Zager guitars?

[Misha]

I just went to the other Zager thread and red that Hudman put in his 2 cents there as well and said and I quote: "They get good reviews. I never had a chance to play one." So now you don't like them because you think it's an expensive "set up" on a cheap guitar. But at least you admit on that thread that you have not had a chance to play one. Choosing a guitar is subjective, what I like somone else might not and what you like I might not like. But until I play one, or hear from someone that has, I don't know how they compare to any guitar. That is why I was hoping that there would be some folks here that have bought them and could give me there first hand opinion based on their experience. My guess, based on my first experience with this forum is that they are probably afraid to say anything here for fear of being ridiculed. I do not own one, but I am going to give it some serious thought and maybe there are some other forums that might be more helpful. What really amazes me is that in my original post I was specific about wanting actual experience with this particular guitar company from those that have actually played one.

 

Just buy the Zager and if you don't like it return it. This way you'll have time to test it by yourself!

 

Goodbye!

 

 

edit:

 

Maybe you could call a couple of luthiers in your area and ask them what they think about Zager guitars!

[OldGuitarPlayer]

Wow...I don't know about "user reviews" here as I don't pay attention to them. I pay attention to my own feelings and if you want my opinion I will gladly give it to you. It's based on 35 yrs experience playing acoustic and electric guitar. I am no means an expert and I am not really a great guitar player by most standards but you came here asking opinions and I'll give you mine.

 

First of all... if you want a guitar that is gonna play itself than you are out of luck. No guitar will do that and I dont care what Denny Zager says. The advertisement Mr Zager makes for his $500 Sigma rippoff is enough to turn me off anything else he sells. If you want to spend $800 on a Zager guitar than by all means do so...myself and the other folks on this forum are just trying to help you find a decent made guitar for a reasonable price. I don't think you realize how far $750 can go in terms of guitar quality these days. Gosh...whats an entry level Larivee go for...$800 - $900? That is one heck of an instrument for the price considering they are hand made in Canada by a worldwide respected company.

 

If you want a great all solid wood guitar for $600 go try an Epiphone Masterbilt or even better if you want a laminate back and sides guitar with a solid spruce top have a look at the Taylor 100 series. I have a Taylor 114 which I think is a great guitar. Sure it's pretty plain and doesn't have fancy mother of toilet seat inlays but it sounds awesome and was setup perfectly when I bought it.

 

I play blues/folk/bottleneck music primarily and like to pick hard so having low super low action and light strings is not my thing. I like to dig in and play hard. The Taylor is the guitar I go to for this type of agressive playing. The more I pound it the more it wants it and I am constantly amazed at what she will take. Most people don't think of Taylors as " acoustic blues guitars" but to me it don't matter... it's all about the set-up. Besides..I can make even an expensive guitar sound like crap...

 

Anyhow...that's my .02 cents for what it's worth...

 

Good luck and if you do buy a Zager guitar please by all means tell us what you think of it and show us pics.

 

Regards,

 

OGP

[thirsty one]

Cheers for the Taylor 100 series. I played one in a store recently and would have bought it but I just got an amp so I am saving for one now. Thanks to all of you guys for giving me some insight on the Zager high price set up. I just assumed he was charging a fifty+ dollar premium over a normal set up. I had looked Zager's way a year or so ago. Thanks all!

[TCBronson]

At least Knockwood has played one.

 

"Have I played one of his guitars? I'm sorry to say that I have. A ZAD-50 purchased by an uninformed acquaintance."

 

This is what I am looking for.

 

Your right about one thing, if I put up a post, then I can't dictate who can respond to it.

 

And I know you can't believe everything you read, but there does seem to be alot of positive comments in the testamonials I have read. Almost too good to be true comments. I wonder if any major magazine have done a reviews on Zager guitars?

[Hudman]

At least Knockwood has played one. "Have I played one of his guitars? I'm sorry to say that I have. A ZAD-50 purchased by an uninformed acquaintance." This is what I am looking for. Your right about one thing, if I put up a post, then I can't dictate who can respond to it. And I know you can't believe everything you read, but there does seem to be alot of positive comments in the testamonials I have read. Almost too good to be true comments. I wonder if any major magazine have done a reviews on Zager guitars?

 

Have you ever watched Esteban selling his guitars on Home Shopping Network? People call in raving about how much they love their Esteban guitars.

