The Portable PA & the Solo Performer

[Keithos28]

. If you are making a living as a musician and part of that is gigging, then you don't mess around with entry level Peavey stuff. I

 

:)Richardmac many thanks for your comments; and all the rest for the insight into something that appears 'not as simple' as some folks think. Now I played last night at 'Acoustic Night' and the sound man [who is a Pro Musician] brought his Peavey Mixer [older model] and 15" Peavey Speaker plus he had a floor 12" floor monitor [which was not in use] but he says the floor monitor can act as Speaker [facing the audience] when necessary. Small atmosphere much like [playhouse theatre] and audience about 25/30 people. Every performer had one song to perform. He had the 15" on the ground; when we play outside [not raining] then the speaker is up on a stand. I thought that inside he should have it up on the stand. But I asked him what kind of system he would recommend and of course he felt that the Peavey was like the 'energizer bunny' ; took a licking and kept on ticking. He also insisted that it was mobile enough and even though it did not have all the bells and whistels that the new Pa systems carry; he felt it was reliable. I cant remember his mixer model [10 channel] ; thought it was something XR600GF or XR800GF, RF or something like that. I felt the mixer was too bulky to be mobile, but I seen him put it on his cart and wheel to his car with ease. Course now the mixer and speakers in this day and age , slap together, [ or the mixer fits in behind a compartment in the speakers] and everything is picked up as one with one hand practically.

PS: Noticed someone posted on craigs list [locally] A peavey XR600F with two 15" Peavey Speakers $550.00

[Craig Vecchione]

 

A peavey XR600F with two 15" Peavey Speakers $550.00

 

 

The XR600 is indeed legendary for reliability...they go from XR600A? to G, I think, and are now the XR8300 and XR8600.

 

And yes, a compact box powered mixer, and three speakers will make a decent complete system. Pay a LOT more attention to the speakers you buy than the mixer. The speakers are where the rubber meets the road, and skimping there (which is what all the lock-together varieties do, IMO) will doom the rig to mediocrity.

 

Just for fun, have a try at the Bose PAS system. It's well beyond a $1000 budget, but the portability and ease of use, and good sound make it a no-brainer for solo and duet use in smallish venues.

[guitarharv52]

If you are going the powered mixer route you might check out on MusiciansFriend's live sound package deals.They have a selection of brands for you to look at(my choice would be Yamaha or Peavey).If you are not too well versed in gain staging and sound reinforcement in general these are handy systems if you are not planning on building a larger PA.For example (a little over your budget but it is complete) is the Yamaha EMX512 package which comes with the mixer,4club 15's(2foh2monitor),speaker stands, a couple of AKG mics,and all cables.This for $1850

When you decide on a system you still want the stands and cables to be figured in your cost.Good Luck!!

[Rbts]

Good enough is good enough, and usually, Peavey actually IS good enough. When it is NOT good enough, they usually have a higher end line that IS good enough, OR... somebody can afford to just rent a system and not worry about it. Peavey is a company that has been around for a long time, and values it's reputation for making quality product offerings at decent prices.

 

I suppose I like BMW and Volov as much as the next guy, but a late model Chevy is plenty good for me, and what I actually drive is a 10 year old Ford.

[Craig Vecchione]

I suppose I like BMW and Volov as much as the next guy, but a late model Chevy is plenty good for me, and what I actually drive is a 10 year old Ford.

 

Eh, you think you drive proletariat car, but Ford owned Volvo, and that makes you petite bourgeoisie.We have cleansing class every Tuesday. You come to class.

 

 

 

 

[Rbts]

Eh, you think you drive proletariat car, but Ford owned Volvo, and that makes you petite bourgeoisie . We have cleansing class every Tuesday. You come to class.

 

You have revealed my shame. I will be at class.

