life span of speakers

[badhabit]

I realize this question will probably make me sound like a dunce but I want to ask anyway. Do speakers, the actual drivers/transducers, have a life span? I realize there are many variables but in reality, is there a point where they are worn out? Let's assume for a minute that a speaker is never abused or subjected to adverse conditions. But it is used frequently. Since a speaker (woofer) does have a moving part, the surround and cone, it seems that those parts would wear out eventually. Then of course, the quality of the manufacturer factors in. Let's assume it is of the highest quality available. Could one expect a 10 yr, 20 yr, 30 yr, etc. usable life. Something to be considered when buying used, yes?

[Dogoth]

You are correct in you thinking. The variables matter a lot. In a humid environment you get corrosion. In a dry environment you get dry rot (like spider and suround suspension parts). If the drivers been driven hard (not necessarily past it's rated specs though), eventualy the suspension parts will wear (not respond as well as they should). If the speaker's been driven even a little harder then the VC glue can melt Etc Etc Etc.....

 

I'd say there isn't any hard and fast rule.

 

There are a few speaker rebuilders on this forum who I'm sure have seen a lot more speakers than I have and who can maybe give a better reply.

 

Sorry I can't give a better answer.

[twostone]

Running the factory RMS rating without any clipping involved I could see a

20yr span but in real world it never happens. So hard to say most add to much or not enough it's either or. My rule of thumb I learn is the more air you move the more volume you can achieve might be wrong but works for my dumb hillbilly ass.

[W. M. Hellinger]

 

There are a few speaker rebuilders on this forum who I'm sure have seen a lot more speakers than I have and who can maybe give a better reply.

 

I've reconed some of the best cone drivers made... some of which had one show of operating time (approx 2 hours). They weren't blown, but the suspensions were completely shot.

 

I've reconed some fairly cheap cone drivers... some of which were approx. 30 years old and had been operated installed in a busy venue 5 to 7 days a week, upwards of 10 hours a day for most of those 30 years (approx 100,000 operating hours)... and they didn't actually need reconed... they were fine and probably would have run a decade or two longer but the owner thought a fresh recone job would be a good thing.

 

Based on my experience I'd say a good estimate on average lifespan of a cone driver would be somewhere between 2 hours and 100,000 hours operating time.

[Al Poulin]

Based on my experience I'd say a good estimate on average lifespan of a cone driver would be somewhere between 2 hours and 100,000 hours operating time.

 

 

I love it.

 

Odds are in your favour that your statement is at least fairly accurate.

[W. M. Hellinger]

I love it. Odds are in your favour that your statement is at least fairly accurate.

Actually, based on what I've experienced, here's a more accurate statement:

 

"Based on my experience I'd say a good estimate on the average lifespan of a cone driver could be less than 2 hours or more than 100,000 hours operating time, or somewhere in-between."

 

Also: Every vehicle I've purchased in my life was used when I purchased it. Every vehicle I've purchased was way past due for a brake job when I purchased it, regardless of the milage registered on the odometer. I've never given a single vehicle I've owned another brake job after the initial brake job I administered directly after I purchased the vehicle. And... to my recollection, I don't believe I've ever put more than maybe 25% wear on a set of brakes on a vehicle I've owned (less than 10% is probably more accurate), and I've put well in-excess of 250,000 miles on some of the vehicles I've owned. Point being: It's obvious to me that many (most) folk's driving habits wear-out a set of brakes in 100,000 miles or less, where-as it's possible that a set of vehicle brakes could last me 1,000,000 miles or more. I've also found that generally the higher the quality of the vehicle... the harder it's been driven, judging by the abuse the brakes have taken. I've also found that generally the higher the quality of the loudspeakers, the harder they've been driven judging by the condition of the cones that needed reconed.

[W. M. Hellinger]

I love it. Odds are in your favour that your statement is at least fairly accurate.

I strive for at least a 50/50 chance of being right 10% of the time.

[dboomer]

 

Do speakers, the actual drivers/transducers, have a life span?

 

 

Yes ... they are simple mechanical devices and wear out over time. It depends on how hard you drive them and how well you store them. I had a set of UPA's that I used for over 20 years and the guy I sold them to a few years ago is still using them ... with no recones.

