Members BIGD Posted May 6, 2011 Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 [ATTACH=CONFIG]334642[/ATTACH]If a company lists a guitar as first quality, and then sends you a guitar with a severe blemish that affects the usefullness of the guitar, shouldn't that companies first reaction be to offer a full refund..including shipping? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jumpwin Posted May 6, 2011 Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 Damn that's messy! I would think a full refund with shipping, or a replacement would be a companies lawful response. but there are some unscrupulous companies out there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members photon9 Posted May 6, 2011 Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 Damn that's messy! I would think a full refund with shipping, or a replacement would be a companies lawful response. but there are some unscrupulous companies out there Definitely. If not Judge Judy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BIGD Posted May 6, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 Damn that's messy! I would think a full refund with shipping, or a replacement would be a companies lawful response. but there are some unscrupulous companies out there I'm hoping they decide to do the right thing, as I've had good experiences with these guys in the past (never ordered a whole guitar though), and I don't want to start a big {censored} storm on the forum, but this is completely unacceptable and what they've offerred so far doesn't cut it. They offered a call tag but would not refund shipping. They offered a replacement but I will not accept one without a guarantee that it is flawless, and that if it is not, that I will be fully refunded including the shipping. Also, I didn't realize how badly the guitar was {censored}ed up until after I had installed a new pickup (also ordered from them) and then tried to restring it. I couldn't restring it withouth removing the bridge!!! And, if you do a google on this company, there is a guy who got 2 {censored}ed up guitars in a row from these guys and it turned into a {censored}storm on here a few years back. Although he initially ordered a blem, and i didn't. The partial refund they offered only lowers the cost of the guitar down to what they are offering for cosmetic blems on their website..this is not just cosmetic, you can't string the guitar without taking the bridge off as it is now. Secondly..I didn't order a blemished guitar yet I was sold one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members caveman Posted May 6, 2011 Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 That and sincerest apologies as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Grantus Posted May 6, 2011 Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 Who is the retailer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members fly_with_v Posted May 6, 2011 Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 Full refund should be given, no doubt. That said if they offer you a good partial refund and you have a little skill it would be easy to fix, but only if it is a great guitar to you. Personally, I would probably want a full refund and ship it back immediately and look elsewhere bcause it is probably an indication of other potential issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members frankie pajamas Posted May 6, 2011 Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 Who is the retailer? OK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members etawful Posted May 6, 2011 Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 Who is the retailer? I think the name of the picture he attached is a pretty good give away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BIGD Posted May 6, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 I'm giving them at least 24 hours from my last e-mail before I start a complete {censored}storm. So far it's only a partial {censored} storm. This would be the third contact. I'm not a wise ass punk kid or anything looking for something for free and to slag off a company for fun, and I haven't been done wrong by them before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BIGD Posted May 6, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 I'm going to upload the picture without their products name. Please delete your post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BIGD Posted May 6, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 My contention is that the partial refund should be for something that makes the guitar cost significantly less than what they sell cosmetic blems for on their site....since I didn't order a blem. They're falling short of that right now...with 2 refunds offered neither is enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jhorne Posted May 6, 2011 Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 If a company lists a guitar as first quality, and then sends you a guitar with a severe blemish that affects the usefullness of the guitar, shouldn't that companies first reaction be to offer a full refund..including shipping? This has happened very rarely in my experience, but there are only two acceptable options: 1. Full refund including return shipping. 2. Partial refund to compensate you for the blemish, and only if you agree with their offer. And this applies to ANY legitimate problem with ANY product from ANY retailer. There is no excuse to offer anything less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BIGD Posted May 6, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 OK Thanks, you're an ethical man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Elias Graves Posted May 6, 2011 Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 I have a pitchfork you can borrow. EG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BIGD Posted May 6, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 I have a pitchfork you can borrow. EG Seriously, if someone in their factory realized the holes were {censored}ed up and wanted to correct it, they could have used a drill to try to correct the problem..instead of giving a Chimpanzee a screwdriver and having him go to town. