Members Marko Posted June 7, 2006 Members Share Posted June 7, 2006 Originally posted by Black Frog If I owned a bar, I probably would too. But for a band to be under the notion that it should the bar's RESPONSIBILITY to own and provide a sound system is really pushing it. Oh... I totally agree. I wasn't responding to your thread or disagreeing, just in case you thought I was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted June 7, 2006 Members Share Posted June 7, 2006 The bar would also need to deal with service and replacement of broken items etc... not always done in a timely manner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Black Frog Posted June 7, 2006 Members Share Posted June 7, 2006 The bar would also need to deal with service and replacement of broken items etc... And, bands that don't give a crap about the bar's equipment because it isn't theirs, they didn't pay for it, and they don't have to worry about it.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted June 7, 2006 CMS Author Share Posted June 7, 2006 Forget a PA, show me a bar that's got two outlets on two unused circuits remotely close to the "stage" (read: spot where two tables might be slid over). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Axisplayer Posted June 7, 2006 Members Share Posted June 7, 2006 ...and a table with all 4 feet that sits stable would be good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Black Frog Posted June 7, 2006 Members Share Posted June 7, 2006 Some small places in earlier days have just killed me. ".....well, you can run a cord into the kitchen, I think all we have on that circuit is the big freezer. Maybe a fridge too...." ".....You can plug into that outlet over there, but don't unplug the neon beer sign- we need that lit up...." "You mean you need more than two outlets?!?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BassDemon Posted June 7, 2006 Members Share Posted June 7, 2006 Sounds like the bar scene really sucks over there. I'm organising two gigs here One is in a small venue and will draw about 100-120 people (based on past gigs) We charge $5 on the door, everything goes to the band There are no costs for sound or PA, the venue supplies it all.Sound guy is the bar owner. The second gig is at a larger and more central venue. For 4 bands the venue charges $260 for sound, lighting and daytime soundcheck.All PA and lighting is owned by the venue.We charge $10 on the door and should draw 200 people. This isn't playing 4 sets of top 40 in a bar, it's for metal. My old guitar teacher used to play in a traditional bar band (top 40 and radio rock etc) and his band would get $1,000 at most venues.They did all their own PA and lights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members The*Ataris Posted June 7, 2006 Members Share Posted June 7, 2006 I don't think the club scene on this side of the ocean is doing terribly. I just think a lot of people have false expectation for live music... The first realization one must come to is that young people (active participants in nightlife) don't go out to dance to rock music anymore. It's been hip-hop for years and I don't see that changing... Realization number two is that the majority of people watching original live rock bands are 16 to 25 year olds and successful clubs have to accomodate that. Every live music venue here in Colorado that's done good business in recent years, one, has a rockin' soundsystem that draws national acts, and two, is capable of doing all-ages shows and still get a significant take at the bar. The ability to market music to both age groups is essential to good business... Every other venue format right now just seems archaic... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RainsongDR1000 Posted June 7, 2006 Members Share Posted June 7, 2006 DOn't know if I should be even replying since I'm not a professional soundman or a professional musician. I'm the "weekend warrior" who makes a decent living owning my own printing company and play in an acoustic duo for fun and "gear money" 3-4 times a month. We make an average of $175.00 per 3 hour gig, run our own sound from stage and once a month I haul my 2 Carvin PM15's, 2 EV sx100's, Yorkville powered mixer, 3 mics, 3 stands to the neighborhood watering hole and host an open mic for 3 hours. Even though I only make $100, it's good practice, let's me hear what my system sounds like from "the other side", allows me to visit with friends and gives some of the other local "weekend wariors" their 15 minutes of fame once a month. There are no contracts or riders at this or any other place we play. I'd imagine the guy in question is not doing this for a living and is happy to just be making $15/ hr having fun in the environment he likes. I'd also imagine he won't be cutting into the pro's gigs until he makes a name for himself, and then his prices will go up. The Printing business has these type of folks working out of their garage and "whoring" the market so to speak, but they usually either whore themselves out of business or cater to clientele that is strictly shopping on price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Zeromus-X Posted June 8, 2006 Members Share Posted June 8, 2006 $175 for a 3-hour gig? Wow, I'm constantly bitching that we're making $300-$400 for a 3-hour one. I guess it all depends on location. I'm playing in another band with some guys who have been at it for awhile. One of them has played in bands constantly; the other was out of the "scene" for about ten years. He's constantly amazed by what he's finding out; last thing he remembers, it was easy as hell to go out, play an hour long gig as a rock band, and walk away with $1000 if you were headlining the show. $450 for a 4-hour set just blew him away, which is what we made the other night (not the same band). In regards to the hip-hop comment: I've noticed that, while people do want to dance to the hip-hop and such, they'll also get into slower songs. I compromise a bit; we're a country and classic rock (for the most part) cover band, but I throw in a lot of stuff between... samples while the band is changing instruments or taking a break, I've got a bass drop pad and an electronic snare pad that I'll break into if I see people moving on the floor, etc. That's the great thing that live bands still have that DJs can't quite compete with... the