Members mineame Posted January 5, 2012 Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 So here's the thing. My new band is pretty solid music wise. We have a good singer/bass player. A good lead player that sings a few songs. A good drummer that also sings a few songs. Then there is me. A good rhythm guitar player that does a few leads, sings a few back ups. Runs lights from on stage with a foot pedal to switch some static scenes. Both the bass player and lead guitarist use music stands. They are small and placed so they aren't obvious. They both do tend to go into reading mode when they sing though. If there is one thing we are missing, it would be a front man. I was thinking today, would it be goofy for the Rhythm guy to be the front man (hell could I even do it? but that is another thread) What do you all think? Goofy? Worth a shot? My guitar is wireless, so I do go out and roam the crowd every so often. I have even been known to get out and dance with a chick / chicks that are dancing by themselves. I think that is a good first step, but don't want to over do it as it may become cliche or look like I am trying to score some after gig nookie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tlbonehead Posted January 5, 2012 Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 So here's the thing. My new band is pretty solid music wise. We have a good singer/bass player. A good lead player that sings a few songs. A good drummer that also sings a few songs.Then there is me. A good rhythm guitar player that does a few leads, sings a few back ups. Runs lights from on stage with a foot pedal to switch some static scenes.Both the bass player and lead guitarist use music stands. They are small and placed so they aren't obvious. They both do tend to go into reading mode when they sing though.If there is one thing we are missing, it would be a front man. I was thinking today, would it be goofy for the Rhythm guy to be the front man (hell could I even do it? but that is another thread)What do you all think? Goofy? Worth a shot?well, it is pretty popular approach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rangefinder Posted January 5, 2012 Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 Yeah, I have trouble seeing how this idea could be at all controversial. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Chip Stewart Posted January 5, 2012 Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 The stereotypical rock band is: Lead Singer/Rhythm Guitar, Lead Guitar, Bass, and Drums. Some bands don't fit this mold such as The Police (Lead Singer/Bass), but the majority of bands have the Rhythm Guitarist also being the Lead Singer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tim_7string Posted January 5, 2012 Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 I guess it all depends upon whether or not you feel you can handle most of the night as the frontman/lead singer. Have you only been doing a few songs since you started? You will need lots of energy and stamina to sing a big portion of the songs for the night. It took me a while to build up my voice to handle an entire night without cracking, straining or giving out. I can sing all night long now, but after years of not being the frontman, it wasn't easy. It may cause some friction in the band, but if they are willing to give it a try, it might turn into something good. But, you never know until you try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members wheresgrant3 Posted January 5, 2012 Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 As Tim said... the question is really can you carry the band as a front person... guitar or no guitar. Your last band had a female front person (right?0 who was the focal point of the band? All her focus was on singing and connecting with the audience, and not delivering the music. From the videos you showed it seemed to work well. Jason (Blackbird 13) fronted his previous band but added a 'hands free' vocalist to front his new band. With our group, our singer is free to jump all over the stage and out into the crowd. He insists on strapping a guitar on for a few songs but we make sure those songs are far and few between. There was a terrific band in my area that recently disbanded. In my opinion they nailed it in terms of musicianship and material... the defining factor that prevented them from graduating to larger rooms was the lack of a dynamic frontman. They all sang... great 4 part vocals. But they were a little like watching the Bare Naked Ladies perform instead of Van Halen perform. They often took turns at the mic and the audience never felt compelled to stick around more than a set or two. It all depends on what style of presentation you want. A frontguy with a guitar strapped will work in any bar situation but it won't elevate you in the larger rooms where you need to work a larger audience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mineame Posted January 5, 2012 Author Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 I guess I failed at being clear here. My bad. I won't be singing any more or less then I already do. The bass player will still remain the main lead singer, easily singing 75% of the songs. The lead guitar player and drummer will still their songs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rangefinder Posted January 5, 2012 Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 I guess I failed at being clear here. My bad. I won't be singing any more or less then I already do. The bass player will still remain the main lead singer, easily singing 75% of the songs. The lead guitar player and drummer will still their songs. So... what's your question, exactly? Because if you want to take center stage in some sense as the rhythm guitarist... but NOT sing very often and NOT play any lead parts... well, I have to think THAT would be kind of weird. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members wrongnote85 Posted January 5, 2012 Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 thread makes no sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mineame Posted January 5, 2012 Author Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 So... what's your question, exactly? Because if you want to take center stage in some sense as the rhythm guitarist... but NOT sing very often and NOT play any lead parts... well, I have to think THAT would be kind of weird. Exactly this. Would it be odd for a guy that doesn't sing the bulk of the songs, or do the bulk of the lead guitar work to try and be some sort of front man. So we aren't as Grant put it "The Bare Naked Ladies" I won't be taking over as the lead singer of this band or any band. That just isn't my role. I am not a good enough singer to do it. All that being said, I am not the type of guy to just sit around with my thumb up my ass and say "oh well." I will try to fix it, and if that means thinking outside the box, then I will. I just thought I would get some of your guy's take on this one option I have to run with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rangefinder Posted January 5, 2012 Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 Who knows. You could argue that Bez was some sort of front man, in the sense you seem to mean it, for the Happy Mondays... and he didn't sing OR play an instrument, just danced around. So... never say never. But I still think it would be a stretch to pull it off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rockerdiva Posted January 5, 2012 Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 Well - Can you ask the bass player /lead singer if he is aware that the stage show is lacking when he is reading from a music stand while singing 75% of the tunes? Can't he memorize the tunes and try to develop his presence a bit? What about the lead guitarist when he sings his songs ... can't they both just lose the music stands? Have you talked to them about this? I'm not picking on music stands, I actually have one when I do a solo. Most people don't notice me checking it out, and I just like it because it puts 100 or so other tunes at my fingertips other than the ones I have memorized. I do tend to think they look worse when a band uses them, though - and for sure - if they are in "reading mode" .... that is NEVER a good thing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members wheresgrant3 Posted January 5, 2012 Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 Exactly this. Would it be odd for a guy that doesn't sing the bulk of the songs, or do the bulk of the lead guitar work to try and be some sort of front man. So we aren't as Grant put it "The Bare Naked Ladies" I won't be taking over as the lead singer of this band or any band. That just isn't my role. I am not a good enough singer to do it. All that being said, I am not the type of guy to just sit around with my thumb up my ass and say "oh well." I will try to fix it, and if that means thinking outside the box, then I will.I just thought I would get some of your guy's take on this one option I have to run with. I'm still a little confused over what your proposing? Like it or not the vocalist is usually the focal point of any band. But it doesn't have to be. The band I described earlier had an identity problem just because of the same issue. They split vocal duties between 2-3 of the singers in the band and passed around songs like a hot potato. The guitarist was really the main singer, and sang about 60% of the songs. But he was often stuck in the corner.... The ideal front guy in that band was a handsome guitarist who had great stage presence. He mostly rapped on songs (instead of singing) but the guy had presence. Instead of putting him upfront he choose to squeeze between the drummer and keyboard player, upstage near the backline. I think he did that by choice... ideally he had the personality to be up front. Instead for some incomprehensible reason they stuck the bass player up front... nice guy, sang backups but not front worthy material. This was a real issue BTW... they had a real hard time drawing and maintaining an audience. They sounded great but there wasn't much of a show. Even my own band... our singer is a great front person... but some nights he is a bit more mellow depending on mood. When our previous guitarist joined the band he was like a bright shot of white testosterone to the front of the stage... a showman and completely engaging to watch. He didn't compete as much as he complimented our frontman... we've encouraged our new guitarist (with great success) to do the same. If you have the personality to be up front... then by all means be up front. It doesn't matter necessarily who's on the mic all of the time as long as you are making eye contact and a connection constantly with that audience. My concentrations is more on running the show... I may peak my head toward the front of the stage, but I'm more making eye contact with our drummer and other keys player on pushing through our transitions from song to song and arrangements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Perfessor Posted January 5, 2012 Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 Jazz bands use stands. If they have to read lyrics, they are not ready for prime time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members GCDEF Posted January 5, 2012 Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 Isn't the front man by definition the one doing most or all of the singing? What exactly are you proposing you do differently that would make you the "front" man? I don't understand the question either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Lee Knight Posted January 5, 2012 Moderators Share Posted January 5, 2012 What's the question? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members FitchFY Posted January 5, 2012 Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 I wouldn't do it. It hasn't worked out well for bands like Metallica or The Beatles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kmart Posted January 5, 2012 Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 What's the question? If I understand, the questions are along the lines of "If I make up for the 2 statues reading from music stands while they sing lead by being active & engaging up at the front of the stage, and maybe handle any witty banter between songs, etc., is that considered 'fronting' the band, and no matter what you call it, is that odd/weird that I do so even though I don't sing any lead vox?" My answer would be that no matter how many cool rock faces/poses one makes while playing or how many clever asides they quip between songs, if you're the rhythm guitarist, it's going to come off as a bit odd BECAUSE you've got 2 other folks who would traditionally be 'the show' for your band not doing so.In other words, I don't think the OPs actions would compensate for their lack of. If anything, I think they would highlight them.The solution is for them to up THEIR show. Start by losing the music stands, or at the very least, becoming far less relient on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kmart Posted January 5, 2012 Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 I wouldn't do it. It hasn't worked out well for bands like Metallica or The Beatles. Neither of those bands had a situation like he's proposing:Hetfield and Lennon both sang a wee bit of lead vox, IIRC... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members FitchFY Posted January 5, 2012 Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 Neither of those bands had a situation like he's proposing: Hetfield and Lennon both sang a wee bit of lead vox, IIRC... Ahh, I get what the OP is saying now - that quip got me to understand it better. Yeah, kmart is on the ball -- the "side man" guy isn't going to make up for the fronts putting on statue performances. If anything, it may actually look kind of... desperate. Like "please like us more, I'm pulling their weight." This is going to turn into a music stand debate, isn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mineame Posted January 5, 2012 Author Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 Yeah I pretty much figured a non-singer type trying to fill a need (front man) would be weird. Thought I would stop in here and see what you guys thought. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators BATCAT Posted January 5, 2012 Moderators Share Posted January 5, 2012 Yeah, I agree with everyone; it's weird. I will say this: I have sen a few bands where the person who made announcements, inter-song banter, etc was someone who didn't sing lead vocals or didn't sing at all, and I felt it worked. But they weren't really "fronting" the band... I would say they were were more taking on an "MC" role and letting the singer just be a performer. As others have said, I think the issue to overcome here is the unengaging singers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kmart Posted January 5, 2012 Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 1)Yeah, I agree with everyone; it's weird.2) I will say this: I have sen a few bands where the person who made announcements, inter-song banter, etc was someone who didn't sing lead vocals or didn't sing at all, and I felt it worked. But they weren't really "fronting" the band... I would say they were were more taking on an "MC" role and letting the singer just be a performer.3)As others have said, I think the issue to overcome here is the unengaging singers. 1) Let me be clear, I don't think the idea is weird or doomed to failure always, but in a band where the guys who would USUALLY be fronting the band are standing still/using music stands, I think it would be. 2) As have I. A little combo from down the road from me you may have heard of called Cheap Trick. Rick is pretty much the (only) guy who talks between songs, introduces the next number, has all the banter, etc. Doesn't take away from the show at all. He's the MC of their shows for sure. But it's not like Robin or Tom are stock-still and not otherwise engaging, either. 3) Yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators BATCAT Posted January 5, 2012 Moderators Share Posted January 5, 2012 1)2) As have I. A little combo from down the road from me you may have heard of called Cheap Trick. Rick is pretty much the (only) guy who talks between songs, introduces the next number, has all the banter, etc. Doesn't take away from the show at all. He's the MC of their shows for sure. But it's not like Robin or Tom are stock-still and not otherwise engaging, either. I think it also makes sense sometimes in that (speaking from experience) an instrument-playing singing "frontperson" has a lot on their plate- singing well while playing well, trying to be the main one engaging the crowd during songs, remembering lyrics... sometimes I wouldn't mind having someone take away the burden of having to think about the "thank yous" and merch table mentions and blah blah... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members J.Paul Posted January 5, 2012 Members Share Posted January 5, 2012 I think everyone is in agreement that what you're suggesting might be too awkward (from the audience perspective) BUT you might could get away with it if you were "singing" a little more and it were perceived (by the audience) as a 1/3 split between the others. Do you like Cake? They've got a few How about learning some old school rap?The Clash has a few songs that aren't demanding.Gary Numan Cars?Limp Bizkit dude just yells....thats a couple of tunes That's almost a set right thereThere's also a singers forum herehttp://acapella.harmony-central.com/forumdisplay.php?119-The-Singer-s-Forum(which is awesome cause this post totally contradicts my last post there) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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