Members SonicVI Posted October 1, 2010 Members Share Posted October 1, 2010 I was joking around with Malekko one time about creating a circuit that was held together my resin, Devi's resin? how about a built in explosive device and if you clip the wrong wire... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members the_bleeding Posted October 1, 2010 Members Share Posted October 1, 2010 psh i build all my pedals now. Its cheaper (i built a $300 6 knob tremolo for 90$, building an $2-500 analogue delay for $60, a fuzz face ish thing for 50$ which ranges from 100-400 depending on builder) Its fun I learn something I can customize it to do what i want theres no remorse when i hack it up to do something different - because its MINE in its entirety. I do not sell pedals, but i will build them for a friend if they dont know how to solder, because its fun. Buying a pedal serves different purposes. You're paying for somebody's skill, build quality, promise of warranty and maintenance, and sometimes aesthetics. If you don't want/need those services, then why pay for them? This is why i like Devi's business model. She'll build you stuff, but also makes her designs available if you want to do it yourself. You pay for the service Theres 2 ways you can solve problems, you can use with what you have (solderin skillz), or throw money at your problems to make them go away. I prefer the former. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ryan. Posted October 1, 2010 Author Members Share Posted October 1, 2010 I'm an insurance agent. My life is all about throwing money at problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members the_bleeding Posted October 1, 2010 Members Share Posted October 1, 2010 I'm an insurance agent. My life is all about throwing money at problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members FXR Posted October 1, 2010 Members Share Posted October 1, 2010 This is kinda ironic. Musicians feel like it's ok to clone and profit from a pedal. But clone one of their songs and the tune likely changes. A general statement folks, only the guilty need to disagree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members chakosh Posted October 1, 2010 Members Share Posted October 1, 2010 1) When you buy a clone there's no guarantee that it's legit. 2) When you build a clone yourself, you need to spend time researching the components, which means dissecting the original or looking for prints online and then looking for all the components online. Unless you like doing this I don't think this is a worthwhile endeavor for most people / pedals. Unless you are talking about a Klon or other really expensive pedal. I think there's a place for clones, like pedals that are not made anymore (original guv'nor, etc...). Other then that it's not really worth it unless you enjoy building that kinda of stuff. ... or something with a ridiculously long wait list and subsequent ridiculously high re-sale price. Like the Analog Man King of Tone. The thing sounds amazing, but the wait list is over 1 year, and the pedal goes for a ridiculous amount in the "used" market - I saw one for $365 or something like that on TGP. I'm all for buying one, but I don't know that I have the patience to wait more than a year for one. Maybe I'm just NOWNOWNOWNOWNOW!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ronsonic B Posted October 4, 2010 Members Share Posted October 4, 2010 So there is no pedal out there that one of you builders couldn't make on your own for way cheaper?And I don't mean to sell it, just to have your own. Depends on how you value your time. There are pedals I'll just buy. Some I build because they either aren't available or are stupidly overpriced. Two I wanted from when I was a kid the Ampeg Scrambler and the Colorsound OverDrive just weren't around to be had when I wanted one. Now I'm working on a Roland Jet Phaser clone. They don't have those in stores. But stuff you can get off the shelf, hell, I'd have to pay myself as much as I'm giving the store for many pedals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members devi Posted October 4, 2010 Members Share Posted October 4, 2010 You pay for the service Exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members IamBurnout Posted October 4, 2010 Members Share Posted October 4, 2010 It came up in another thread, but I want a boost pedal in a custom box with this graphic: You want a Debian boost?Better make sure requisite files are there before installing the package. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members hwaorang Posted October 4, 2010 Members Share Posted October 4, 2010 Builders should just put scorpions in the boxes. Scorpions are natures answer to cloners. Also, I never really got the point of buying an expensive clone when the original is pretty cheap, like tubescreamers and muffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Brian Marshall Posted October 4, 2010 Members Share Posted October 4, 2010 1build pedals in larger than necessary boxes. 2pour in concrete.3profit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members boytbpc Posted October 4, 2010 Members Share Posted October 4, 2010 IMO, clones are limited to pedals that are extremely popular (Fuzz Face, Tube Screamer, etc) are discontinued (too many to name) are hard to acquire (King of Tone, Klon, anything with a long wait list) are are unneccisarily expensive (Klon). Most pedals are priced about right for the market so it isn't worth cloning or don't have a large enough market share to make it worth the cloners time. I have no ethical problems with cloning because the community showed it's true colors by the rampant Tube Screamer/Fuzz Face market, and only complain when it affects them. That said, I rarely purchase clones of pedals still in production unless the clone is far superior, as the case of Retro-Sonic clones of MXR and Boss effects and Analogman and Fulltone's Fuzz Faces. There is one builder that I will never purchase from and happily by clones of his stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members devi Posted October 4, 2010 Members Share Posted October 4, 2010 are unneccisarily expensive (Klon)You know, I really think the Klon is priced appropriately. The guy obviously wants to keep his business small, but make a living, so I understand him keeping the prices where it's at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members boytbpc Posted October 4, 2010 Members Share Posted October 4, 2010 You know, I really think the Klon is priced appropriately. The guy obviously wants to keep his business small, but make a living, so I understand him keeping the prices where it's at. I meant on the used market for the Klon. It fell in both categories, a long wait time to get it at the reasonable price, or buy it now at over $600. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members devi Posted October 4, 2010 Members Share Posted October 4, 2010 I meant on the used market for the Klon. It fell in both categories, a long wait time to get it at the reasonable price, or buy it now at over $600.True 'nuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Johansolo Posted October 4, 2010 Members Share Posted October 4, 2010 im a hobbyist builder/cloner/experimenter/modder. whatever clones i build are just part of the building itch. and if i do sell them...i list them on ebay with a 99c starting bid. the only time i do build clones is when people request/ask for something that is challenging... but even then i won't build it for them if i can recommend an alternative pedal that can be purchased. I really only do it for sh#ts and giggles (ie artwork and recording soundclips) and if i did come up with something truly original...i would post the schematic/layout etc on diy stomp/free stomp box as a contribution. i still buy and go trhough a heap of pedals...just cause i can and love it. i love opening them up and seeing what constructions methods are used and what not... and if i do clone them its to see how close i can get and learn from my failures. face it even with a correct schematic...theres so many variables that can make a clone sound diffrent to the real thing. heck even the real thing sometimes differs from pedal to pedal... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DeludedDude Posted October 4, 2010 Members Share Posted October 4, 2010 Really interesting thread I don't have the skills to clone pedals, but pedal building is something I would really love to learn someday as a hobby, so I find discussions like this really interesting. Thanks for sharing your experience everyone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members boytbpc Posted October 4, 2010 Members Share Posted October 4, 2010 heck even the real thing sometimes differs from pedal to pedal... I agree completely with this. Anybody that has sat down with a stack of Deluxe Memory Mans or Fuzz Faces can attest to this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members delay dude Posted October 4, 2010 Members Share Posted October 4, 2010 btw: Is here anyone who would build a Klon for me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members THAT4301 Posted October 4, 2010 Members Share Posted October 4, 2010 The law is clear; you're paying for the effort of assembly, the PCB design, etc... Not for the circuit itself. Someone having the 'genius idea' of (gasp) changing some tonestack values and using some funny diodes does not make them a genius, and you should not feel bad about cloning that when the rest of the circuit is a stock-as-balls TS9.1) When you buy a clone there's no guarantee that it's legit.True enough. On the other hand, they could even make improvements.2) When you build a clone yourself, you need to spend time researching the components, which means dissecting the original or looking for prints online and then looking for all the components online. Unless you like doing this I don't think this is a worthwhile endeavor for most people / pedals. Unless you are talking about a Klon or other really expensive pedal.An hour on rapid and Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members IvIark Posted October 4, 2010 Members Share Posted October 4, 2010 If something should be an expose, let it be so afterward. But I saw some high-count poster just absolutely {censored}ting all over the Dirty Bomb, trying to put a boot up Dave Barber's ass about not using part of the dual op-amp, etc., and essentially accusing him of incompetence in his design. Barber, who is a great designer, Barber who puts out extremely high quality products at an extremely affordable price point. Making pedals by hand with extraordinary attention to detail in their construction, high quality parts, everything about them suitably "boutique" and yet they are price competitive with mass produced stuff from BOSS, Ibanez, etc.That {censored} is utterly unnecessary, just hateful! Even other members seemed to find it a little over the top, though, so at least that's something. The whole place could do with a little less acid. But then I think you and I have talked about this very problem in the past. I don't know, do you still feel they go a bit far in the underlying thrust of the site, making a mission out of "exposing" and attacking rather than first seeking information and then interpreting it? Like every other forum, and HC is certainly no exception, there are plenty of more dickish members. But then you don't have to agree with everyones opinion to enjoy other things about a forum. I spend a lot of time there because I'm interested in electronics and the technical side of the circuits really interest me, and then the vast majority of the time I do my own layouts based on information gathered from there anyway. Some people there are seemingly negative about any effect that isn't mass produced in China, but that's up to them, you don't have to agree or even acknowledge them in order to gain something personally from the rest of the site. Any HC member who still comes here despite SAL, serve to illustrate tolerance of half-wits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RUExp? Posted October 4, 2010 Members Share Posted October 4, 2010 Also, I'd like to make the point that I don't believe there has been any evidence of a cloned pedal sold by another company ever ruining the livelihood of the company of which cloned pedals was... cloned.This is a name brand biz. I've said it once and I'll say it again. It's just like shoes. Sure there are a half dozen converse all star rip offs, but coverse all stars still sell like crazy.If anything, the prevalent cloning of a particular pedal only adds value to the original pedal cloned, because people will always have in the back of their mind that nagging thought that they should give the original a try someday if they can.... and if it's affordable, I guarantee you they do.Muff clones abound, but people eventually buy a real Big Muff. Same with Fuzz Faces and Tube Screamers. Of course I'm not speaking for everyone, but in general, it is the nature of the biz. I agree. The real deal will almost always be more desirable than a copy. I think most people buy clones because the original is either costs more than they are willing to spend or it's just not readily available to buy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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