fact that they can play exactly to what the audience is doing. The DJ can do this to an extent, but if it's too far off from the last thing, people just get confused. We played a show where a bunch of guys showed up into heavier music. We ended with "Freebird", which most of the bar wanted to hear... because it's a bar and they {censored}ing have to hear it apparently... but during the fast part at the end, I double-bassed the whole thing. Constant, ridiculous speed. It got the people who liked the heavy stuff's attention, and the people who liked Freebird seemed to enjoy it and it picked up the energy a bit. (I didn't get lynched after the show, which was a plus.) /rant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Marko Posted June 8, 2006 Members Share Posted June 8, 2006 In all fairness to RainsongDR1000, there are people gigging for different reasons. He's got his business, and he likes to play for people, enjoy his friends, express his art, keep his chops up, etc. It's a hobby, for fun and gear money. Maybe he'd rather do that than golf or fish or mountainclimb. If I admitted what I've got in bikes you'd call me an idiot, I just hope I enjoy my bike riding as much as he enjoys his gigging, and I wish I could say I made a $175 bucks per putt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rxnet Posted June 8, 2006 Members Share Posted June 8, 2006 lets take it back a little...80's..I visited my best friend in Florida to see Ozzy play down in Tampa (unfortunately this was the concert forever remembered as Randy Rhoads died right before it in a plane crash) anyway...I can remember going to this bar in Tampa (if anybody from the sunshine state can help me with the name that would be great) where a band called Stranger played all originals. What I remember (or the Alabama slammers will allow me to remember) was a GREAT bar....it had lots of open space for dancing-the stage was real size so the band was front and center...not pushed off into a corner-the bar was perfectly designed as it was two floors designed so every bar on the first floor faced the stage and bars on the second floor faced the stage-sound system was awesome-also had a seperate bar for dance music that was attached but seperated enough that there was no music overflow.....it catered to the headbangers ball and the disco ball......and this bar was packed every night!! I just think you need the right mix of talent-sound-venue-musical mix-clientel to be a successful bar where you can make the draw of people and pay bands some of the higher fees to make it worth their while....now I need a slammer!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted June 8, 2006 CMS Author Share Posted June 8, 2006 Trouble is, there aren't that many Tampa's.....cities big enough to support a few large clubs like this (if there's only one in town, it's still a pretty dismal prospect that you'll get to play it consistently), and there aren't a lot of entrepeneurs with the kind of scratch to make a go of it. The reality is that there are a lot of bars out there, and enough of them can draw enough drinkers to make a good profit for the house, but it doesn't seem that bands make enough of an increase in business to justify higher fees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bigbang Posted June 8, 2006 Members Share Posted June 8, 2006 Bands I gigged with in the 80's used to make $1000 - $1200 per night playing live rock at least two nights a week. Bars were ALWAYS packed. Now the going rate is $500 - $800 and a it's rare for a club to have more than one packed night regardless what the entertainment is. I believe the downward trend in the club scene is drunk driving laws. No one party's like the old days. Too much risk. Just my $.02 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RainsongDR1000 Posted June 8, 2006 Members Share Posted June 8, 2006 Originally posted by bigbang I believe the downward trend in the club scene is drunk driving laws. No one party's like the old days. Too much risk.Just my $.02 You have hit the nail on the head. By playing partner used to make a decent living playing the bar scene in the 80's and he firmly believes the DWI laws are what has curtailed the live music scene. PS - to Zeromus... Remember $175.00 is only divided 2 ways and set up and tear down for an acoustic duo is about 30-40 ea. way.So that's a little more than $20 an hour/ea. (cash, usually) and a couple of free drinks. Not a bad way to spend a Friday evening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted June 8, 2006 Members Share Posted June 8, 2006 This is where the quality of the gig plays into the pricing. A really fun gig can pay less and still be enjoyable. Areally crappy gig is still crappy but just less painful when the pay is excellent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted June 8, 2006 CMS Author Share Posted June 8, 2006 Originally posted by agedhorse This is where the quality of the gig plays into the pricing. A really fun gig can pay less and still be enjoyable. Areally crappy gig is still crappy but just less painful when the pay is excellent. Very true, and applies to all forms of employment, IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members GigMan Posted June 10, 2006 Members Share Posted June 10, 2006 Originally posted by agedhorse This is where the quality of the gig plays into the pricing. A really fun gig can pay less and still be enjoyable. Areally crappy gig is still crappy but just less painful when the pay is excellent. So true - here in New Jersey, I'll play bar gigs w/rock bands (as a kybd. player) take home only $80 - $125 bucks cash in my pocket but really enjoy it! Yet I also do wedding gigs and come home w/400 bucks (coctkail hr. & 4 hr. reception) - or close to 5 bills if there's a ceremony for me to play as well... but I'll be totally stressed out on some of those and come home and collapse. Then again - either way (low-paying fun bar gigs where friends can come or high-paying but stressful wedding receptions), I'm playing music and making money, it beats driving a truck (which I've done as well)! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Dan Magers Posted June 10, 2006 Author Members Share Posted June 10, 2006 I think I'll just grow zucchini. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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