[Keithos28]

RBTS you had mentioned Yorkville in this thread. I am not familiar with them but from the research I have done, it appears to be made by a company in Canada. Yorkville appears to make high quality mixers. There is someone selling a Yorkville M810 Powered Mixer [locally] for $550. He says he bought it a year ago. 10 channels plus 2. Seems to be just the thing to "grow with". I would imagine though that some very good quality speakers to go with it would be needed. Anyone have any thoughts on the quality of the M810. It appears to have come out in 2004. Also what kind of reasonable offer [if I decide] would be suitable. Rule of thumb 'been told' is that most audio equipment [when sold second-hand] should be 1/2 the list price. In this case the Yorkville M810 list is between $1149.99 - $1129.00 although it appears that the sale price = $861 new on the street.

[Rbts]

Yes, Canadian Company. My own PA is founded on their NX 550P speakers, which is a powered speaker, so the amp is included, in a cabinet with a 12" woofer, and a high freq horn. I have been very pleased with them. They were purchased after hearing many people on this forum speak well of them.

 

Their instrument amplifier line is Traynor, which has been around for a long long time too. I do not know about their mixers, but I would be inclined to trust a product with their name on it.

 

I agree with your research, and the price used is usually about half of what the actual cost was new... (not the "suggested retail" or some gimmick price), so if something sold for $ 850 new, then $ 425 would be a closer general estimate of it's value used than $ 550.

 

When I was putting together a system, I decided to go with powered speakers, and a passive mixer, instead of a powered mixer and passive speakers... but it is commanly done either way.

[Keithos28]

When I was putting together a system, I decided to go with powered speakers, and a passive mixer, instead of a powered mixer and passive speakers... but it is commanly done either way.

 

So the M810 is a powered Mixer ?

 

Powered mixer VS Passive Mixer !! I apologize if I seem confused; I guess I need to take Course PA101.

 

It appears that the Yorkville M810 has [among its many features] 'the mono line inputs on channels 5 and 6 are pre-eqd for HI-Z instrument level input, making them an ideal place to start when looking for that perfect live acoustic guitar or direct bass sound'

 

[Rbts]

ha ha... I am not familiar with the M810 mixer specifically. I AM familiar with the Yorkville Company. You said:" There is someone selling a Yorkville M810 Powered Mixer [locally] for $550. " I took it from this that the M810 WAS a powered mixer. Maybe not? I will do some research and find out.

 

Yep, sure is... a powered mixer... with two amps on board, each 400 watts at 4 ohm.

 

Sure this would be a good mixer for a solo artist, and I think a couple of Yorkville NX 35 speakers would be a good match for it.

[John Bartus]

Just going to add my $0.02...

 

I've been doing the solo acoustic gig thing since the 70s (full-time working pro), and I've gone through more than my share of PA setups. The first was an *old* Peavey powered mixer and two speakers each containing 2 10" drivers. No horns or tweeters. I then "graduated" to the venerable Shure Vocal Master (Vocal Disaster) PA setup -- a powered mixer with large knobs and "anti-feedback" switches combined with two five-feet-tall speaker towers containing multiple 10" drivers. Again, no horns or tweeters.

 

Since then, I've used more than my fair share of PA setups, including the Peavey XR600 (a real warhorse), the original Fender Passport (great concept, not-so-great sound), and stuff from Yamaha, Yorkville, JBL, Peavey, EV, Behringer, even the old Kustom tuck-n-roll, and more that I can't remember. BTW, the new Kustom is crap -- the only advantage is the price point.

 

The rig I use for solo dates in clubs now sounds as good as any small setup can, and while not the cheapest, it won't totally break the bank. I have a Behringer powered mixer (actually, several, because they are inexpensive and I hate gigging without backup) feeding two EV Force i cabinets (15" + a horn each). The Behringer offers lightweight power, decent effects, and a goodly amount of inputs at a rather low price point. The EVs are great speakers for the money -- good, solid low end and crystal clear highs.

 

I feed the mixer with a Shure Beta 58 mic, a Digitech Vocalist 2 harmonizer, an Akai Head Rush looper pedal, and a Fishman Aura preamp for my acoustic guitars. I usually position the speakers so I can hear them, but I also have wedges and in-ears that I can use if I can't.

 

As with anything, YMMV. End of $0.02.

