Members Diametro Posted January 19, 2007 Author Members Share Posted January 19, 2007 Hey! You still have the fusion? How you doing? Whats up?Well, I just started producing for Beyonce and a couple of projects she has going on the side ... but other than that I never leave my room ...Other than to get some fresh air and move my bowels in the outhouse ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mildbill Posted January 19, 2007 Members Share Posted January 19, 2007 ....I for one was particularly disapointed by the lack of audio tracks in the M3 ... well, the specs (under interface) say it's got usb2 and you can put a firewire card in it: http://www.korg.com/gear/prod_info.asp?A_PROD_NO=M3 maybe you can record into an external hard drive? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Diametro Posted January 19, 2007 Author Members Share Posted January 19, 2007 well, the specs (under interface) say it's got usb2 and you can put a firewire card in it:http://www.korg.com/gear/prod_info.asp?A_PROD_NO=M3maybe you can record into an external hard drive? I'm quite confident they are leaving out the audio tracks to 1) marginally keep the price down 2) differentiate it from the Oasys 3) and differentiate it from the Triton Extreme replacement, which I do not believe this is. The M3 is the new Karma. IMO, Korg will release another more expensive workstation that comes that ditches the Karma but adds audio tracks, slightly more sound rom, more insert FXs but still doesn't feature the flagship Oasys control surface, HD, big LCD and perhaps still isn't open-ended but does throw in one or two extra synth types. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MartinHines Posted January 19, 2007 Members Share Posted January 19, 2007 3) and differentiate it from the Triton Extreme replacement, which I do not believe this is. The M3 IS the Triton series replacement (Korg has said so). The M3 name means "3rd generation" with:-- 1st generation: Korg M/1-- 2nd generation: Korg Triton-- 3rd generation: Korg M3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Diametro Posted January 19, 2007 Author Members Share Posted January 19, 2007 I know what Korg is saying, Martin, about the M3. But do you think Korg is going to forever release an under $3k synth with no audio tracks forever? And when that synth is released, do you think that synth will cost more or less than the M3? And if this isn't the new Karma, then why put Karma in the Triton replacement? Are we to assume this Karma II technology adds nothing to the cost of the machine? Do people who buy Tritons really want Karma? But why make Karma in a new technology so unafforadable? The original Karma was much more accessible price wise. I suppose a $3k price would probably keep the prices on the old Karmas fairly stable. Anyway, Martin, why do you assume audio recording needs a hard drive? Last time I checked, my Fantom X does a commendable job with eight stereo audio tracks and no hard drive. And essentially $250 Fusions (figuring in value of those monitors) do it as well with an 80 or 40 gig hard drive. People expect the price of technology to go down ... I expect Korg to still do a healthy trade in Triton Extremes if these unexpanded ROMplers however near the $3k mark ... (with a monotibral VA expansion? Although why 32 voices and just monotimbral ... That doesn't make sense ... I hope Korg is monitoring these frequencies ... And the softsynth/DAW people are probably scratching their heads as well why people buy hardware ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members dabowsa Posted January 19, 2007 Members Share Posted January 19, 2007 Just got my monitors last night. Mailed the rebate on 12/08/06 and they arrived on 01/18/07 - not too bad! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members keyman_sam v2.0 Posted January 19, 2007 Members Share Posted January 19, 2007 The M3 is the Oasys LE. You can be in denial for however long you want, but its the truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members keyman_sam v2.0 Posted January 19, 2007 Members Share Posted January 19, 2007 After listening to the demos, i think it can be safely said that a talented person (like, say, stephen kay) can make more or less the same type of music given the Oasys or the M3. I.e. he doesnt make BETTER music simply because he has the Oasys. Output wise, i think the Oasys and the M3 are the same. If you're into technical specs, sure, compare whatever you want, but music wise - the final output that a person can achieve using the Oasys can also be achieved through the M3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members assaf Posted January 19, 2007 Members Share Posted January 19, 2007 The Fusion may be a sound designer's dream, but it is a poor replacement for any of the big 3's workstations. I've owned a Fusion 6HD for the past year or so and it fails as a workstation. It is hard to get around. Very convoluted sequencer. The time-lag in loading sounds is an inspiration killer. The on-board acoustic sounds are very weak. There is no way you can play a Fusion and, say, a Motif side by side and not immediately recognize the Motif's superiority. Same goes for the Fantom X. Not familiar with the Triton. The screen died on me a couple of months ago and I probably will just ditch the board (I live in a country where there is no formal support for Alesis). The "Hollow Sun" soundsets are almost 100% electronic in nature, no acoustic instruments whatsoever to remedy the Fusion's weak ROM. "In theory" the Fusion is great, in practice it's horrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Diametro Posted January 20, 2007 Author Members Share Posted January 20, 2007 In your opinion ... LEISURE! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members keyman_sam v2.0 Posted January 20, 2007 Members Share Posted January 20, 2007 What do you say to the people who think it's the new Triton line then? So far, some say it's the new Triton, some say it's Oasys LE, and some say it's the new Karma? To people who think its the new triton : Mkay, lets see. Triton Classic, Triton Classic Rack, Triton-Studio, Triton-LE, Triton-Extreme. The next one would probably be named the Triton-Shiznit.They cant call it the Oasys LE, cos it has potential to steal sales from the Oasys. They cant call it the new Karma because Karma is a failure (from sales point of view).So, call it M3, they said, but under the hood, its an Oasys LE. There. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members keyman_sam v2.0 Posted January 20, 2007 Members Share Posted January 20, 2007 The Fusion may be a sound designer's dream, but it is a poor replacement for any of the big 3's workstations. I've owned a Fusion 6HD for the past year or so and it fails as a workstation. It is hard to get around. Very convoluted sequencer. The time-lag in loading sounds is an inspiration killer. The on-board acoustic sounds are very weak. Agreed. Unfortunately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members keyman_sam v2.0 Posted January 20, 2007 Members Share Posted January 20, 2007 Now back to the Naming argument : One more thing that struck me. The triton Line wouldnt make sense because by your logic : M1, Triton, M3. BUT, the triton wasnt a successor to the M1. It was a successor to the trinity. So, M3 isnt the successor of the Triton. I kinda understand why they named it M3. M1 was the best seller. Triton was a best-seller too. They desperately want M3 to be the next best seller seeing how their Oasys balanced out their best-selling titles with its not-so-best-selling title. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MartinHines Posted January 20, 2007 Members Share Posted January 20, 2007 People expect the price of technology to go down ... I expect Korg to still do a healthy trade in Triton Extremes if these unexpanded ROMplers however near the $3k mark ... (with a monotibral VA expansion? Although why 32 voices and just monotimbral ... That doesn't make sense ... Unfortunately people (musicians) don't understand the actual costs involved in creating MI hardware. I have always thought that Korg, Yamaha, and Roland were pretty equal competitors. If this is true, I would assume that if there were a way to bring MI hardware costs down (and still stay in business), they would do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lildave Posted January 20, 2007 Members Share Posted January 20, 2007 I read on the karma-lab website today that Steven Kay expects the price of the 61 key model to start off at $3000 msrp. Who knows what the street price is going to be. Check out the karma-lab forums for more info and it should answer a few more questions you all may have.http://www.karma-lab.com/http://www.karma-lab.com/forum/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MartinHines Posted January 20, 2007 Members Share Posted January 20, 2007 They desperately want M3 to be the next best seller seeing how their Oasys balanced out their best-selling titles with its not-so-best-selling title. Manufacturers give products new names if they consider them different enough from earlier products. Korg did not use the Triton name since they consider the M3 to be something new and different from the Triton series (thus the M3 name for "3rd generation workstation).I don't think Korg is "desperate" about anything (and I would say the same thing for Roland and Yamaha). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members martyhk0 Posted January 20, 2007 Members Share Posted January 20, 2007 why dont you scan in your quote so we can use it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members keyman_sam v2.0 Posted January 20, 2007 Members Share Posted January 20, 2007 Ofcourse, Korg will say whatever they want to say to not piss off clueless Oasys customers like yourself. I dont care how you put it, but do a musical piece in the Oasys, and you'll most probably be able to recreate that piece in the M3. Through wahtever means available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MartinHines Posted January 20, 2007 Members Share Posted January 20, 2007 Ofcourse, Korg will say whatever they want to say to not piss off clueless Oasys customers like yourself. I dont care how you put it, but do a musical piece in the Oasys, and you'll most probably be able to recreate that piece in the M3. Through wahtever means available. There are a lot of differences between the OASYS and the M3. Scroll down to my post in the link below: http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1508592&page=2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members keyman_sam v2.0 Posted January 20, 2007 