Members New Trail Posted June 13, 2011 Members Share Posted June 13, 2011 Intro, verse, verse, chorus, solo, verse, chorus, outro? Do we need to add a bridge every time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members dramey Posted June 13, 2011 Members Share Posted June 13, 2011 I'm on the fence when it comes to bridges. Too many of them are added in after the fact because they are "supposed" to be there and not because they add anything to the song. Some actually ruin songs for me. For me a bridge needs to justify its existence. I use them about half of the time. Mine usually come from a lyric that fits in the song, but not over the chords as they are played in the verse. When it works, it is great for breaking up the monotony of a song, when it doesn't I will throw it out instead of trying to make it fit. Some of it also has to do with the length of a song, a 5 minute song will need one more than a 3 minute song. This is all just my opinion though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bee3 Posted June 13, 2011 Members Share Posted June 13, 2011 What's a bridge? Are you referring to the 16 bar middle 8? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Lee Knight Posted June 13, 2011 Moderators Share Posted June 13, 2011 What's a bridge? Are you referring to the 16 bar middle 8? Is it 16 or 8? No, every song does not need a bridge. Or a "middle" as some call them. Or a "middle 8", or a "middle 16". Whatever makes the song you want to make. That's the only thing you have to put in there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bee3 Posted June 13, 2011 Members Share Posted June 13, 2011 Is it 16 or 8? No, every song does not need a bridge. Or a "middle" as some call them. Or a "middle 8", or a "middle 16". Whatever makes the song you want to make. That's the only thing you have to put in there. To Lennon and McCartney, it didn't matter.... everything was a middle 8. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blue2blue Posted June 13, 2011 Members Share Posted June 13, 2011 Yes, if it doesn't have a bridge then it is technically not a song because everything has to be exactly the same as everything else. That's why they call it self-expression. So for the love of god, make sure you do it exactly the same or you might spontaneously combust.This helps explain why I keep bursting into flames... sometimes at the most awkward moments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Matximus Posted June 13, 2011 Members Share Posted June 13, 2011 Not if you do a solo instead of singing a third verse. Just do the solo over where the third verse should be. Nirvana often did this and it always struck me as pretty damn fine. But Kurt Cobain could be pretty damn lazy, songwriting-wise. But it worked for him. When you also don't need a bridge: if you have a {censored}ty idea for a bridge but think you just need a bridge. The bridge should be as good as the chorus; Sticking one one just to do it is stupid. Just end the song then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blue2blue Posted June 13, 2011 Members Share Posted June 13, 2011 Not if you do a solo instead of singing a third verse. Just do the solo over where the third verse should be. Nirvana often did this and it always struck me as pretty damn fine. But Kurt Cobain could be pretty damn lazy, songwriting-wise. But it worked for him. When you also don't need a bridge: if you have a {censored}ty idea for a bridge but think you just need a bridge. The bridge should be as good as the chorus; Sticking one one just to do it is stupid. Just end the song then.I'm with you on this. A bridge is only good if it improves the song. And, indeed, solo/improv oriented styles of music do pretty well with a solo over a verse or chorus or part of a one. But, when a bridge really works, it can really help out a song. It might seem paradoxical, but even when the writer is already concerned about the length of a song, a good bridge -- the right bridge -- can actually help make a song feel more interesting by providing a (possibly much needed) change-up just when the listener is feeling restless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kurdy Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 I used to believe that every song I wrote had to have a bridge and it was lazy not to write one. Now I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Marshal Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 No, but every river does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members dparr Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 I hear a lot of modern songs that are missing the middle eight or bridge. To me that's what keeps some of them from being great songs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Oswlek Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 A better question, does every bridge need a song? I hear a lot of modern songs that are missing the middle eight or bridge.To me that's what keeps some of them from being great songs. I don't know. These guys have quite a few solid numbers without any middle 8s or bridges. [video=youtube;4A3pX_shcyU] [video=youtube;ZYilXOe9ML4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZYilXOe9ML4&feature=related [video=youtube;hfWEPu0w-7w] So the guys who pretty much coined the phrase "middle 8" didn't feel every song needed one. I'd say it is safe to say they aren't necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members dparr Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 So the guys who pretty much coined the phrase "middle 8" didn't feel every song needed one. I'd say it is safe to say they aren't necessary. I'm a huge fan of the Beatles. One reason they could get away with bridgeless songs is to keep it short, sweet and catchy. The problem with a lot of modern songs is that they are way too long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Cliftonb Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 I'm not even sure to what extent bridges are used anymore. I haven't really heard any bridges in quite a long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Oswlek Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 