrash Posted July 26, 2010 Moderators Share Posted July 26, 2010 If this AFD caulk-tease goes on much longer, i'm gonna forget all about it, almost there now. Rather have a Marsha. :love: :love: I love Slash, but never pay attention when he releases the sig stuff, mainly because I can't afford it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators justcrash Posted July 26, 2010 Moderators Share Posted July 26, 2010 I can't wait for "how do I get Sweet Chile Of Mine tones with my AFD100 and Slash sig Les Paul?" threads. Guaran{censored}ingtee sume "rich mammy and daddy" little {censored} will ask in all earnestness. Ugh... pick up selector in the middle, tone rolled all the way back on the neck pick up. Saved ya $4k. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jenksdrummer Posted July 26, 2010 Members Share Posted July 26, 2010 How old are you, and no I am not being a dick, its just I have been around for a while and Marshall is still as popular as it was.In fact their 800's and plexi amps are more popular. Old enough that 4-input master-volume Marshalls were the new thing... 800's and plexi's are mostly what I'm referring to - the amps out today basically do the same thing (except more channels and more gain) - the power section of the JVM series, is touted as being identical as the 800 (yet there's no choke...) EDIT: to clarify, Marshall hasn't come up with a new sound in decades; others have. Maybe that's a testament to that which isn't broke/don't fix, but, at the same time, they trumpet signature models like they are a new thing, when they really aren't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jenksdrummer Posted July 26, 2010 Members Share Posted July 26, 2010 Hell no. Why in the world would Marshall want to copy anything from Mesa? Answer: They wouldn't because Mesas sound like {censored}. That comment is reminicent of a chuck norris joke for some reason... I like my Roadster...it's a good contrast to my JVM. I'll likely get (again...) a 5150-II/6505+, and some day either buy or build (again) an SLO, as well as an Orange or two (Rockerverb (again)/OR-series/AD-series) I have a bad habit of unloading my {censored} every once in a while... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dolf Posted July 26, 2010 Members Share Posted July 26, 2010 Personally I think the Marshall bashing is a little retarded (Marshall in general, not the AFD bashing). I don't hear anybody giving Fender any {censored} for not making a metal amp, or a SS/tube hybrid. Oh that's right, they do one thing and one thing only super clean with utter impunity... and apparently we're all ok with it. MetalHead5150 III ^^Those are both Fenders. I'm not even going to bother listing all the tube/ss hybrids from over the years. You were saying? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tech21man Posted July 26, 2010 Members Share Posted July 26, 2010 MetalHead5150 III^^Those are both Fenders.I'm not even going to bother listing all the tube/ss hybrids from over the years.You were saying? User Dolf for the win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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