What amp do I need?

[EdgarSatriani]

Hi guys, I'm having a hard time finding the amp I want. I play instrumental rock (Satch, Vai, Eric Johnson) and I need this head:

5-18 watts Tube
2-3 Footswitchable channels
Separate EQ for each channel
Reverb
Power attenuator
Simulated cabinet out (for recording)

Maybe I'm asking for too much and I have to compromise? Maybe I need a single channel and handle lead with a pedal? Whaddya think I need? So far I've thought about the Blackstar Studio 20, Marshall DSL, Hughes & Kettner Tubemeister 18. Oh and my budget is +/- $600.

[Dr Wanker]

I want to check out a Hughes & Kettner Tubemeister 18 but there aren't any around here.

[d_dave_c]

More power than you're looking for, but look for a used Mesa Nomad.

3 channels with independent Gain, Bass, Mid, Treble, Presence, Reverb and Master Controls per Channel
Output Level Control (over all channels) = attenuator, so overall wattage doesn't really matter
Solo level control (boost function)
recording out

used in the $500-600 range.

[cbh5150]

A bit above your budget, perhaps, but GC in-store has the Egnater Rebel 30 combos on sale for $674.00, or you should be able to find a good one used for under 6.

Perhaps the most versatile tube amp in the price range.

[Floyd Rosenbomb]

Are you using it for playing and recording at home, or is this for gigs?

If it is for at home then I would look for a lower watt amp, like 5 watts with attenuator down to .5 or so.

[kayd_mon]

I could be wrong, but I think you can find Carvin Legacy heads secondhand for somewhere near your price range. If you like Vai, maybe you'll like his amp.

Still, I think the best option is to place the number of channels on your amp as the least important feature, since I think that pedals will give you all the versatility you'll ever need.

[Bro Blue]

POD HD500

[xrleroyx]

Tubemeister!

[Canadian Jeff]

If you're playing at home, which is what I assume when I see people asking about 5w amps, then you'd be better off with either a DI and headphones or a Yamaha THR5/10. Even the quietest tube amps can get really loud and, despite the miniscule power rating, need to be played that loud to sound good.

[kayd_mon]

Originally Posted by Canadian Jeff

If you're playing at home, which is what I assume when I see people asking about 5w amps, then you'd be better off with either a DI and headphones or a Yamaha THR5/10.

Maybe, unless what he wants is a tube amp. If that's the case, then even a great-sounding non-tube rig might leave him wanting, thinking that tubes will be better in some way.

Originally Posted by Canadian Jeff

Even the quietest tube amps can get really loud and, despite the miniscule power rating, need to be played that loud to sound good.

False. A common misconception. One can get perfectly good sounds out of a tube amp that isn't cranked.

[d_dave_c]

 

Originally Posted by Bro Blue

POD HD500

 

+ ZT lunchbox.

[Canadian Jeff]

Originally Posted by kayd_mon

Maybe, unless what he wants is a tube amp. If that's the case, then even a great-sounding non-tube rig might leave him wanting, thinking that tubes will be better in some way.

Of course he wants a tube amp. There's this thing called the internet and, according to this internet, tube amps are the only best thing ever since infinity.

Originally Posted by kayd_mon

False. A common misconception. One can get perfectly good sounds out of a tube amp that isn't cranked.

False. One gets lack-luster sounds from any amp that isn't running loud enough to make the speakers kick out some volume. Oh, wait, I think this bit is actually subjective. In my experience, cranked through good headphones (Sennheiser 280HD in my case) is vastly superior to running though an amp set to .2

[honeyiscool]

I don't think any amps, tube or solid state, sound decent at truly low volume. I think you need to get the room to respond a little bit before anything sounds good. I do think, though, that you should think of a DI and a good amp tone as two different goals, though. It's my limited experience that it's hard to get both to be ideal. A good Character Series pedal for DI, and then a good amp like a Marshall Class 5, that should solve the issue and keeps it simple.

[xrleroyx]

 

Originally Posted by honeyiscool

I don't think any amps, tube or solid state, sound decent at truly low volume. I think you need to get the room to respond a little bit before anything sounds good. I do think, though, that you should think of a DI and a good amp tone as two different goals, though. It's my limited experience that it's hard to get both to be ideal. A good Character Series pedal for DI, and then a good amp like a Marshall Class 5, that should solve the issue and keeps it simple.

 

I've been honestly considering this rig for awhile.

[honeyiscool]

 

Originally Posted by Canadian Jeff

If you're playing at home, which is what I assume when I see people asking about 5w amps, then you'd be better off with either a DI and headphones or a Yamaha THR5/10. Even the quietest tube amps can get really loud and, despite the miniscule power rating, need to be played that loud to sound good.

 

I actually think that 5 watt is the perfect point where you can get a tube amp to truly get going at rehearsal volume, and are ideal for mic'd gigs that are common these days. As long as you don't need headroom, of course.

[Special J]

Used Mesa will get you there. Dave's suggestion of the Nomad. A Studio 22 or DC-2. Maybe a Maverick? Maybe a little higher wattage than you spec'ed, but those low wattage amps tend to be simpler affairs. A used Mesa will be of better build quality than anything you can pick up new for that price.