Members Share Posted January 20, 2007 Right, but those differences are all in paper. In reality, this device has as much potential as any talented guy would want to have. Tell me if you've pushed your Oasys to the limits. You would have used a lot of its features, right, but you can do the same in the M3. From now on, it doesnt make sense to get an Oasys when the M3 has just as much potential MUSICALLY. Yeah, on paper everything looks good. My fusion kicks the llama's ass off my Fantom S, but sonically i've been able to do make the Fantom S sound much better than the Fusion. Its more usable too. It might differ from person to person, I'm sure. But what are the odds of a guy doing SO much more on the Oasys whereas feel entirely handicapped with the M3? I'm sure you understand the point I'm making, yet babbling about technical specs simply for the sake of an argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members keyman_sam v2.0 Posted January 20, 2007 Members Share Posted January 20, 2007 To summarize, for a talented guy (like Stephen Kay, or BT or JR) : Oasys = M3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MartinHines Posted January 20, 2007 Members Share Posted January 20, 2007 To summarize, for a talented guy (like Stephen Kay, or BT or JR) : Oasys = M3. I think you have that backwards -- a talented guy is exactly the type of person who can take advantage of all the features a product has to offer. It is hacks like me that could probably get by with an old Korg M/1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members keyman_sam v2.0 Posted January 20, 2007 Members Share Posted January 20, 2007 I wasn't talking about you specifically. It was a general question. I'd like to see how many have used every single feature of the Oasys. As far as the talented guy comparision goes, i see your point, BUT consider that a talented guy would figure out ways to do things that the Oasys can, using just his M3. So, instead of spending an extra 5K in the Oasys, he'd be smart if he saves up that money and buys an M3 instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members carbon111 Posted January 21, 2007 Members Share Posted January 21, 2007 The M3 has an identical KARMA implementation as the OASYS and a chunk of its rompler samples, thats about where the similarity ends...they're otherwise very different critters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bax Posted January 21, 2007 Members Share Posted January 21, 2007 As far as the talented guy comparison goes, i see your point, BUT consider that a talented guy would figure out ways to do things that the Oasys can, using just his M3. I'll agree that's true to a point, Sam...people tend to squeeze more out of their existing gear if they have no other alternatives. That is a great way to work for some, but others like to push boundaries. Not to come to anyone's defense or start flame wars back up, etc but for me personally there are a few things that the O can do that attract me to it which the M3 will almost certainly never be able to do:Legacy Collection synth emulations (on the board itself, not on an external computer) - the MS20 filter alone is worth it... without needing further discussion of the Polysix, probably the Mono/Poly in the near future, and you have to believe the Digital Collection sometime soon. I do have these for the PC, and it sounds different (and to me, better) on the O. Sure that's subjective (DACs, sample rate, etc) but there is also something to booting up the PC, controller, etc that kills the mood when ya just want to "play" and the O certainly gets from startup to a playable state faster than any of my PCs...Vector Synthesis/Wavesequencing - the next generation of the Wavestation has been in the O since Day 1...from a moving/pad/soundscape perspective this is awesome in its own right. Love it or hate it - this is a personal thing, but I happen to really get off on moving soundscapes and being able to control them, so this is a huge point for me...STR-1 synthesis - this physical modeling will not be available on the M3 and if you've heard the wild things you can do from a sound design perspective from the videos (let alone messed with one in person) you'd take pause. People keep asking for a new "Z1" or a port of "MOSS" - STR-1 and AL-1 come pretty damn close to covering that ground already aside from lacking VPM (which is "on the list") and a few more physical models. RADIAS (while cool in its own right) ain't it...No matter the amount of "pro talent" that one has, they are not gonna coax that particular stuff out of an M3. Sure someone might be able to design a sound somewhere else and sample it into the M3, but then you lose the "playability" and control factors of that sound - that turns it from synthesis into sampling which isn't the same. The M3 looks very cool for what it is, and for gigging players that need the next gen of rompling/sampling along with a respectable analog modeler added in I say go for it. I seriously thought about waiting for it for a while, but the O does so much more now (and is capable of doing so much more past that) that it finally seems worth it to me - enough so that I finally sold some stuff to get me to that goal.Thanks!bax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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