Members Craggin Posted July 29, 2006 Members Share Posted July 29, 2006 Originally posted by guitar shmoe would you rather we wait until we cannot defeat these terrorists?It isn't a matter that we can avoid...kill or be killed. THEY have set the ground rules: KILL ALL AMERICANS....Militia experts on fighting terrorists agree: we cannot let up for one second...every minute we relent they use to re-load, organize and kill.Our directive is clear: KILL THEM BEFORE THEY KILL US.We cannot afford to feel sorry for them, they have no conscience and no remorse.I don't like these parameters but, I accept them and am willing to participate to destroy terrorists...all of them. The time to 'reason' with them is over, they are irrational and unreasonable, they want us DEAD! Very simple: Us or them...I prefer: THEM! (dead that is...) ...spoken like a true Crusader/Christian...bravo, well done. Send me a postcard from your next pilgrimage. Originally posted by guitar shmoe Actually, I've humbled myself and knelt before the cross of Jesus in complete submission. So which Testament of the Bible is your favorite? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Craggin Posted July 29, 2006 Members Share Posted July 29, 2006 Originally posted by guitar shmoe News Flash....most of the world hates us! They are envious of our power/control....no matter what we do, most of the world will hate us....even if we go out to other countries and liberate the civilians from tyranical murderous dictators, even then the world will hate us..even if we provide billions of US dollars in aid, food, medicine and supplies to poor countries...even then, the world will hate us..even if we...oh, what's the use....not only does the world hate us, the social cancer of our society (liberal complainers) they, too hate us. Funny, your rhetoric sounds pretty full of hate... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitar shmoe Posted July 29, 2006 Members Share Posted July 29, 2006 Originally posted by Craggin Funny, your rhetoric sounds pretty full of hate... I have come to the absolute conclustion that you, sir, are a blind man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitar shmoe Posted July 29, 2006 Members Share Posted July 29, 2006 Originally posted by Craggin ...spoken like a true Crusader/Christian...bravo, well done. Send me a postcard from your next pilgrimage. So which Testament of the Bible is your favorite? Your understanding of Christianity is not accurate....(same as draelyc's lack of understanding here...though, he professes to be a Christian, then demonstrates the opposite...(orthopraxy has betrayed him...)) I am a complete pacifist.... until..... Someone (or group of 'someones') swears to murder me and my family including my friends and patriots, then demonstrates it imperically... then... I DEFEND myself from such AGGRESSORS. You guys are a waste of my time and America's time.... Keep complaining/crying about things...I'm sure that will make them change for the better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DirtyBird Posted July 29, 2006 Members Share Posted July 29, 2006 I dont understand why simply protecting our own god damn borders and airports with all these people off in Iraq right now won't protect us from terrorists.I just don't see how Iraq is helping anything as far as terrorism goes. All it's doing is making things worse. You cannot win in these situations... Unfortunately, if we withdraw everyone and go home now it WILL be a sign of a weakness an we're far too deep into this {censored} we're in to get out of it.But what I hate is how NO ONE will hold these people in control accountable.I bet hte only criticism George has ever heard (Who has admitted he doesn't read the newspaper or watch the news ) to his face is Stephen Colbert's satirical rant at the white house dinner! My god that man has some cajones! I just feel like he's not even necessarily dumb, just kind of naive and ill-informed. I'm not even sure Dubya's the one running the show. He doesn't talk like a man who knows why he's doing things... he's talk like someone who's gotten convinced that something is a good or bad idea. I dont know i just get strange vibes from him.There are no magic solutions, there may not be any solutions, PERIOD. But I dont understand why we can't all come to some sort of compromise or agreement to disagree without labelling each other bleeding heart liberals and war hawk neocon rednecks. It just doesn't do anything but divide us and shelter us from dissenting opinions.Like John Stewart said on Crossfire, these partisan debate shows are hurting America. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitar shmoe Posted July 29, 2006 Members Share Posted July 29, 2006 Originally posted by DirtyBird I dont understand why simply protecting our own god damn borders and airports with all these people off in Iraq right now won't protect us from terrorists. I just don't see how Iraq is helping anything as far as terrorism goes. All it's doing is making things worse. You cannot win in these situations... Unfortunately, if we withdraw everyone and go home now it WILL be a sign of a weakness an we're far too deep into this {censored} we're in to get out of it. But what I hate is how NO ONE will hold these people in control accountable. I bet hte only criticism George has ever heard (Who has admitted he doesn't read the newspaper or watch the news ) to his face is Stephen Colbert's satirical rant at the white house dinner! My god that man has some cajones! I just feel like he's not even necessarily dumb, just kind of naive and ill-informed. I'm not even sure Dubya's the one running the show. He doesn't talk like a man who knows why he's doing things... he's talk like someone who's gotten convinced that something is a good or bad idea. I dont know i just get strange vibes from him. There are no magic solutions, there may not be any solutions, PERIOD. But I dont understand why we can't all come to some sort of compromise or agreement to disagree without labelling each other bleeding heart liberals and war hawk neocon rednecks. It just doesn't do anything but divide us and shelter us from dissenting opinions. Like John Stewart said on Crossfire, these partisan debate shows are hurting America. I think George Bush trusts the military personell he has in place to run the war(s)...he may intervene on "executive" decisions...you must trust your experts to make the decisions (Hitler used to usurp his military experts to the demise of Nazi Germany...)..Geoge Bush is accountable to the American people, his limited executive powers and his appointed personnel and advisors...George Bush IS NOT accountabe in the public court of fickle left-wing ill-informed opinion...nor is he accountable to those that disagree with his philosophy on how to conduct war (within Constitutional boundaries...)....it is the LIBERALS my dear boy, that are causing all the DIVISION Who is holding them (liberals) accountable to the social division and damage they are doing???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Craggin Posted July 29, 2006 Members Share Posted July 29, 2006 Originally posted by guitar shmoe I have come to the absolute conclustion that you, sir, are a blind man. ...glass houses..etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Craggin Posted July 29, 2006 Members Share Posted July 29, 2006 Originally posted by guitar shmoe Your understanding of Christianity is not accurate....(same as draelyc's lack of understanding here...though, he professes to be a Christian, then demonstrates the opposite...(orthopraxy has betrayed him...))I am a complete pacifist....until.....Someone (or group of 'someones') swears to murder me and my family including my friends and patriots, then demonstrates it imperically...then...I DEFEND myself from such AGGRESSORS.You guys are a waste of my time and America's time....Keep complaining/crying about things...I'm sure that will make them change for the better I'll ask this again...what exactly have you done to defend yourself from "AGGRESSORS"? You're an armchair quarterback at best. And you say my understanding of Christianity isn't accurate??? And that I'm a blind man?? "Complete Pacifist until..." Do you realize you can only be a "complete pacifist" if you drop the conditional "until". You're a walking, talking, typing oxymoron. Circular, hypocritical logic at it's best. Oh, and before you lecture me on wasting America's time...I've earned my time...and served this country...go away before you say something even more ignorant. Do you ever think before you type/speak? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Corso2 Posted July 29, 2006 Members Share Posted July 29, 2006 A hopeful sign in the Evangelical community. Some are finally getting it: http://www.nytimes.com/2006/07/30/us/30pastor.html?hp&ex=1154232000&en=fc81bfdd0ee7feb1&ei=5094&partner=homepage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Craggin Posted July 29, 2006 Members Share Posted July 29, 2006 Originally posted by guitar shmoe it is the LIBERALS my dear boy, that are causing all the DIVISION ...and of course, close minded, ultra-right wing, hate mongering folks such as yourself play NOOOOOO part in any of that "DIVISION" you speak of...right? I'd say the ultra-left bears as much of the burden as the ultra-right...but hey, that's just me.Ya'll be cool now...I've got to get to my gig. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitar shmoe Posted July 29, 2006 Members Share Posted July 29, 2006 Originally posted by Craggin I'll ask this again...what exactly have you done to defend yourself from "AGGRESSORS"? You're an armchair quarterback at best. And you say my understanding of Christianity isn't accurate??? And that I'm a blind man?? "Complete Pacifist until..." Do you realize you can only be a "complete pacifist" if you drop the conditional "until". You're a walking, talking, typing oxymoron. Circular, hypocritical logic at it's best. Oh, and before you lecture me on wasting America's time...I've earned my time...and served this country...go away before you say something even more ignorant. Do you ever think before you type/speak? .....Jim! quick wake up! craggin's attacking you! ..."Oh, craggin's attacking me again?" :bor: "wake me up when something intelligent or important is being posted.... :bor: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitar shmoe Posted July 29, 2006 Members Share Posted July 29, 2006 Originally posted by Craggin ...and of course, close minded, ultra-right wing, hate mongering folks such as yourself play NOOOOOO part in any of that "DIVISION" you speak of...right? I'd say the ultra-left bears as much of the burden as the ultra-right...but hey, that's just me. Ya'll be cool now...I've got to get to my gig. how often do you turn on the TV set and see a bunch of 'whacked-out' conservatives complaining about things and protesting the war?that's what I thought...LIBERALS are a blight on humanity, a social disease and a shameful disgrace to this country....I see you wear the 'liberal badge' proud! have a nice gig! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitar shmoe Posted July 29, 2006 Members Share Posted July 29, 2006 Originally posted by Corso2 A hopeful sign in the Evangelical community. Some are finally getting it: http://www.nytimes.com/2006/07/30/us/30pastor.html?hp&ex=1154232000&en=fc81bfdd0ee7feb1&ei=5094&partner=homepage I agree with this statement of his: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Craggin Posted July 31, 2006 Members Share Posted July 31, 2006 Originally posted by guitar shmoe .....Jim! quick wake up! craggin's attacking you! ..."Oh, craggin's attacking me again?" :bor: "wake me up when something intelligent or important is being posted.... :bor: Why...it would go unnoticed by you anyway...just look at how this thread has gone. (But then again, I've seen your behavior before on the Splawn forum...that didn't end so well for you, either.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Craggin Posted July 31, 2006 Members Share Posted July 31, 2006 Originally posted by guitar shmoe how often do you turn on the TV set and see a bunch of 'whacked-out' conservatives complaining about things and protesting the war? that's what I thought... LIBERALS are a blight on humanity, a social disease and a shameful disgrace to this country....I see you wear the 'liberal badge' proud! have a nice gig! Ignorance is the true blight to this country...and your badge gleams bright. That's your problem...I'm a moderate in every sense of the word (had you been paying attention, you would've caught that)...you can't see that because:A) I call out your blind allegiance to whatever is being spoon fed to you.andB) You're mind is so closed and full of hate, your blind to reason. I have no problems calling out BS I see coming from the ultra-left, too.Proof..."how often do you turn on the TV set and see a bunch of 'whacked-out' conservatives complaining about things and protesting the war?"You need to pay closer attention to the tube...more and more AMERICANS (both conservative and liberal) are exercising their right to free speech and protesting the war. My biggest problem with you (other than your closed mindedness) is your reductive reasoning. An aesthetic based on fear and hate is really pretty ugly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kush06 Posted July 31, 2006 Members Share Posted July 31, 2006 Originally posted by guitar shmoe 2 worst American Presidents: Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton. regarding Clinton, I suppose if you're going to judge him on building the healthiest economy our country has seen in decades, eliminating all budget debt, reducing crime more than previous or subsequent presidents, building the world class military that is now fighting your war in Iraq, leading a war to remove an evil dictator without losing a single soldier's life while bolstering our image in the world, adding more jobs than any president in recent history, then yeah, I guess he was one of the worst presidents. I suppose if your standard of presidential greatness is giving tax cuts to the wealthy while lying to the middle and lower classes that it actually helps them, squandering the largest budget surplus in history to the extent that every previous president *combined* didn't even do that much damage, rolling back environmental regulations to pre 1980's levels, cutting education, arts and human services funding, legislating with a blind eye to science, then yeah, this guy is great. Did you know that there have been no net new jobs created under the Bush family? None. Not one. Yet somehow I suspect you blame the democrats for that, lol.Seriously, how could you possibly claim that, unless you have a complete ignorance of reality? Oh wait, I answered my own question! I'd like to see how you'd support your claim.Actually, I already know the only criteria you use to judge your leadership: whether or not they're a fundamentalist Christian. You can base your ideas on 2000 year old, stricly interpreted mythology all you want. Just realize, I'm a member of the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitar shmoe Posted July 31, 2006 Members Share Posted July 31, 2006 Originally posted by kush06 regarding Clinton, I suppose if you're going to judge him on building the healthiest economy our country has seen in decades, eliminating all budget debt, reducing crime more than previous or subsequent presidents, building the world class military that is now fighting your war in Iraq, leading a war to remove an evil dictator without losing a single soldier's life while bolstering our image in the world, adding more jobs than any president in recent history, then yeah, I guess he was one of the worst presidents. I suppose if your standard of presidential greatness is giving tax cuts to the wealthy while lying to the middle and lower classes that it actually helps them, squandering the largest budget surplus in history to the extent that every previous president *combined* didn't even do that much damage, rolling back environmental regulations to pre 1980's levels, cutting education, arts and human services funding, legislating with a blind eye to science, then yeah, this guy is great. Did you know that there have been no net new jobs created under the Bush family? None. Not one. Yet somehow I suspect you blame the democrats for that, lol. Seriously, how could you possibly claim that, unless you have a complete ignorance of reality? Oh wait, I answered my own question! I'd like to see how you'd support your claim. Actually, I already know the only criteria you use to judge your leadership: whether or not they're a fundamentalist Christian. You can base your ideas on 2000 year old, stricly interpreted mythology all you want. Just realize, I'm a member of the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. where did you get those numbers?Do you think that what you pointed out is criteria for judging that a President is successful or not?I'm for any President (Republican or Democrat) that allows me to keep more of my own money and make more of my own decisions...and doesn't grow government by raising taxes to pay for liberal entitlement programs that I am not in favor of...and that doesn't appoint liberal activist judges that 're-interpret' the Constitution to advance left-wing ideology, making it illegal for me to disagree with it...Someone that keeps our borders, keeps us safe and doesn't 'PUSS OUT' when terrorists fly hi-jacked planes into our commercial buildings and threaten to kill all our citizens...Is that asking too much? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Craggin Posted July 31, 2006 Members Share Posted July 31, 2006 Originally posted by guitar shmoe I'm for any President (Republican or Democrat) that allows me to keep more of my own money and make more of my own decisions...and doesn't grow government...Is that asking too much? I would agree with you there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitar shmoe Posted July 31, 2006 Members Share Posted July 31, 2006 Originally posted by Craggin Why...it would go unnoticed by you anyway...just look at how this thread has gone. (But then again, I've seen your behavior before on the Splawn forum...that didn't end so well for you, either.) crag, you're probably a pretty cool guy...but, you think way too highly of yourself... I apologized on Splawn site because Scott personally emailed me and asked me too...which I was happy to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Craggin Posted July 31, 2006 Members Share Posted July 31, 2006 Originally posted by guitar shmoe ...and that doesn't appoint liberal activist judges that 're-interpret' the Constitution to advance left-wing ideology, making it illegal for me to disagree with it...Someone that keeps our borders, keeps us safe and doesn't 'PUSS OUT' when terrorists fly hi-jacked planes into our commercial buildings and threaten to kill all our citizens...Is that asking too much? ...i could actually agree with you here, too. Just let me know when your "scenario" actually happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Craggin Posted July 31, 2006 Members Share Posted July 31, 2006 Originally posted by guitar shmoe crag, you're probably a pretty cool guy...but, you think way too highly of yourself...I apologized on Splawn site because Scott personally emailed me and asked me too...which I was happy to do. Wrong again...just making an observation based on this thread. Truthfully, if you and I were having this discussion face to face in a bar...I'd have no problem buying you a beer (if you were so inclined). From my perspective in this thread, you accuse anyone with a different viewpoint from yours as a "LIBERAL", pushing some type of subversive agenda upon the masses. It appears highly hypocritical...that's my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitar shmoe Posted July 31, 2006 Members Share Posted July 31, 2006 Originally posted by kush06 Actually, I already know the only criteria you use to judge your leadership: whether or not they're a fundamentalist Christian. You can base your ideas on 2000 year old, stricly interpreted mythology all you want. Just realize, I'm a member of the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. I'm really not in favor of Christians in politics...they just get beat down as 'trying to legislate morality'...and such...I never 'force' my life style on anyone...if someone doesn't want to believe in God and trust in Jesus Christ for 'salvation' that's fine! I won't force ya...I won't try and get a political position to FORCE you... on the other hand, I don't like it when liberals try to get political power in order to FORCE their anti-Christian life style down my throat as 'civil rights' legislation...to me this kind of 'liberal' is the 'anti-Christian' religion.... if I can't force you to be Christian....then, you shouldn't be able to force me to be anti-Christian... seems fair to me! that's all I'm askin' when it comes to Religion and politics... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitar shmoe Posted July 31, 2006 Members Share Posted July 31, 2006 Originally posted by Craggin Wrong again...just making an observation based on this thread. Truthfully, if you and I were having this discussion face to face in a bar...I'd have no problem buying you a beer (if you were so inclined). From my perspective in this thread, you accuse anyone with a different viewpoint from yours as a "LIBERAL", pushing some type of subversive agenda upon the masses. It appears highly hypocritical...that's my opinion. You think too highly of yourself because you stand in judgment (without all the evidence...) of LEADERS that are actually pretty smart. Standing on the sidelines and criticizing the players is not helping the matter at all. I understand you disagree with the direction of Bush's administration...but, to beat them down as a pack of retarts is simply arrogant and un-founded on your part.... years ago, I disagreed with the Clinton Administration on a ton of stuff...I didn't like it, but I never thought I was smarter or even could do better in the context at hand...we don't know until confronted with the challenge. that's why I posted my personal experience as a leader and Business owner....I have firsthand experience getting judged by people that have limited understanding and only a small fraction of the information. It is the hobgoblin of losers, complain without enough criteria/information...then condemn and execute sentence...and all without providing resolve or solutions...pretty cowardly. That's why some people are leaders and others are followers and sadly a growing 3rd group are complainer/critics without helpful reasoned and experienced solutions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Craggin Posted July 31, 2006 Members Share Posted July 31, 2006 Originally posted by guitar shmoe You think too highly of yourself because you stand in judgment (without all the evidence...) of LEADERS that are actually pretty smart. Standing on the sidelines and criticizing the players is not helping the matter at all. How do you know I'm not doing something about it? What makes you think these LEADERS are any smarter than anyone else? How do you measure that? Originally posted by guitar shmoe I understand you disagree with the direction of Bush's administration...but, to beat them down as a pack of retarts is simply arrogant and un-founded on your part.... According to whom? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitar shmoe Posted July 31, 2006 Members Share Posted July 31, 2006 Originally posted by Craggin How do you know I'm not doing something about it? What makes you think these LEADERS are any smarter than anyone else? How do you measure that?According to whom? they have access to an unprecedented amount of top secret intel/information that we don't. we simply aren't able to judge at this point (New York Times national security sensitive info not withstanding...)... knowing what I know about military intel I laugh at those that 'suppose' they can accurately judge...because they watch CNN or MSN or FoxNews or whatever?....simply laughable.... Our Leaders are ....our Leaders! they deserve our support even if we don't agree with their decisions (as long as they're legal..) Bill Clinton was our president and deserved the honor due his office (even though I didn't agree with his politics...)... you dishonor our nation and our President when you cheapen him as you have...as if you could do better....complaining doesn't help anything. Next election maybe your guy (or gal?) will get voted in and your ideology will be advanced? then I will be challenged to 'not' criticize or complain to the point of distracting our leader. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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