Bad Poetry Workshop

[Poor Yorick]

I've been scanning a bit of the lyrics put up for review, and I've noticed some "bad poetry" tendencies. These aren't mistakes per se, but the sort of vague-ish uses that all writers fall into when starting out or even cranking out a first draft.

 

First of all, poetry (and by extention lyrics) is stylized speech. It's conversation boiled down to its essentials and they equipped with meter and rhyme for maximum effectiveness. There should be no fat in poetry -- and only a tiny amount in lyrics (because sometimes you do need to simply get to the bridge).

 

Also, any and all poetry/lyrics using the following imagery should REALLY prompt the author to revisit whether or not the following words are the very best, most accurate words they can use given the situation --

 

eyes

hands/fingers

darkness

mirror

suffering

pain

suffocating

rain

tears

worry

longing

missing

heart

mist

heroin/opium

skin

embrace

fire

cutting

 

And so on. These are stock elements of self-conscious "deep writing." Not to say that these words can't be useful or potent within the right context. Sometimes the only word for a "fire" is "fire." But watch out for the lazy misuse of these words in a poetic/metaphorical context.

 

This post cannot be and is not exhaustive. Feel free to add your pet peeves in hopes that we can all check ourselves against lazy, unoriginal writing.

[rsadasiv]

brain/insane

[Stackabones]

I can't stand the overuse of any form of the verb "to be." Language lives in verbs.

[rsadasiv]

Do away with all progressive constructions or kill all the metaphors?

[myredshoes]

My reply got ate by the scheduled maintenance thing?

 

I support the virtue of economy, that this writing should be essential. I'm pretty much on board for the first two paragraphs.

 

I disagree with the list of words. When I need a lazy half-assed rhyme for "masturbate", I want to know that "suffocate" is there for me.

[Marko]

I think all this is more important in poetry than lyrics. There

[Sentry68]

LOL @ Myredshoes...

 

And I agree with Marko- the average listener isn't offended most of the time. Still, it's worthy to point out some of the most obvious rhyme crimes (chrymes?). It's true that some are desperately overused, but often the intent outweighs the rhyme- and there are plenty of examples of the opposite extreme... lyrics that read like a page from the dictionary with obscure or overly-complicated phrases/words.

[myredshoes]

 

I think the average listener is less sophisticated, or even fussy about the use of these words; they

[Poor Yorick]

I think all this is more important in poetry than lyrics. There

[myredshoes]

I lost my lover

while she danced

I smartipanced

and proved I was above it

[pop tarts]

i avoid any writing that looks like it was done by a fat goth chick. it's my only rule.

[Lee Knight]

 

When I need a lazy half-assed rhyme for "masturbate", I want to know that "suffocate" is there for me.

 

 

Writing a song about Michael Hutchence are you?

 

I love this thread and agree with the OP. To write the story in your head and not just fill in blanks. Oh, there's no story in your head? Then put the pencil down. One thing that's really getting on my tits is this, "nobody listens to lyrics" crap. WTF does that have to do with anything. You don't listen to great lyrics anyway. They wash over you. They take hold and grab your nuts until they've had their 3 minutes and 30 seconds.

 

Nobody pays attention to the supporting cast in movies. Nobody listens to bass, let's hire your brother. Milk and sugar cover the taste of bad coffee, buy the Folgers.

 

The craft and art of lyric writing are hugely important to the same people who think "who listens to lyrics?". They just don't realize it. They are not a poem, they are not supposed to be read. They are lyrics, meant to be heard, or more accurately, felt, and are an entirely different art form than poetry.

 

I-am-iron-man. Whoa, that's rad and scared the {censored} out of me when I was a kid.

 

...and she's buying a stairway to... hea-e-ven... I wanted to flitter away on fairy wings and drink Jack Daniels with Page.