I'm not even sure to what extent bridges are used anymore. I haven't really heard any bridges in quite a long time. Really? I hear them all the time, mostly as a substitute for what would have been a guitar solo in the 80's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Cliftonb Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 Really? I hear them all the time, mostly as a substitute for what would have been a guitar solo in the 80's. Maybe it's just from where I'm standing. I've heard a lot of truly awesome songs over the last several years, but can't say I've heard many bridges. Or guitar solos for that matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members LCK Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 Do we need to add a bridge every time? No. "In the Wee Small Hours of the Morning." Two 8-bar verses. That's it. [video=youtube;2XdN4SDYwyc] The Beach Boys, "I Get Around:" Intro, Chorus, Verse, Break, Verse, Chorus, Break, Solo, Verse, Break, Verse, Chorus, Intro, Chorus. And all in 2:10. [video=youtube;TCeD_6Y3GQc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCeD_6Y3GQc "Our Love Is Here to Stay," by George and Ira Gershwin (with Vernon Duke). 2 verses, that's it. [video=youtube;rOJNb9XCRwY] "At Long Last Love," by Cole Porter. 2 verses, that's it. [video=youtube;-VfcdsiJBDs]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VfcdsiJBDs&playnext=1&list=PLAE0914A26D8399C8 "The Days of Wine and Roses," by Henry Mancini and Johnny Mercer. 2 verses, that's it. [video=youtube;YwUY4BS5ibQ]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwUY4BS5ibQ "Cold, Cold Heart," by Hank Williams. 3 verses. [video=youtube;usxi3mk1k3g]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=usxi3mk1k3g&feature=related "Like a Rolling Stone," by Bob Dylan. Verse, Chorus, Verse, Chorus, Verse, Chorus. [video=youtube;hk3mAX5xdxo]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hk3mAX5xdxo LCK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members New Trail Posted June 14, 2011 Author Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 I'm not even sure to what extent bridges are used anymore. I haven't really heard any bridges in quite a long time. Listen to "All the Single Ladies" by Beyonce...AWESOME bridge, maybe better than the verses IMO. Lately a lot of bridges are rap parts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Cliftonb Posted June 14, 2011 Members Share Posted June 14, 2011 I've heard "Single Ladies". It was pretty inescapable a couple years ago. I'm still leaning toward the notion that bridges are the more the exception than the rule these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Lee Knight Posted June 14, 2011 Moderators Share Posted June 14, 2011 Lately a lot of bridges are rap parts. That is a great point. It's the new bridge. I look to see a nice hybrid of old fashioned middles married to a hip hop/rap aesthetic. Right now they're supplanting them. I'd like to see both paradigms working together. A middle is a great way to zap out of the action and say, "meanwhile, I was thinking..." then zap back in. They're fun once you get the zeitgeist... no... the fun of what a bridge offers your tune. MiddleMiddle 8Middle 16?BridgeRelease Our terms are {censored}ed up and in transition. The part that happens once and steps away for a different POV. Except sometimes we repeat them too. Damn. I prefer 'Bridge' and keep clear that the 'prechorus' is not a bridge. That clears it up for me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members w,wert Posted June 20, 2011 Members Share Posted June 20, 2011 some songs do not even have choruses , I think Lady Madonna was just verse and bridges ,the latter being the days of the week thing. It wasnt a chorus and it did change keys like a bridge characteristically does but I dont know . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members New Trail Posted June 20, 2011 Author Members Share Posted June 20, 2011 ... I think Lady Madonna was just verse and bridges ,the latter being the days of the week thing..... Hmm, that's the part that FEELS like a bridge to me, the "Friday night arrives..." but really it seems more like a verse than the "Lady Madonna, children at your feet" part does, but, either way, that song definitely does not follow any normal formal. There's not an actual chorus, either... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Brusco Posted June 23, 2011 Members Share Posted June 23, 2011 Really?, I always thought a bridge was either the small segment leading into or out of the chorus. "See how they Run" would be what I would call the bridge In Lady Madonna. For instance, since we're using the Beatles as a platform, Ticket to ride has a VERSE (I think I'm gonna be sad), CHORUS (she's got a ticket to ride), and a MIDDLE 8 ("don't know why she's riding so high"). The bridge would be the small guitar lead after the middle 8 which leads back into the verse again "shes gonna think twice she's gonna do right by me" BRIDGE>> short segment playing 5th chord E lead riff on it)). FWIW the guitar lead or riff on the bridge was played by McCartney. Lennon and McCartney would always picked up where the other left off or may have been stuck without a chorus or middle 8. We Can Work it out is one song that comes to mind. Lennon wrote the middle 8. I would consider the chorus to be the bridge in this song. No? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members New Trail Posted June 23, 2011 Author Members Share Posted June 23, 2011 I thought a 'bridge' and a 'middle 8' was the same thing, but maybe not. I guess we could have a pre-bridge or pre-chorus... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Oswlek Posted June 23, 2011 Members Share Posted June 23, 2011 I thought a 'bridge' and a 'middle 8' was the same thing, but maybe not. I guess we could have a pre-bridge or pre-chorus... A bridge can be the lift between the verse and chorus or it can be a middle 8. They are both technically bridges, thougj different types. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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