Members smorgdonkey Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 I don't think that a bolt on design is a method of 'getting out of joinery'. It is just s different design, much like front wheel drive, rear wheel drive, 4 wheel drive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Elias Graves Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 I don't think that a bolt on design is a method of 'getting out of joinery'. It is just s different design, much like front wheel drive, rear wheel drive, 4 wheel drive. Nope. Just tightwad Leo's shortcut for not hiring skilled labor. EG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kit_strong Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 No idea whether or not it has any impact on tone but i've been really considering having them installed on my CP Strat since it's a heel access truss rod and I'm always worried about stripping out the screw holes when I do a truss rod adjustment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members smorgdonkey Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 Nope. Just tightwad Leo's shortcut for not hiring skilled labor. EG HAHA!! That's hilarious!! So, you are saying that Leo was making set neck instruments and then, because 'skilled labour' would cost more, when he started the company he came up with an alternate design and started bolting them on? Excellent 'really stoned' theory!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Wayne2 Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 Threaded inserts were originally developed for IKEA furniture in the 1970s. Of course today, musical instrument manufacturers misuse the technology. Threaded inserts are fine for cheap shelving but when you put them in a guitar the metal interferes with standing waves, destroying tone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members xrleroyx Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 I highly doubt that anyone could really hear the difference in a band or playing loud. On the other hand, the placebo effect is totally fine. If this makes people think their guitars are "better" with these inserts and that inspires them to play more, go for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jamdogg Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 I've already mythbusted this erroneous statement. But if denial allows you to sleep at night, thats cool too. I highly doubt that anyone could really hear the difference in a band or playing loud. On the other hand, the placebo effect is totally fine. If this makes people think their guitars are "better" with these inserts and that inspires them to play more, go for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Belva Posted January 2, 2012 Author Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 Threaded inserts were originally developed for IKEA furniture in the 1970s. Of course today, musical instrument manufacturers misuse the technology. Threaded inserts are fine for cheap shelving but when you put them in a guitar the metal interferes with standing waves, destroying tone. Uh, threaded inserts have been around waaaay longer than the 70's. I'm an old fart. I remember them from my days as a young punk taking things apart in the 60's. BTW I didn't start putting them back together till I was in my teens.Pocket joinery may very well be something IKEA started, but I dunno about that fersure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Wayne2 Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 Uh, threaded inserts have been around waaaay longer than the 70's. I'm an old fart. I remember them from my days as a young punk taking things apart in the 60's. BTW I didn't start putting them back together till I was in my teens.Pocket joinery may very well be something IKEA started, but I dunno about that fersure. Sorry, I thought we were just making things up for the sake of pointless internet argument. Spreading misinformation is part of the deal, right? I really know very little about threaded inserts other than having seen them in some of my furniture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BoneNut Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 Bolt on necks do seem like a cost effective solution for mass produced guitar. Comparing both set necks and bolt ons that I own, I can't perceive a difference in sustain either way though. I'd say the biggest advantage of a bolt on is the ability to adjust the neck angle. When we see so many QC complaints on something as relatively easy as finishes, imagine an unskilled worker trying to get a neck angle spot on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kayd_mon Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 Nope. Just tightwad Leo's shortcut for not hiring skilled labor. EG I thought he used a bolt-on design because he believed it would be cheaper and easier to replace the whole neck when the frets were worn out rather than replace the frets. But alas, I am no Fender historian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Elias Graves Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 I thought he used a bolt-on design because he believed it would be cheaper and easier to replace the whole neck when the frets were worn out rather than replace the frets. But alas, I am no Fender historian. Neither am I. Isn't this the pointless argument thread? I'm making {censored} up as I go. EG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members smorgdonkey Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 Neither am I. Isn't this the pointless argument thread? I'm making {censored} up as I go. EG ...but...I thought that we were going to fight... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ballhawk Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 I thought he used a bolt-on design because he believed it would be cheaper and easier to replace the whole neck when the frets were worn out rather than replace the frets. But alas, I am no Fender historian. What we think doesn't matter. What Leo thought is what matters. The only way to clarify what he thought is to find some actual quotes from a reliable source. Now with that settled let's move on to the real topic at hand. Wild speculation. Everyone knows that the only threaded inserts that are any good are vintage nos ones made before the first mayan calendar ran out of days. They are hard to find but I've seen them on evilbay for only $2,000. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Wayne2 Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 Now with that settled let's move on to the real topic at hand. Wild speculation. Everyone knows that the only threaded inserts that are any good are vintage nos ones made before the first mayan calendar ran out of days. They are hard to find but I've seen them on evilbay for only $2,000. Yes yes the metallugy was so advanced back then, and they mass produced them in such great quantity and to such close tolerances, that to make similar threaded inserts today would be cost-prohibitive. Though the Albanians have come close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RaVenCAD Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 All the better woodworkers and machinists I've spoken to have been strong proponents of threaded inserts. But what do they know compared to a bunch of musicians? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Elias Graves Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 ...but...I thought that we were going to fight... Well if it's any consolation, you're still wrong. EG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members etawful Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 Yes yes the metallugy was so advanced back then, and they mass produced them in such great quantity and to such close tolerances, that to make similar threaded inserts today would be cost-prohibitive. Though the Albanians have come close. Not to mention that from the Albanians you get 90% of the performance for 10% of the cost. It's the best bang for the buck out there when it comes to inserts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members smorgdonkey Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 Well if it's any consolation, you're still wrong. EG Wrong about the fighting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members etawful Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 Those woodworkers and machinists couldn't find t0An with a jigsaw or a drill press or any kind of lathe. I'll listen to the 14 year old who just got his first guitar (an SX Strat) two weeks ago. Wrong about the fighting. You know if that kid would put some frickin' inserts in the guitar and use bolts instead of screws for the neck, that SX would sound a LOT better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members yanktar Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 I don't care a whit about the clamping force argument; I just like the fact that I don't have to worry about them stripping. Exactly! But you should be able to apply far more force to the insert and machine screw combination than a wood screw. My dad was a machinist and he called the insert, when set into a metal object (as opposed to wood) a "Dutchman". So if you have an aluminum block, a steel "Dutchman" will allow you to bolt something to it that can stand far more force. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members smorgdonkey Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 You know if that kid would put some frickin' inserts in the guitar and use bolts instead of screws for the neck, that SX would sound a LOT better. He won't though...he's busy getting GFS bridge, tuners, saddles, replacement pots and pickups for the SX. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Elias Graves Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 Those woodworkers and machinists couldn't find t0An with a jigsaw or a drill press or any kind of lathe. I'll listen to the 14 year old who just got his first guitar (an SX Strat) two weeks ago. Wrong about the fighting. No, wrong about Leo. EG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Meowy Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 How many millions of guitars have been made since say a Charlie Christian Gibson? How many have metal neck mount inserts? Someone would have found a mass-production or custom shop benefit by now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members honeyiscool Posted January 2, 2012 Members Share Posted January 2, 2012 The best part about this thread is people are still managing to argue and putting in their two cents amid all the jokes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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