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Elias Graves Posted May 6, 2011 Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 Chimps are good cheap labor, though. No unions, you know. But, regarding your issue, that sucks. I hope they man up and do the right thing. EG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Tweedledee Posted May 6, 2011 Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 That looks horrible and I would be quite angry. There are a few things that complicate this situation a bit, however. 1) I'm sure the company, even if they inspected the guitar when they got it from the factory, didn't notice that issue since it's under the bridge. They would have no reason to look under there. So being angry at them for sending you a blemished guitar and saying it's first quality is a little harsh. They would have had no reason to assume it wasn't a first quality guitar when they sent it to you. Not that it makes it ok, but your post makes it sound like they knowingly sent you a blemished item, which isn't really the case. 2) You changed one of the pickups. This is where it gets more complicated. Even if you reverted back to the stock pickup, the guitar is no longer in the original condition. It has been modified, which makes returning something as a blem not so cut-and-dry. And even though I'm sure it's not the case, there is at least the slight possibility, from the seller's perspective, that you caused this issue under the bridge when you were modifying things. In your correspondence did you tell them you changed the pickup? If this company is the one I think it is, their warranty policy explicitly states that the warranty is void if the guitar shows signs of being tampered with, which I imagine would include replacing the pickups. Even with all of this, I would still think the right thing for the company to do would be to send you a replacement at no charge and pay to have the blem sent back to them. The whole demanding that they send you a perfect guitar bit seems kind of obnoxious to me. Go for the exchange, and if it arrives with a blem then take it from there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BIGD Posted May 6, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 That looks horrible and I would be quite angry. There are a few things that complicate this situation a bit, however.1) I'm sure the company, even if they inspected the guitar when they got it from the factory, didn't notice that issue since it's under the bridge. They would have no reason to look under there. So being angry at them for sending you a blemished guitar and saying it's first quality is a little harsh. They would have had no reason to assume it wasn't a first quality guitar when they sent it to you. Not that it makes it ok, but your post makes it sound like they knowingly sent you a blemished item, which isn't really the case. 2) You changed one of the pickups. This is where it gets more complicated. Even if you reverted back to the stock pickup, the guitar is no longer in the original condition. It has been modified, which makes returning something as a blem not so cut-and-dry. And even though I'm sure it's not the case, there is at least the slight possibility, from the seller's perspective, that you caused this issue under the bridge when you were modifying things. In your correspondence did you tell them you changed the pickup? If this company is the one I think it is, their warranty policy explicitly states that the warranty is void if the guitar shows signs of being tampered with, which I imagine would include replacing the pickups.Even with all of this, I would still think the right thing for the company to do would be to send you a replacement at no charge and pay to have the blem sent back to them. The whole demanding that they send you a perfect guitar bit seems kind of obnoxious to me. Go for the exchange, and if it arrives with a blem then take it from there. I was upfront and honest from the get go that the reason I had discovered the bridge issue was after a pickup change and trying to change strings. I had ordered a pickup and pickguard with the guitar..a piclguard specifically designed for this guitar. That is 100% without question. This is also the reason why I thought an exchange wasn't the best option, because the guitar had been modified, and I'm not a professional solderer. Also, I invested time in the guitar and that would be completely wasted if I sent it back. And, if a company would ever insinuate that giant holes were gouged out under a guitar bridge by changing a pickup, that company shouldn't be in business and can go f themselves. They didn't do that, but if they did it would be pretty messed up. I actually assumed from the start that the guys in the US didn't know about this..that wherever their factory resides, someone there is the culprit. However, they are the end vendor, and if they feel that their factory tried to pull a fast one on them, then that is their issue to deal with on their time, not mine. The first reaction should have been "sorry about his, we'll offer a complete refund or a substantial discount." Their first offer was less than 20%, their second was 20%, which is not substantial enough in this case. As I stated previously, they sell similar guitars on their site listed as "cosmetic only blems" for 20% off. Based on that alone, they should do better than that here. My tone that was used in relation to an exchange of instruments was based on a thread here from a few years back. To make a long story short, a guy ordered a blemished guitar and got a guitar that had playability issues, not just cosmetic. The company sent them another guitar, and that one had a cracked nut. After that, the owner of said company comes on here and starts a firestorm, displaying quite a bit of unprofessionalism, and refusing to refund the guys shipping costs. Their initial reaction to me indicated that I would also have to eat shipping costs. That's completely unacceptable in this situation. If I had seen this post previously, I would never have ordered a guitar from them. My mistake on that one. The guy basically says in one post, after someone comments on his unprofessionalism, that he reserves the right to be a dick to unsatisfied customers. "I'm a guitar player". But maybe they've changed that philosphy. I'm hoping so. I don't see what they can possible gain by pissing customers off...pride? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members C-4 Posted May 6, 2011 Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 If a company lists a guitar as first quality, and then sends you a guitar with a severe blemish that affects the usefullness of the guitar, shouldn't that companies first reaction be to offer a full refund..including shipping? That guitar has no excuse for being shipped! The online retailer has no excuse he can use for not sending you a complete refund. I would never use that online dealer again. They don't check what they ship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BIGD Posted May 6, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 That guitar has no excuse for being shipped! The online retailer has no excuse he can use for not sending you a complete refund. I would never use that online dealer again. They don't check what they ship. To play devils advocate for them, the only way they can sell guitars at the price they do is to have them built and shipped from China or wherever else they pay people $5 a day. The guitar should not have shipped from their Chinese supplier, no question. They have obvious quality control issues with their supplier, and they should address it with them. Their suppler should obviously owe them a credit back for whatever they paid for this thing, plus more on top. However, I accept the fact that they did not knowingly ship this guitar to me on their US end. I don't expect them to take the bridge off every guitar they get..although there are other reviews on the internet that mention issues with string through holes being off so it makes you wonder if all the bodies for this type of guitar are from a bad batch or something that they got really cheap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BoneNut Posted May 6, 2011 Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 and then sends you a guitar with a severe blemish that affects the usefullness of the guitar, shouldn't that companies first reaction be to offer a full refund..including shipping? Really? The usefulness of the guitar? Isn't this under the bridge where you'll never see it and it doesn't affect the guitar's playability? Sorry, I don't understand. Is this a really expensive guitar or an inexpensive import? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members fu2jobu Posted May 6, 2011 Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 Really? The usefulness of the guitar? Isn't this under the bridge where you'll never see it and it doesn't affect the guitar's playability? Sorry, I don't understand. Is this a really expensive guitar or an inexpensive import? Glad I'm not the only one thinking that. It's ugly for sure but at certain price points you really shouldn't expect more. I wouldn't be overly happy about it but would understand at the price point I'm paying some things are going to be crappy. If it affects playability or is above a certain price point then it's different. OMMV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members xStonr Posted May 6, 2011 Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BIGD Posted May 6, 2011 Author Members Share Posted May 6, 2011 Glad I'm not the only one thinking that. It's ugly for sure but at certain price points you really shouldn't expect more. I wouldn't be overly happy about it but would understand at the price point I'm paying some things are going to be crappy. If it affects playability or is above a certain price point then it's different. OMMV. I don't think I was clear enough on this. The reason I discovered the problem with the bridge is because I couldn't string the guitar back up after changing the pickup. I noticed when I was pulling the old strings out they were getting stuck..had to pull pretty hard to get them out. Then, with the new pack open, I'm trying to thread the strings through...kept getting stuck.. tried bending the strings every which way to get them through the hole...ain't happening..try threading the string through the TOP of the guitar ...can't be done. WTF? So, I take the bridge off. The original holes were obviously way off, and what whoever tried the rectify the problem did was take a blunt object and gouge out wood on an angle. Problem is that it wasn't deep enough to allow the string to get past the bridge plate when trying to put a string through. So, the "usefullness" part comes in in terms of the fact that you have to unscrew the 5 bridge bolts everytime you need to change a string. This means that the guitar has very limited reliabilty on a gig ...or rehearsal where you're on the clock..or at a studio when you're on the clock..because I don't expect bandmates to wait ten minutes for me to remove my bridge to change an e string. Regardless of if this is a $1000+ American made gem, a $400 Mexican made workhorse, or a $200 Chinese knock off, this is a serious problem. Besides that fact, the sellers website does not say "hey, buy a guitar from us..you never know, you might be okay with it!!" They say "please don't compare our guitars to sub $200 guitars out there...." The expectations are created by their hyperbole, not by a customer being unrealistic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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