[John Bartus]

BTW, the Yorkville stuff is quality stuff, too.

[pikappant82]

 

for $550. " I took it from this that the M810 WAS a powered mixer. Maybe not? I will do some research and find out. Yep, sure is... a powered mixer... with two amps on board, each 400 watts at 4 ohm. Sure this would be a good mixer for a solo artist, and I think a couple of Yorkville NX 35 speakers would be a good match for it.

 

 

Just a note: I was actually looking at the M810 in a local music store yesterday. The 2 x 400W @ 4ohms is actually MAX power. I read it right off the back of the mixer.

[Rbts]

 

Just a note: I was actually looking at the M810 in a local music store yesterday. The 2 x 400W @ 4ohms is actually MAX power. I read it right off the back of the mixer.

 

 

Yea. So is that enough "power"? I dunno.

[fingerpicker]

I bought the new Bose L1 with the T1 tonematch.. Yes its triple your price-range, but before I was always buying new gear and now im happy. I play solo and duo gigs.

 

If its strictly small coffe shop gigs get one powered speaker JBL eon g2, and a cheap small mixer with some onboard efx. You''ll be under a grand, and can always add a second speaker if you go beyond coffee shop gigs.

[daklander]

Fishman now has a very portable line array system that would work great for coffee shop and similar situations. A thousand bucks and IMO, many instances would require an add on sub so the cost would be that much higher but still less than the Bose PAS.

[J.]

Does anyone have any experience with the new(ish) Peavey TriFlex system? I ask because someone is selling one on my local craigslist for $800. I don't have any particular use for one at the moment, but it does peak my curiousity. They look like a modernized, powered take on the old Dawn speaker system. I'd like to see one in action.

[Craig Vecchione]

 

Fishman now has a very portable line array system that would work great for coffee shop and similar situations. A thousand bucks and IMO, many instances would require an add on sub so the cost would be that much higher but still less than the Bose PAS.

 

 

 

Have you tried or heard it?

 

That's mighty short to be called a line-array. I'd imagine the dispersion won't be nearly as effective as the PAS...it would only act as a line source at a pretty high frequency. It would be interesting if the bass response was usable as-is, as Fishman claims.

[daklander]

 

Have you tried or heard it? That's mighty short to be called a line-array. I'd imagine the dispersion won't be nearly as effective as the PAS...it would only act as a line source at a pretty high frequency. It would be interesting if the bass response was usable as-is, as Fishman claims.

 

 

 

No, I've not seen or heard it yet. It's not even on Fishman's website yet, or wasn't a couple of days ago. The description is "line array" on the ads I've seen and I suppose like most advertisers, they're being a bit lenient in the actuality vs the description.

 

With that unit supposedly having the essence of the Loudbox units, it should be a very dependable system and should also sound quite good, depending on the low end reproduction, and I agree it's going to be interesting to see if it does, indeed, handle those lower end frequencies as claimed.

 

I think it's going to be a viable, lower cost, alternative to the Bose PAS, of which I'm somewhat familiar, having heard it in real life situations, indoors and out. It also won't surprise me if other similar systems aren't showing up in the near future.

[Keithos28]

I have been looking at Mixers and Pa systems on local selling sites like [CL] Craig's List for example. Some are selling Mixers; or a mixer with speakers; or just speakers; or Speakers Stands. For one who is entering the PA system environment for the first time, one obviously needs the accessories that go with the 'circle of sound' such as , dynamic microphones, 20 ' mic cables, speaker stands, and 20 ' speaker cables etc... Unless you got a terrific deal on CL, you could end up spending nearly as much as one of those PA packages that the Music Online Outlets [such as MF]. If you bought a Mixer here, and the Speakers somewhere else, and the speaker stands [again privately] ...well you know what I am getting at !

I have not found private sellers on CL willing to part with their product at a bargain price, or what I would consider 1/2 off the regular price for the product if it was brand new.

Just an observation !

[fingerpicker]

I dont think that fishman amp would be comparable to the bose system at all.