 

Now that your pictures in the paper being perfectly admired

And you can have anyone that you've ever desired

All you gotta tell me now is Why-why-why-why-Welcome to the Working week! EC

 

I saw her from the corner when she turned and doubled back

And started walkin' toward a coffee colored cadillac

I was pushin' through the crowd to get to where she's at

And I was campaign shouting like a southern diplomat

 

Nadine! Honey is that you?!?! Chuck Berry

 

Great lyrics are huge to not only pop or country, but to good old rock and roll.

 

Great lyrics are an important part of great songs. Rant over.

[myredshoes]

"Oh, there's no story in your head? Then put the pencil down."

 

Very lovely rant.

[Marko]

...rhyme crimes (chrymes?)...

 

 

Also

[Marko]

 

One thing that's really getting on my tits is this, "nobody listens to lyrics" crap. WTF does that have to do with anything.

 

 

Nothing

[oldnewbie]

Nobody says "Let's go listen to some lyrics."

 

I say that.

 

For me at least, the lyrics are the backbone of the song. I posted a thread a while back in SSS "ranting" that I couldn't hear the vocals on a CD that I bought. If I can't hear the lyrics I don't even want to listen to the song.

 

I can't be alone.

[Cripes]

This is very interesting from a scholarly perspective. But, it doesn't carry much valid evidence of use, popularly speaking. Constructing a message with fresh style in the traditional standards of rhyme and meter is, IMO, not too far from the last thing the average song-smithing ambition is focused upon. Metaphors, similes and other such bypasses around creativity might be tiresome, lame and even taboo for the student of poetry and creative writing but without them country music would be reduced to instrumentals. Can't have that now can we?

 

I'm for using any old tool that gets the job done to the satisfaction of the laborer.

[Poor Yorick]

 

This is very interesting from a scholarly perspective. But, it doesn't carry much valid evidence of use, popularly speaking. Constructing a message with fresh style in the traditional standards of rhyme and meter is, IMO, not too far from the last thing the average song-smithing ambition is focused upon. Metaphors, similes and other such bypasses around creativity might be tiresome, lame and even taboo for the student of poetry and creative writing but without them country music would be reduced to instrumentals. Can't have that now can we? I'm for using any old tool that gets the job done to the satisfaction of the laborer.

 

 

I didn't say metaphors, similies, and other figurative language were "wrong." Quite the contrary. That business is vital to writing -- that's why it's best not to adulterate it's power by using stock figures of speech (i.e., cliches) when there's more powerful language available.

 

Also, I think you're quite wrong in saying that "Constructing a message with fresh style in the traditional standards of rhyme and meter is, IMO, not too far from the last thing the average song-smithing ambition is focused upon." Songwriting -- because it lives to happen out loud and because it fuses words with rhythmic sound -- begs for meter in a way that "bad highschool poetry" never needs to worry about.

 

And country music because of its tradition of economical language usage requires the writer to mean what he/she says and say it well -- someone like Geo. Jones or Toby Keith would sound plenty stupid carrying on like Dylan or Black Francis with their flowery language and skewed imagery.

 

For instance, I am a great fan of Hank Williams whose figures of speach and command of meter and phrasing were pretty excellent. And phrases like "rockin' chair money" or "settin' the woods on fire" are pretty distinct and compact ways of getting their points across.

 

Hell, one of my favorite bits of rock and roll writing comes from Carl Perkins' "Dixie Fried" --

 

Well, Dan got happy and he started raving.

He pulled out a razor, but he wasn't shaving.

And all the cats knew to jump and hop,

Cause he was born and raised in a butcher shop.

 

He hollered, "Rave on, children, I'm with you!

Rave on, cats," he cried.

"It's almost dawn, the cops are gone.

Let's all get Dixie fried."

 

It doesn't seem like much, but you know EXACTLY what is going on and it feels 100% authentic and interesting and cool.

 

Basically, I'm not saying that you have to use fruity language -- if anything I'm saying good writing is the opposite of trying to use the fruitiest language possible.