[dman11]

[Floyd Rosenbomb]

Originally Posted by honeyiscool

I don't think any amps, tube or solid state, sound decent at truly low volume. I think you need to get the room to respond a little bit before anything sounds good. I do think, though, that you should think of a DI and a good amp tone as two different goals, though. It's my limited experience that it's hard to get both to be ideal. A good Character Series pedal for DI, and then a good amp like a Marshall Class 5, that should solve the issue and keeps it simple.

Great sound at low volume with tube amps is in the pedals. There is no doubt that one can sound really great at lower volumes, just have the right tools on hand.

[soundcreation]

Originally Posted by Canadian Jeff

False. One gets lack-luster sounds from any amp that isn't running loud enough to make the speakers kick out some volume. Oh, wait, I think this bit is actually subjective. In my experience, cranked through good headphones (Sennheiser 280HD in my case) is vastly superior to running though an amp set to .2

My amp disagrees with you. It's 15 watts of cathode biased tube driven heaven at any volume. The power tubes are ALWAYS pushed to their max...so there is virtually NO change in tone from quiet to loud using the master volume.

Plus builders like 65 amps take it even farther with master voltage options which do the same thing as mine but even better. It's like having a watt dial.

The old myth that "tube amps can't sound good unless their at ten" hasn't been true for at least over a decade now....if it ever was true.

[honeyiscool]

 

Originally Posted by Floyd Rosenbomb

Great sound at low volume with tube amps is in the pedals. There is no doubt that one can sound really great at lower volumes, just have the right tools on hand.

 

I don't think you need pedals, I think a good master volume amp is all you need. I mean, I think I can get my AC15 sounding pretty great at a low volume. However, low volume is a relative term. I still have yet to hear truly inspiring guitar tone at a volume that would be safe against apartment neighbors. I still have to have the room shake a bit before I feel that I have my tone. I think it just has to do with dynamics being part of what we consider good tone, and that means when you strum hard, you need some real feedback from your amp.

[tlbonehead]

Originally Posted by d_dave_c

More power than you're looking for, but look for a used Mesa Nomad.

3 channels with independent Gain, Bass, Mid, Treble, Presence, Reverb and Master Controls per Channel
Output Level Control (over all channels) = attenuator, so overall wattage doesn't really matter
Solo level control (boost function)
recording out

used in the $500-600 range.

very nice amp!!

[tlbonehead]

http://reasonamps.com/amps_grande.php I have the Bambino 8/2 head. Very nice.

[kayd_mon]

Originally Posted by Canadian Jeff

Of course he wants a tube amp. There's this thing called the internet and, according to this internet, tube amps are the only best thing ever since infinity.

Well, we know he wants a tube amp because he said so.

False. One gets lack-luster sounds from any amp that isn't running loud enough to make the speakers kick out some volume. Oh, wait, I think this bit is actually subjective. In my experience, cranked through good headphones (Sennheiser 280HD in my case) is vastly superior to running though an amp set to .2

If you mean cranked as many do, which means your knobs all the way up (or pretty close), then it is a misconception as I've said. If you mean loud enough to "fill" the speaker out, then of course. If you're playing so quietly that you can hear the pick hitting the string over the speaker volume, then you're not going to get the best from your amp. And you certainly don't need to crank it in the sense that most people use that phrase to mean.

[kayd_mon]

Originally Posted by Canadian Jeff

Of course he wants a tube amp. There's this thing called the internet and, according to this internet, tube amps are the only best thing ever since infinity.

Well, we know he wants a tube amp because he said so, not because he said he follows internet opinions. Of course, he wants opinions from others on the internet, but whatever.

Originally Posted by Canadian Jeff

False. One gets lack-luster sounds from any amp that isn't running loud enough to make the speakers kick out some volume. Oh, wait, I think this bit is actually subjective. In my experience, cranked through good headphones (Sennheiser 280HD in my case) is vastly superior to running though an amp set to .2

If you mean cranked as many do, which means your knobs all the way up (or pretty close), then it is a misconception as I've said. If you mean loud enough to "fill" the speaker out, then of course. If you're playing so quietly that you can hear the pick hitting the string over the speaker volume, then you're not going to get the best from your amp. And you certainly don't need to crank it in the sense that most people use that phrase to mean.

[Canadian Jeff]

Originally Posted by kayd_mon

If you mean cranked as many do, which means your knobs all the way up (or pretty close), then it is a misconception as I've said. If you mean loud enough to "fill" the speaker out, then of course. If you're playing so quietly that you can hear the pick hitting the string over the speaker volume, then you're not going to get the best from your amp. And you certainly don't need to crank it in the sense that most people use that phrase to mean.

Excuse my discrepancies, I was trying to fire out a few posts while doing homework. Yes, I mean enough to get the speakers going. I live in an apartment and so far "get the speakers going" volume is the same as "get people complaining about the noise" volume. A DI with some good headphones has been the best practice rig I've ever had. I can make mind-boggling amounts of noise while not disturbing people in the next room.

YMMV, of course.