OT:Pol: and you don't have to click on it, now do you?

[droolmaster0]

 

 

That is a subjective judgement.

[mytee2.0]

It is good to see that you are continuing in your tradition of calm rationality.

 

 

your post is idiotic and offensive.

[Gus Lozada]

We're just trying to avoid a more serious political discussion which may lead Paolo or myself to move this thread into the political forum.

I appreciate the documentation to support your posts.

[droolmaster0]

We're just trying to avoid a more serious political discussion which may lead Paolo or myself to move this thread into the political forum. I appreciate the documentation to support your posts.

 

 

Can we move it to VSE?

[Gus Lozada]

your post is idiotic and offensive.

 

 

That does not help.

Specially against droolmaster0.

 

Just take it easy, guys.

[droolmaster0]

Oh, it's ok. I like it. (I should say in his defense, that it was a joke)

[Gus Lozada]

Can we move it to VSE?

Only if I ban you and you go there to cry it loud

[ElectricPuppy]

Oh, it's ok. I like it.

Evidently.

[droolmaster0]

Can we do a pretend banning?

[mytee2.0]

 

That does not help. Specially against droolmaster0. Just take it easy, guys.

 

 

alright, im done... being silly.... silly indeed. Ive been watching 6 hours of old robust estimation lectures and my brain is melting

 

and my apologies to drool for being so silly... silly indeed. But man you need to stop taking this place so offensively.

 

 

just for the record im 100% against the war, my nieces husband got {censored}ed over in the stop loss department. Basically he/they was/were 100% lied to by my government and he wont be there to witness the birth of his daughter who is due anytime now. When he comes back she will already be over a year old.

 

I hate Bush, I think this war was motivated by revenge because sadam tried to kill his Dad. So no im not for the "killing of innocent people" and that isnt my agenda.

 

I would have thought that my initial post would have had the rub of "go out and do something" instead "im for the killing of innocent people" but I was wrong. Now I know that if you arent for these types of threads, you're a baby killer...

[droolmaster0]

Well, ok - but you can't presume that because someone comes around here, and posts an ot message about what's going on, that he isn't an activist...and it's really irrelevant. It's not your business whether any particular person votes, gives money to so and so, marches in protests, or eats babies, for that matter. This is a discussion forum, and your post sure sounded like it was ridiculing his politics. I can see your drift now, but I just don't see the point. We all waste way too much time here. It's analogous to saying, 'why don't you make music rather than posting here'...well, because I'm here....

[mytee2.0]

10 4, thats a roger sweet charlie

 

wheres piggy? I demand a republican to make this uber liberal discussion more centralist.

 

far right and far left persons make baby jesus stop masterbating

 

*edit*

 

oh! and just to make this discussion more intereting, Im against pulling out right now. Yes Im against the war, but leaving right now would be a mistake imho.

 

we're in it, we need to stay until the Iraqies can handle themselves, otherwise Iran might swoop right in and we'll all be in even worse trouble then we are in now.

 

Are things going well? No, Could things be handled better? YES!!!

we're in it, we're there.... we cant leave a cluster{censored} behind.

 

I could be wrong, I dont know

[ElectricPuppy]

oh! and just to make this discussion more intereting, Im against pulling out right now. Yes Im against the war, but leaving right now would be a mistake imho.

 

 

My thoughts exactly. Now that we're there, we're stuck, and probably for a lot longer still. Thanks ever so much, Mister President.

[droolmaster0]

Shouldn't we do what the Iraqi people themselves want? Why exactly should it be our decision to make in the first place? They overwhelmingly want us to leave, and they believe that the violence will subside when we do.

[mytee2.0]

I dont know what to believe anymore, Im skeptical of every poll and article pertaining to the war.

 

for every poll that says they want us to leave, theres one that says they dont.

[droolmaster0]

uh - I don't think that's true....but in any case - it should be up to them. Totally. And you kind of know by the fact that the polls that show that they want us out are not reported by the press that they are true....I think that except for the Kurds they consistently show that they want us to leave. And no wonder...and a very large number approve of attacks on U.S. forces. Which is rational. If we were occupied, people would be in favor of it here.

 

Putting it another way - I think that if Bush/Cheney/Rice thought that the Iraqis really wanted us to stay, they'd put it to a vote...the fact that it's just assumed that it's totally up to us implies that it's known that we'd be booted out.

 

And, you know, that famous film of the Iraqis celebrating by toppling the statue of Saddam - it was staged. But you still see it from time to time as if it were real news...

[mytee2.0]

And, you know, that famous film of the Iraqis celebrating by toppling the statue of Saddam - it was staged. But you still see it from time to time as if it were real news...

 

 

I havent seen it since right after 911

 

and where did you hear it was staged?

[droolmaster0]

I havent seen it since right after 911 and where did you hear it was staged?

 

 

Many sources, and I believe that it was eventually even admitted by the military. Do a simple google search and you'll get info on it.

[The Severalist]

I find it very interesting there was such a huge U.S. outrage over the YouTube video of a U.S. soldier throwing a dog off a cliff (which was bad) compared to almost no U.S. outrage over at least 20,000 Iraqi deaths.

