Members Babel2 Posted April 1, 2006 Members Share Posted April 1, 2006 I recently bought a Taylor 410 Ltd edition (Rosewood back and sides instead of evonkol). Seemed like a good idea at the time but now I really wish I had gone for the 410 standard model. The 410 Ltd ed is beautiful except that there is way too much bass in the tone for me - it has a wooliness that I just can't get away from. I changed the strings twice - to DR phosphor bronze and back to a fresh set of Elixirs (both 13s). I just wonder if there are any tricks or tips I can use to reduce the boominess?(no I'm not going to spend the next 25 years of my playing career only picking next to the bridge). Also worried that as it ages it will get more boomy - true/false? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Cldplytkmn Posted April 1, 2006 Members Share Posted April 1, 2006 first taylor i've ever heard it said had too much bass... try some 12s on there, but after that... some different string types... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Babel2 Posted April 1, 2006 Author Members Share Posted April 1, 2006 Thanks - so dropping to 12s will make a noticable difference? I really like the sound of non coated strings but after a week with the DRs there was nothing but boom left :-( I want to try a few brands but where I am there are VERY limited options. Any ideas on what brand to order for less bass and more zing/punchy top end (especially as they get a bit older) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members knockwood Posted April 1, 2006 Members Share Posted April 1, 2006 Originally posted by Babel2 Thanks - so dropping to 12s will make a noticable difference? I really like the sound of non coated strings but after a week with the DRs there was nothing but boom left :-( I want to try a few brands but where I am there are VERY limited options. Any ideas on what brand to order for less bass and more zing/punchy top end (especially as they get a bit older) If you want brighter/less boom, maybe give 80/20 or 85/15's a shot. But in terms of aging... the exceptional brightness tends to fade fairly quickly. I like p/b's because (A) I'm not a bright kind of guy and (3) they tend to remain relatively tonally consistent. Someone will eventually suggest coated strings... Don't do it, man. I'm with Clippity in that I think this is the first complaint I've heard about too much boominess in a Taylor. More than strings, the solution I'd suggest is mahogany... My 310 doesn't give me near the boom I tend to like. Ultimately I'm gonna have to just sell that sucker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Babel2 Posted April 1, 2006 Author Members Share Posted April 1, 2006 excuse my ignorance but what are 80/20 or 85/15? the exceptional brightness tends to fade fairly quickly I guess its really more a matter of dropping the bass than anything. The top end of the gtr is beautiful - I just want it to come through without being overpowered by the bass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JasmineTea Posted April 1, 2006 Members Share Posted April 1, 2006 I think you bought the wrong guitar. Lighter strings, 80/20s, whatever, will change the tone some, but it's not quite like having a tone control. Also, lighter strings will feel different. IMO, extra bass is a good thing. Gives you more sound to work with. I suggest you learn to play that particular guitar accordingly, and save up for something with a different voice. I like having a bunch of guitars for the purpose of getting different sounds. But each of them has to be played with a different touch in order to bring out the best in them. Some require a softer touch on the bass strings, some not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members knockwood Posted April 1, 2006 Members Share Posted April 1, 2006 Originally posted by Babel2 what are 80/20 or 85/15? 80/20 & 85/15 are string compositions - percentages of copper/tin phosphide. Typical bronze used for strings (just the exterior windings - the core is steel) is about 90 to 95% copper & 5 to 10% Tin Phosphide. The latter is much more brittle than copper, so generally the higher the concentration of tin, the brighter the tone of the strings. The reason the brightness wears so quickly is that the less supple tin in the windings contributes to quicker fraying off the steel core as a result of vibration... So after a few days, a week (depending on how hard/how often you play), they'll sound more or less like regular p/b strings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members knockwood Posted April 1, 2006 Members Share Posted April 1, 2006 Originally posted by JasmineTea I think you bought the wrong guitar. Lighter strings, 80/20s, whatever, will change the tone some, but it's not quite like having a tone control. Also, lighter strings will feel different.IMO, extra bass is a good thing. Gives you more sound to work with. I agree with all of this. I bought the wrong guitar myself (also a Taylor), but wrong for the opposite reason. Not dark enough for me. There are things I like about it but ultimately I can't make it work for me the way I want it to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Hudman Posted April 1, 2006 Members Share Posted April 1, 2006 A Taylor with too much bass? I thought that was an oxymoron. I'm not sure that you can reduce the amount