 

The better choice over any combo amp is a powered speaker and small mixer for the simple fact that you can add more speakers and build on having a real PA (for small/medium venues)

 

This aint rocket science

[Rbts]

...well you know what I am getting at ! I have not found private sellers on CL willing to part with their product at a bargain price, or what I would consider 1/2 off the regular price for the product if it was brand new. Just an observation !

 

Yes, you are quite right. This is an expensive endeavor, no two ways about it.

 

www.audiopile.net has good deals on cables.

www.audioeast.com has some attractive packages.

 

Fingerpicker is right too... it ain't rocket science, but there are maybe too many choices, and ways to look at things. Until you exceed the input capacity (which would not take much but still,) an acoustic amp can be a very viable alternative to a PA system, and if it has a line out (which it should), it is quite easily made louder with the addition of powered speakers.

[Keithos28]

A buddy of mine wants to part with a Mackie 808S and a pair of Mackie 300 speakers. The system comes with the cables , one Shure PG58 MIC, one SM58 MIC , a couple of MIC XLR Cables, 2 on-stage stands with Boom. May main concern was what to offer on 808s. It sells new for $879 and on ebay used $625. I have not seen the 300 speakers so I figure they could be C300E, which sell new for $379.00, on ebay I see some mackie 300 speakers selling for about $300 -479. My struggle is what its all worth. The tough part is that this person is my best friend. I am figuring all used is well over the $1000 mark. Now the Mackie 808s is a powered mixer , stereo at 1200 watts. Which is something I could grow with for sure.

If anyone has a suggestion on what the package (I just described) would be worth let me know, thanks for all the input.....Keith

[Rbts]

Used stuff is worth exactly what you can get for it.

 

If someone is willing to sit on their stuff forever, maybe they will end up finding a buyer at a higher price... but... maybe not.

 

I think business should be fair... especially between friends. What is fair? I think a fair deal is one you would be just as happy to have either side of.

 

I don't think there would be anything wrong with offering your friend $ 1000 for that system. It may not be as much as he hopes he is going to get... but as they say... a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. If I had that stuff, and someone offered to actually give me $ 1000 for it, I would be glad... especially if it was a friend. Sure it might not be as much as I hoped to get for it maybe... but there is something to be said for actually getting something SOLD. Who better to give a good deal to than a friend... if he is really a friend.

[MusicalSchizo]

 

Don't know about the B215As, but I do know the B212As do not put out any real bottom end. I demo'd them at my local music store, and although the mid and top end really sounded pretty good with a little EQ, the low frequencies simply do not go very low. There is not much information below 100hz coming out of those boxes. They are very compact and small platic boxes... A pair of those with a compact powered sub would be an OK sounding solution on a budget.

 

 

I have not had exactly the same experience you had at the store, in practice, with the Behringers - they've provided a good amount of bass response for me (and in my band I use one of them as a bass monitor for a 5-string, so...) - not a great amount, but enough so I can hear all that I am doing.

 

I can't imagine he would have any bass issues with two of the B215As, though - I used to use 2 B300s and those things had plenty of bass.

 

This is for coffee houses...not exactly large venues. That's why I thought the B212As with their mostly even sound, compact size, and low price might be a perfect choice for him.

 

My old main small-venue rig was a Peavey XR600C (circa 1982 or so) with two Peavey column speakers that had a 12, a 10 and a horn. It was great, if a little cardboard-sounding. That thing is still kicking (my brother uses it now)...and it was old when I bought it in 1994.

 

I do love the Yorkville stuff I've heard, though...and considering how well it's made - it's a great value. For our "little rig" my band uses one of the Yorkville 2x10" 700-watt powered subs - that thing KICKS and is perfect for smaller venues. That thing and a pair of powered speakers would be a great mains rig for his application.

 

Anyway, you can get what you need to do the gigs and sound good for less than $1000 - it's very important that you learn how to make whatever you've got work to your advantage, though, in that price range. I can't tell you how many times I've heard people who have no idea what they're doing exploit all the worst things about a small PA system...a problem easily avoided with some listening and some smarts.

 

Brian V.