 

 

It is interesting if you don't moralize it. Why is it people respond with more revulsion at the murder of a random dog then a graph that reads 20,000 dead foriegners?

 

Maybe 20,000 dead Iraqis is something that just naturally translates into simple political leverage for the anti war movement, or into "Not so bad considering the potential future positives", or "at least it's not Hiroshima" or "Yeah? Well you should have seen what your hero president X did Y years ago!" for the "there's a future and a past but not a present" time travel loving pro war crowd. Or maybe it's the impressively effective grey magic of the numbers game which can make any overwhelming horror as cut and dry and bloodless and palletable as simple mathematics, operating in all it's glory. Or maybe it's the result of the effect of lawn furniture on the part of the brain that handles empathy and morality. Maybe it's the result of mercury poisoning from nation wide overconsumption of tuna. Or maybe it's just a body count so shocking that it's a natural defense to feel next to nothing or is simply incomprehensible for most modern people (it seem's incomprehensible to me personally), or it's simply something that we've been well conditioned to accept as the cost of war (though there was never a mention of sadistic flying lessons for stray dogs), which we've in turn been well conditioned to accept as necessity of our society. Or maybe getting upset about such things is an endangered wooly mammoth of a reaction to have.

 

For a large portion, I figure it's something that many can't grasp outside of the prism of their own respective ideology or idealogical war, which distracts quite wonderfully from the stark reality of the 20,000, while a dog being thrown off a cliff is just a dog being thrown off a cliff. The image of an American soilder, one of our proud and noble freedom fighters, cruelly throwing a dog off a cliff is an image that perfectly and bluntly contradicts the largely agreed upon and deep seeded lie of military benevolence and war time glory, fittingly trafficed in black and white, starring John Wayne, etc. etc. For some, it's like finding out Santa Claus exists but he's a serial killer who rarely gives out presents. All captured in that one strange and strangely sad image.

 

If you want to wag your finger at society in general for responding in such a way though then "check please."

[The Severalist]

Many sources, and I believe that it was eventually even admitted by the military. Do a simple google search and you'll get info on it.

 

 

Yup on all counts. It's showbiz man.

[The Severalist]

10 4, thats a roger sweet charlie wheres piggy? I demand a republican to make this uber liberal discussion more centralist.

 

 

Viva La Center!

 

Hey, this discussion is full of people who hate cancer, let's get some pro cancer people in here to raise the level of discourse! And we shall heroically make our way to the creamy nuget center.

 

Admittedly that was kind of unfair and medium high on the hyperbollic bullshyt meter, but I just couldn't help it.

 

P.S. I like pighood, in fact I'm in like with him, but personally I'd much rather have a more thoughtful conservative mind involved.

[syncretism]

This American Life ran an episode in 2005 about the Lancet's first study. In 2006, they revisited the new numbers. Like most TAL programs, it's a fascinating listen, whatever your politics.

 

http://www.thislife.org/Radio_Episode.aspx?sched=1157

[mytee2.0]

Hey, this discussion is full of people who hate cancer, let's get some pro cancer people in here to raise the level of discourse! And we shall heroically make our way to the creamy nuget center. Admittedly that was kind of unfair and medium high on the hyperbollic bullshyt meter, but I just couldn't help it.

uh, ok

this is up there with the most asinine reply in HC history.

[The Severalist]

uh, ok this is up there with the most asinine reply in HC history.

I wouldn't know, I failed history. I'm guessing there's no gift certificate involved for this specific accomplishment?

Seemed to make sense at the time. In any event, I'm sorry your confused, but overjoyed that through it all you've retained your capacity for semi articulate sarcasm.

Okay, here's what I was trying to say in own confusion inducing way. I think hearing both sides of an argument in certain discusions is very much overestimated (and incidentally a technique usually coveted by inbreds and mongoloids, but you didn't hear that from me, in fact I don't agree with it at all) to the point of absurdity, and can actually drag a discussion down, when it comes to many a thing, especially when one of the sides is... well, for example, take evolution...please! By the way, I just flew in from indignation and boy is my passive aggresiveness tired! But I disgress, whatever that means (I failed english too.) One mans opinion. I'd nueter my postion further but I think I've reached the legal limit.

Anyways, I thought it applied. If it didn't, feel free to invade a third world country, kill it's leaders and convert it's people to christianity, which, if I'm reading between the lines of your post correctly, and I'm sure I undoubtedly am, is what your really after.

In any event, like the stand up guy I am, I forgive you. That's right! It can happen to anyone. Feel free to brag to your friends, I would. In fact I will. In fact I'm doing it right now.

Really, for real, on the level, with sincerity levels medium high, I'm not tryin ta give ya hassles, I don't want to be a thorn in anybodies proverbial paw. But, uh, what? Yeah.

What were we talking about? Oh, right. Sorry but I'm in a commited relationship right now. Goodbye my love, I'll always remember the good times.

P.S. I edited this down from a twenty thousand word rebuttal I wrote in a sobriety induced fever. If anybodies interested in reading the whole thing, it can be found in it's entirety at fictiouswebsite.com/non-existant.

[jjdugan3]

Severalist,your replies remind me of a bit by Patton Oswalt called Dr. Pepper.
That is all.