 

Please keep in mind that I never said that Zager guitars were bad. I don't like his deceptive tactics (you can't get a blown up view of the Martin DM headstock on his website) and his "string science" set up is grossly over-priced.

 

You missed my point entirely and you decided to be insulting towards me. I was trying to give you good advice.

 

You can do much better in the $800 price range.

 

If you want a Sigma, buy one and take it to a tech for a set up. Use the extra $200 - $300 on something else.

[TCBronson]

Please keep in mind that I never said that Zager guitars were bad. I don't like his deceptive tactics (you can't get a blown up view of the Martin DM headstock on his website) and his "string science" set up is grossly over-priced.

 

You missed my point entirely and you decided to be insulting towards me. I was trying to give you good advice.

 

I am sorry if I have insulted you. I never mentioned the Martin DM in any of my threads and don't really care about the Martin DM. I understand your point about Zager using the Martin name and I understand your point about an expensive set up. But the fact still remains that you have not played one yourself. You have your opinion and it is not based on personal experience with Zager guitars. You have more knowledge about what a "good" guitar construction and set up should be and how much it should cost.

But when I look at name brand guitars with that type of construction, at least the ones that I like so far are all over $1000 dollar on up to $3500.

I have looked at the low end Martins, Taylors, nicer Yamahas, Ephiphones, etc. Al at Guitar Center. Speaking of Guitar Center, I am not sure I would trust them to do an extensive set up on my guitar.

[Hudman]

 

Please keep in mind that I never said that Zager guitars were bad. I don't like his deceptive tactics (you can't get a blown up view of the Martin DM headstock on his website) and his "string science" set up is grossly over-priced. You missed my point entirely and you decided to be insulting towards me. I was trying to give you good advice. I am sorry if I have insulted you. I never mentioned the Martin DM in any of my threads and don't really care about the Martin DM. I understand your point about Zager using the Martin name and I understand your point about an expensive set up. But the fact still remains that you have not played one yourself. You have your opinion and it is not based on personal experience with Zager guitars. You have more knowledge about what a "good" guitar construction and set up should be and how much it should cost. But when I look at name brand guitars with that type of construction, at least the ones that I like so far are all over $1000 dollar on up to $3500. I have looked at the low end Martins, Taylors, nicer Yamahas, Ephiphones, etc. Al at Guitar Center. Speaking of Guitar Center, I am not sure I would trust them to do an extensive set up on my guitar.

 

 

The Zager brand is the same as the Sigma DM.

 

There are 2 main guitar companies in the world: Cort and Samick. They make guitars for most guitar companies. The Zager / Sigma is a Martin copy. I played and owned many different solid top, laminate sides and back guitars similar to them over the years. None of them were worth $745.

 

You need to spend more time shopping. Taylor, Martin, Larrivee, Guild, Blueridge and several other companies make great solid wood guitars in the under $1000 price range.

 

Skip Guitar Center.

[AugTPD]

The only thing I'll say in response to these threads to to completely agree with Hud as well as several other veteran forumites here. I don't post all to often but I lurk a lot and have found that they are very honest, knowledgable, and helpful individuals who have nothing to gain by giving their opinions. They truly post to give others good advice and encourage people to explore themselves musically.

 

That being said, I completely agree with everything they have said about Zager guitars being overpriced. For $200 the solid top model might be worth it, but for nearly $500 or more it is ridiculous. I've been playing acoustic guitar for over 10 years now and have learned a lot of lessons with the guitar purchases I have made. Zager prays on uninformed buyers who have no idea that any decent acoustic guitar can be made to play easily for a modest setup price.

[babablowfish]

I really don't remember what the model #s were on the 2 Zagers I heard. As I said in the post above, they were definitely not junk; but they weren't particularly great either. In my opinion, they sounded OK. I wouldn't put anyone down who bought one, but I know that much better sounding guitars can be had for the money. My Parkwood cost me $550.00 (and if I had waited a few months it was selling for $375.00!) There is simply no comparison between the way those Zagers sounded and the tone and volume of my Parkwood - and to state the obvious, the Parkwood sounds, looks and plays far superior. And again, and this might be entirely an aberration, the one I played had uncomfortably high action. That is my opinion based on my limited experience.

[Pine Apple Slim]

I played one for a friend who ordered one.