 

If you take a 60W light bulb rated at 120V and run it at 120v it will last about 2000 hours. If you run it at 130v it will be a few percent brighter and last about 200 hours. If you run it at 110v it will be a few percent dimmer but last 8000 hours.

[W. M. Hellinger]

 

If you take a 60W light bulb rated at 120V and run it at 120v it will last about 2000 hours. If you run it at 130v it will be a few percent brighter and last about 200 hours. If you run it at 110v it will be a few percent dimmer but last 8000 hours.

 

And since a (incadecent) light bulb is approx 2 - 3% efficient (about the same as a cone driver) the difference between running at 110V and 130V is possibly perceivable, but not necessarily dramatic... hence the difference between the perceived output of the lightbulb (or speaker) operating @ 130v for 200 hours before burning out and the lightbulb (or speaker) operating @ 110V for 8000 hours before burning out might be splitting hairs.

 

In Moscow, ID the line voltage seems to commonly be somewhere around 124V. Admittedly... if you haven't been around Moscow for awhile... the lights seem a little bit brighter... but if you've lived in Moscow for any length of time... you get really tired really quick of changing lightbulbs.

 

Of-course, running speakers 3dB harder (barely perceiveable for most) is a considerable than 110V and 130V. And running speakers 10dB harder (perceived as like twice as loud dude) is 10 times the wattage conversion.

[badhabit]

Thanks guys. All very interesting. I come from a guitar player's perspective and in some circles, mint, vintage amps ( Fender, Marshall ) command top dollar. A premium is placed on original condition, including original speakers. Guys pay a lot for 60's era Celestion GM25's. And a 59 Bassmen commands more if the original 10's are in it. But I realize sound re-enforcement is not the same as guitar playing because we actually like our sound to be somewhat "fuzzy" sometimes:) And I guess reconing a $500.00 transducer at a cost of $150.00 or so is still better than buying cheaper for the same price. Or is it? If the $500.00 speaker is useless after one show and $150.00 speaker is still working many years later, what are we paying $500.00 for? A brand name?

[moody]

 

Thanks guys. All very interesting. I come from a guitar player's perspective and in some circles, mint, vintage amps ( Fender, Marshall ) command top dollar. A premium is placed on original condition, including original speakers. Guys pay a lot for 60's era Celestion GM25's. And a 59 Bassmen commands more if the original 10's are in it. But I realize sound re-enforcement is not the same as guitar playing because we actually like our sound to be somewhat "fuzzy" sometimes:) And I guess reconing a $500.00 transducer at a cost of $150.00 or so is still better than buying cheaper for the same price. Or is it? If the $500.00 speaker is useless after one show and $150.00 speaker is still working many years later, what are we paying $500.00 for? A brand name?

 

 

Umm. I think the point was that the person paying for the $500 driver would tend to abuse it much more than the $150 driver. The $500 driver in this case is definately better - just still not good enough for the situation it is in.

 

(I have a guitar speaker in an amp of mine from the mid 60's - original cone - still going strong but I suspect never played at any incredible volumes).

[axeman6969]

I'd really like to see what Agedhorse has to say about this since he's actually old enough to have seen drivers actually "wear out". :-)

 

OK, so am I, but I've never kept a piece of equipment long enough to wear out.

[TimmyP]

At work we've got 30 year old JBL D120Fs with original cones that are working just fine. We've also had to replace a number of 5 year old Jensens owing to the cones shattering. So it depends on a lot of factors.

[agedhorse]

Aside from physical damage (dirt/goo/fluids/direct sun,foot) a speaker's life is inversely proportional to the power applied. This is essentially the same as Don and Mark indicated.

 

Running under the point that the suspension transitions from it's purely elastic motion to inelastic motion, the speaker will last almost indefinately (>20 years) but as the speaker operates in it's inelastic region, lifespan will deteriorate very quickly. This is why my recommendations stay away fron the inelastic area.

 

I typically expect 20 years on all my boxes, rarely am I disappointed and often speakers last well beyond this. I also do not operate beyond the RMS rating of the speaker without taking "engineering precautions", including properly calibrated limiting, bandwidth limiting, duty cycle considerations etc.