[Lee Knight]

Nothing

[myredshoes]

I say that. For me at least, the lyrics are the backbone of the song. I posted a thread a while back in SSS "ranting" that I couldn't hear the vocals on a CD that I bought. If I can't hear the lyrics I don't even want to listen to the song. I can't be alone.

 

Bless you.

[Lee Knight]

Check out Katy Perry's I Kissed a Girl. There couldn't be a more sensationalistic, manipulative idea for a song out there. A hot 23 year old writes about kissing a chick... and digging it. I'm all for it. And what a sell out. Easy to write off. Except that Perry writes her ass off. She excepted the challenge to write a song a day for a year as suggested to her by a producer friend. Her execution is awesome. And, I think maybe she did kiss a girl. A least her writing is good enough to convince...

 

This was never the way I planned

Not my intention

I got so brave, drink in hand

Lost my discretion

 

It's not what

I'm used to

Just wanna try u on

I'm curious for you

Caught my attention

 

(CHORUS)

I kissed a girl and I liked it

The taste of her cherry chapstick

I kissed a girl just to try it

I hope my boyfriend don't mind it

It felt so wrong

It felt so right

Don't mean I'm in love tonight

I kissed a girl and I liked it

I liked it

 

(V2)

No I don't even know your name

It doesn't matter

You're my expiramental game

Just human nature

 

It's not what

Good girls do

Not how they should behave

My head gets

So confused

Hard to obey

 

(CHORUS)

I kissed a girl and I liked it

The taste of her cherry chapstick

I kissed a girl just to try it

I hope my boyfriend don't mind it

It felt so wrong

It felt so right

Don't mean I'm in love tonight

I kissed a girl and I liked it

I liked it

 

(BRIDGE)

Us girls we are so magical

Soft skin, red lips, so kissable

Hard to resist so touchable

Too good to deny it

Ain't no big deal, it's innocent

 

(CHORUS)

I kissed a girl and I liked it

The taste of her cherry chapstick

I kissed a girl just to try it

I hope my boyfriend don't mind it

It felt so wrong

It felt so right

Don't mean I'm in love tonight

I kissed a girl and I liked it

I liked it

[sgiven]

There was another song in the 90's with a girl singing about how she kissed a girl. Funny enough it was titled "I kissed a girl". The music and lyrics are different, but the general point and intent of the song was the same. I think her name was Jill Sobule.

 

And as my contribution to this post...

 

She loves you, yeah, yeah, yeah

She loves you, yeah, yeah, yeah

She loves you, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah

 

I agree that in many (very good) songs, lyrics can go beyond secondary and become irrelevant even. Just sounds to sing. Like a vocal instrumental, if you know what I mean. How many songs have you listened to and enjoyed when you couldn't even understand most of the lyrics.

 

And I say this as someone who has spent a great deal of time writing (fiction, not songs).

[blue2blue]

 

I can't stand the overuse of any form of the verb "to be." Language lives in verbs.

 

 

To be, or not to be--that is the question:

Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer

The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune

Or to take arms against a sea of troubles

And by opposing end them. To die, to sleep--

No more--and by a sleep to say we end

The heartache, and the thousand natural shocks

That flesh is heir to. 'Tis a consummation

Devoutly to be wished. To die, to sleep--

To sleep--perchance to dream: ay, there's the rub,

For in that sleep of death what dreams may come

When we have shuffled off this mortal coil,

Must give us pause.

 

-- that Shakey guy

 

 

 

Rules are made to be broken.

 

But -- really -- it's no fun unless you know the rules you're breaking.

[Miskatonic]

One thing to note is that you can get away with lyrics that would probably sound completely lame if it wasn't set to music.

[ProgRock11]

Maybe it's because lyrics are not poetry, they're words to a song. Just because you write something that rhymes, has meter, and follows a certain structure doesn't make it poetry...it makes it poetic (poetry-like). Simply meaning that it's written in verse and not in prose format. Lyricist are not contributing to literature, they're crafting melody and meaning into song structure, which in its self is a beautiful thing...it's just not poetry.