Nothing reall wrong with the guitar itself. A well constructed, clean, decent sounding Sigma Dred. A little nicer than most, really. Overpirced by about a third is all, in my estimate.

What I had a prob with is the "Zagerizing".

If you want to start out on a guitar with practically no frets and action so low that when you hit the strings any harder than a whisper, it buzzes like a chain saw, that plays like some shredders pointy low action electric axe string with XXXLights, then its the guitar for you. I guess since you touch is so light, you'll never experience fretwear. If you do, too bad, theres no frets left to work on.

And for those of who who say, "I always plug in anyway", well the electronic suck. Piezo quacks like a duck.

 

It really is easy to play tho.

 

He sent it back. Thanks goodness they honored their return policy.

[zenbu]

Hope I don`t get excommunicated for this but...this is the first I`ve heard of them.

[Scott Fonseca]

 

Hope I don`t get excommunicated for this but...this is the first I`ve heard of them.

 

 

nah, it's cool. TCBronson, why are you calling out people on this? Are guitars not subjective? People in this forum are very helpful and nice. Hudman gave his opinion, and you disagree, why continue? You wanted opinions and you got them. So they were not exactly what you wanted to hear, big deal.

[Guitar Hack]

Zager Zad 80 is a great guitar with great tone and a loud sound with little effort and a sustain that goes on forever.

 

I have one and have a Martin D-15 custom with solid rosewood back and sides and a spruce top. I prefer the sound of the Zager Zad 80.

[Hudman]

 

Zager Zad 80 is a great guitar with great tone and a loud sound with little effort and a sustain that goes on forever. I have one and have a Martin D-15 custom with solid rosewood back and sides and a spruce top. I prefer the sound of the Zager Zad 80.

 

 

The Zagers are popular with many of our newer posters.

 

You need to get a set up on your D-15, either that or you got a dud.

[TCBronson]

I am back with my opinion and experience with my purchase of a Zager ZAD 80.

 

But first a little back ground. I started playing guitar in 1968 with a Harmony, sunburst acoustic, moved up to a hollow body electric (forgot the brand) then an Epiphone 12 string and in 1980 My wife bought me a Yamaha FG355. Also had Epiphone Les Paul for a while. I took some lessons back in 1968 and have been playing off and on ever since. Fast forward to Dec 16th, 2007 when Dan Fogelberg died, I decided to get back into playing guitars and did some research on what Dan played. He mostly played a Martin D41. So, I decided to go guitar shopping. Locally and on the internet. Best price I could find on a new D41 was about $3,500, which was out of my price range. Did some more searching and came accross Zager guitars and spent quite some time at their web site, reading all of their ads and reviews. Then I came to this forum to do some more homework and to hopefully get some honest opinions on Zager guitars from those that own them or at least played them. I took the advice from those that posted here and went to no less then 6 music stores, including two Guitar Centers with a list of models recommended. I palyed a martin D35, ($2,200), Martin MMV ($1,200), Martin custom D ($1000), Martin D16RGT ($1,200) also played a coupe of Parkwoods, Taylors, Larrivees, Guild, Epiphone Mastercraft DR 500R, and a couple of Bluridges. The two that had the sound and the look that I was looking for and was in my price range were the Martin MMV ($1,200) and the Blueridge 40 ( $495).

 

So, based on the Zager ad, they are the only guitar company that has a 100% guarantee. And you can return for any reason, and they pay the freight. I e-mailed the company a couple of times with many questions and they quickly responded. So, with no out of pocket expense for me if I did not like the guitar I ordered a ZAD 80. I chose the 80 over th 50 because of the look. The box came with the guitar case partially wraped with bubble wrap. The guitar case was an average quality decent case with a humidity guage. Came with a second set of Martin strings, some picks, a T shirt and paperwork on the guitar.

My first impression on just how the guitar looke was very good. Compared to many of the guitars that I mentioned above, the finish, color and wood grain looked better than the non gloss Martins. There are no flaws anywhere that I could see. It looked like an expensive guitar to me. I had to do some tuning before I played it , but it sounded really good to me, good tone and great sustain. Good low end base, midrange and the treble was not tinee sounding. I played it like I did the other guitars and did not experience any string buzzing unless I really strummed it hard and that was only from the low E string. The strings are farther apart from each other then any of the guitars I played which was good for me because I have XL glove size hands. The sound of a guitar is a personal thing and I new in my head what I wanted a guitar to sound like and this guitar really impressed me. I would say that it had a sound better than most of the guitars I tried and some of those were expensive guitars. The action was not as lght as I thought it would be, no where near an electric guitar, but alot better then my 28 year old Yamaha.