[W. M. Hellinger]

 

Running under the point that the suspension transitions from it's purely elastic motion to inelastic motion, the speaker will last almost indefinately (>20 years) but as the speaker operates in it's inelastic region, lifespan will deteriorate very quickly. This is why my recommendations stay away fron the inelastic area.

 

If I remember correctly the term for the point of inelastic motion is yield point. There's tensile strength, yield strength, and breaking strength. If the tensile strength isn't exceeded, the spring will retain it's original characteristics MOL indefinitely. If the tensile strength is exceeded to the yield point the spring is deformed and will never return to normal.

[dboomer]

Run reasonably I don't think you need to worry about the suspension ... unless its a foam type (which isn't normally used in Live Sound products). Foam surrounds dry out and rot in about 10 years no matter what you do.

[badhabit]

 

Foam surrounds dry out and rot in about 10 years no matter what you do.

 

I found that out. I had a nice pair of home stereo speakers I put into storage. Years later I went to get them and the woofers were shot. All dry-rotted out, the surrounds that is. If that is a problem with foam surrounds, why do home speaker manufacturers make them that why?

[InACanProductions]

 

I found that out. I had a nice pair of home stereo speakers I put into storage. Years later I went to get them and the woofers were shot. All dry-rotted out, the surrounds that is. If that is a problem with foam surrounds, why do home speaker manufacturers make them that why?

 

 

planned obsolescence maybe

[Gregidon]

 

I found that out. I had a nice pair of home stereo speakers I put into storage. Years later I went to get them and the woofers were shot. All dry-rotted out, the surrounds that is. If that is a problem with foam surrounds, why do home speaker manufacturers make them that why?

 

 

Cheapest material possible.... in most consumer electronics price point is the main deciding factor.

[W. M. Hellinger]

Cheapest material possible.... in most consumer electronics price point is the main deciding factor.

Hey, it worked flawlessly for the length of the origional purchaser's warranty, didn'tit? And... your point is? You ever seen a feeder calf at a slaughter yard? All hep up on goof-balls takes on a whole new meaning if you haven't seen it before.

 

Not to be a devil's advocate, but: origional purchasers pay the rent. Secondary purchasers ask a lot of questions. However... I do realize that what made Harley Davidson great was the fact that wrenches could utilize 3 or 4 generations of product components. I'm fixing on catching that similar wave.

 

I wouldn't spill the beans, but I don't think the competition's watchin.

 

Hopefully I'm not selling francises to clothing botiques in 20 years.

[Gregidon]

Hey, it worked flawlessly for the length of the origional purchaser's warranty, didn'tit? And... your point is? You ever seen a feeder calf at a slaughter yard? All hep up on goof-balls takes on a whole new meaning if you haven't seen it before. Not to be a devil's advocate, but: origional purchasers pay the rent. Secondary purchasers ask a lot of questions. However... I do realize that what made Harley Davidson great was the fact that wrenches could utilize 3 or 4 generations of product components. I'm fixing on catching that similar wave. I wouldn't spill the beans, but I don't think the competition's watchin. Hopefully I'm not selling francises to clothing botiques in 20 years.

 

 

Hey don't get me wrong. I'm not saying there is anything wrong with the cheapest possible approach. Let's be honest, if you aren't using the cheapest possible then you are losing money. The market will bear what it will bear. If most people consumers demanded stereo speakers with rubber surrounds that would last 20 years were willing to pay for it then that's what we'd have in stereos, most aren't and are more driven by the price.

 

Don't get me wrong through, it would be nice if the average consumer was willing to pay for higher quality stuff, but places like wal-y-world make it very clear this is not the case.....

[W. M. Hellinger]

 

it would be nice if the average consumer was willing to pay for higher quality stuff, but places like wal-y-world make it very clear this is not the case.....

 

I think consumers will pay for the quality that fits the application. I believe lifestyle image and reacting to the tidalwave of advertising many consumers are subjected to drives many buying decisions in the first place... and real need is oftentimes not a criterion. If there is no real need in the first place, then paying for true quality when deciding on a discretionary or impulse item is doubtfully a very high criterion.