So, bottom line, I am happy with my purchase and will keep this guitar because I like the looks, the sound and they way it feels and plays. My only suggestion to any one that has not had a chance to play one is to order one and try it out for yourself, don't like it send it back. I was fully prepared to send it back if I did not like it and go buy one of the other guitars that I mentioned above. I tried to be honest with my experience and my opinion and felt that I owed it to myself to at least try one just to compare, glad I did.

Tom

[Hudman]

 

I am back with my opinion and experience with my purchase of a Zager ZAD 80. But first a little back ground. I started playing guitar in 1968 with a Harmony, sunburst acoustic, moved up to a hollow body electric (forgot the brand) then an Epiphone 12 string and in 1980 My wife bought me a Yamaha FG355. Also had Epiphone Les Paul for a while. I took some lessons back in 1968 and have been playing off and on ever since. Fast forward to Dec 16th, 2007 when Dan Fogelberg died, I decided to get back into playing guitars and did some research on what Dan played. He mostly played a Martin D41. So, I decided to go guitar shopping. Locally and on the internet. Best price I could find on a new D41 was about $3,500, which was out of my price range. Did some more searching and came accross Zager guitars and spent quite some time at their web site, reading all of their ads and reviews. Then I came to this forum to do some more homework and to hopefully get some honest opinions on Zager guitars from those that own them or at least played them. I took the advice from those that posted here and went to no less then 6 music stores, including two Guitar Centers with a list of models recommended. I palyed a martin D35, ($2,200), Martin MMV ($1,200), Martin custom D ($1000), Martin D16RGT ($1,200) also played a coupe of Parkwoods, Taylors, Larrivees, Guild, Epiphone Mastercraft DR 500R, and a couple of Bluridges. The two that had the sound and the look that I was looking for and was in my price range were the Martin MMV ($1,200) and the Blueridge 40 ( $495). So, based on the Zager ad, they are the only guitar company that has a 100% guarantee. And you can return for any reason, and they pay the freight. I e-mailed the company a couple of times with many questions and they quickly responded. So, with no out of pocket expense for me if I did not like the guitar I ordered a ZAD 80. I chose the 80 over th 50 because of the look. The box came with the guitar case partially wraped with bubble wrap. The guitar case was an average quality decent case with a humidity guage. Came with a second set of Martin strings, some picks, a T shirt and paperwork on the guitar. My first impression on just how the guitar looke was very good. Compared to many of the guitars that I mentioned above, the finish, color and wood grain looked better than the non gloss Martins. There are no flaws anywhere that I could see. It looked like an expensive guitar to me. I had to do some tuning before I played it , but it sounded really good to me, good tone and great sustain. Good low end base, midrange and the treble was not tinee sounding. I played it like I did the other guitars and did not experience any string buzzing unless I really strummed it hard and that was only from the low E string. The strings are farther apart from each other then any of the guitars I played which was good for me because I have XL glove size hands. The sound of a guitar is a personal thing and I new in my head what I wanted a guitar to sound like and this guitar really impressed me. I would say that it had a sound better than most of the guitars I tried and some of those were expensive guitars. The action was not as lght as I thought it would be, no where near an electric guitar, but alot better then my 28 year old Yamaha. So, bottom line, I am happy with my purchase and will keep this guitar because I like the looks, the sound and they way it feels and plays. My only suggestion to any one that has not had a chance to play one is to order one and try it out for yourself, don't like it send it back. I was fully prepared to send it back if I did not like it and go buy one of the other guitars that I mentioned above. I tried to be honest with my experience and my opinion and felt that I owed it to myself to at least try one just to compare, glad I did. Tom

 

 

Congrats.

 

For the record, Zager isn't the only company that will allow you to return a guitar and pay the freight.

 

Most online retailers will do that on EVERY brand they carry.

[fred zappelin]

Being in the market for a new acoustic myself ihave been "lurking" in this acoustic forum looking for info, advice and guidence in my quest.

 

In the past I based my original acoustic purchase solely on product reviews here and other websites. That was for a $185 Washburn D10s which I still have and will use as a "beater".

 

Becuase of this forum I have become a much better shopper and player for that matter. My point is that most of the formites here know what they are talking about when it comes to value, quality and sound in regards to acoustics.

 

I have used advice here to narrow my search down for an all solid wood guitar to a few specific brands (Larrivee, Epiphone Masterbilt, Martin, Taylor, Parkwood) I have also learned quite a bit about the asian all solid wood guitars of lesser names such as Morgan Monroe, Silver Creek, Johnson, walden, Blueridge etc...

 

I read about the Zagers a while back and even back then I questioned myself as to why an asin made middle of the road at best guitar would go for $500- $800. Call it insticts but somethings not quite right with that.

 

Bottom line is the formites here will steer you to make the right choice based upon your own tastes, budget, and playing ability.

 

If anyone spends $750 on a Zager and likes it then they should not care that they could have gotten an all solid wood acoustic for the same or less cash.

 

Personally I am wiating for a $300 Silver Creek T170 to arrive at my door.

I have been at countless stores countless times playing Epis, Larrivees, Martins, Taylors, Parkwoods,Guilds, Fenders, Gibsons etc... etc..

 

My skill and talent level do not warrant me spending more than $800 for an all solid wood guitar. If I dont like the Silver Creek, I'm seneding her back at my own cost but because of this forum I do know that I will end up with an acoustic that will be the best bang for my buck.

 

So I thank the formites who like me enjoy HC and the forums.

 

:p

[TCBronson]

I ment to thank the forum for the input as well. Otherwise I might not have played some of the guitars suggested. The Blueridge is really nice guitar for the price.

 

I must admit, since I am not a profesional muscian or music instructor with any kind of formal training, I just go by what sounds good to me. I read alot about guitar construction and the many types of wood used and at least for me some of that doesn't really matter. Sure I wanted a solid wood guitar because that was a "quality feature", but just because it's all solid wood doesn't guarantee it will always sound better than a laminated guitar. In fact with my Zager ZAD 80, again at least to me it sounds better than alot of solid wood guitars that I tried. I wish someone with formal training or a professional guitarist could do a side by side comparison test and get a professional opinion just for grins. Laminates vs. solid woods. Again I guess it all comes down to personal prefrence or a favorite brand name. My folks drove Hondas, so I drive a Honda because we are a Honda family kind of thing. My grand dad played a __________guitar and so I play a _________guitar because he always had good luck with them and liked them.

 

And when it comes to describing the sound of a guitar and choosing the right adjectives, it's still subjective, isn't it. I mean, when I hear a rich full sound with good base midrange and treble, what does someone else hear?

 

Anyway, thanks again to those that contributed to this thread, I hope that more people get a chance to try a Zager and look past the negatives and listen to the guitar and then decide for themselves if it's worth the money, it was for me.

Tom

[babablowfish]

Tom, I am happy that you found the right guitar for you. If you are happy, then it does not matter a whit what anyone else thinks. Enjoy your new guitar and don't be a stranger.

[Guitar Hack]

 

Congrats. For the record, Zager isn't the only company that will allow you to return a guitar and pay the freight. Most online retailers will do that on EVERY brand they carry.

 

 

Which ones might that be?

[Samilyn]

 

Tom, I am happy that you found the right guitar for you . If you are happy, then it does not matter a whit what anyone else thinks. Enjoy your new guitar and don't be a stranger.

 

 

+1

 

Be happy and make your music. That's all that really matters.

[Hudman]

 

Which ones might that be?

 

 

Musicians Friend (45 days), Music123 (45 days), Same Day Music (60 days), Sweetwater (30 days), and others.

[corduroyhorn]

this is a very strange thread, whay come and ask for advice then moan when you get some then go and stick up for something you "needed" advice on....come off it, i smell something and it dont smell good. seems the workforce at zager dont have anything better to do than coming here and trying to defend themselves..

[knockwood]

Sorry. I don't want to be a great big downer or go against my own basic belief that people generally deserve the benefit of the doubt... BUT...

 

I smell bullshit too.

 

Have a nice day.

[corduroyhorn]

this makes me laugh....

 

http://www.digitalcartography.com/EstebanZager.htm

 

 

"We loosened the strings and pulled the saddle.

There is a Fishman undersaddle pickup AND there

is a 1/32" plastic shim UNDER the pickup element.

The plastic shim appears to be a piece of plastic

wire tie."