of bass by much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JasmineTea Posted April 1, 2006 Members Share Posted April 1, 2006 I'm an oxy-moron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Hudman Posted April 1, 2006 Members Share Posted April 1, 2006 Originally posted by JasmineTea I'm an oxy-moron. I'm a standard, run of the mill, moron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Freeman Keller Posted April 1, 2006 Members Share Posted April 1, 2006 Babel, have you tried boning it? Changing the saddle on my 314 added a lot of mid sparkle, but it wasn't overly bassy to start with. Of course a dread will always be bass heavy, that is the nature of the beast. My personal feeling is that PB strings are brighter than 80/20 but others will argue the opposite. I happen to like Nano PB's for my Taylor, but since it is a GA and not a dread that may not apply directly. The standard Elixers are 80/20's so changing to Nano PB (make sure you don't get the regular Nanos, they are 80/20 also) might brighten it. I also play fingerstyle with flesh and nails - I assume you are flat picking your 410. I also agree that light gauge will reduce both the volume and the bottom end. Rosewood is usually felt to have the most complex sound, but ovangkol is very similar so I doubt if the your choice of wood was wrong. Last comment, I don't think Taylors "open up" as much as some guitars, but it will probably become both more complex, a little louder, and yes, maybe a bit bassier. Last opinion, change one thing at a time - strings but not saddle, then saddle with the same strings. That way you can really tell what worked. Good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members solitaire Posted April 1, 2006 Members Share Posted April 1, 2006 Babel2: sounds to me you bought a Dreadnought when you should have bought a Grand Concert or something. Dreadnoughts are made to boom. Taylors are not know to pronounce these frequencies much, so those oxy-morons have some point in saying that. Anyway I'd return that guitar whilst still new. Dreadnoughts are rhythm instruments most of all, so If I were you I would have gone smaller and with more of a waistline to the guitar, espec if I had single note picking ambitions on my mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members knockwood Posted April 1, 2006 Members Share Posted April 1, 2006 Originally posted by Freeman Keller Babel, have you tried boning it? I love my guitars too, man... but that's just sick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Freeman Keller Posted April 1, 2006 Members Share Posted April 1, 2006 Originally posted by knockwood I love my guitars too, man... but that's just sick. You don't think that will raise its voice an octave or two? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members knockwood Posted April 1, 2006 Members Share Posted April 1, 2006 Originally posted by Freeman Keller You don't think that will raise its voice an octave or two? One of the more extreme methods I've heard suggested... But good point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Babel2 Posted April 2, 2006 Author Members Share Posted April 2, 2006 Originally posted by solitaire Babel2: sounds to me you bought a Dreadnought when you should have bought a Grand Concert or something. Dreadnoughts are made to boom. Taylors are not know to pronounce these frequencies much, so those oxy-morons have some point in saying that. Anyway I'd return that guitar whilst still new. Dreadnoughts are rhythm instruments most of all, so If I were you I would have gone smaller and with more of a waistline to the guitar, espec if I had single note picking ambitions on my mind. I tried the 414 ltd ed too - heart melting for fingerpicking but I do prefer the 410 for flat picking. Just without quite as much boom... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kwakatak Posted April 2, 2006 Members Share Posted April 2, 2006 Originally posted by knockwood I love my guitars too, man... but that's just sick. One can only imagine what method he'd suggest for reaming out the endpin hole during a K&K PW installation!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Babel2 Posted April 2, 2006 Author Members Share Posted April 2, 2006 Originally posted by JasmineTea I think you bought the wrong guitar. Lighter strings, 80/20s, whatever, will change the tone some, but it's not quite like having a tone control. Also, lighter strings will feel different.IMO, extra bass is a good thing. Gives you more sound to work with. I suggest you learn to play that particular guitar accordingly, and save up for something with a different voice.I like having a bunch of guitars for the purpose of getting different sounds. But each of them has to be played with a different touch in order to bring out the best in them. Some require a softer touch on the bass strings, some not. I think you are right. When I bought it I tried a 310, 410, 2*410 Ltd eds, 2*510.Eventually I wittled it down to 410 vs 410 ltd ed. 410 had uncoated strings ltd ed had elixirs and 410 normal had a deeper fuller tone I liked. I asked the shop to put elixirs on it to compare the 2 on equal footing. With same strings they were extremely similar - just the ltd ed was slightly darker and boomier. For some stupid reason I thought I'd get the one with more boom and eq it out etc but now its just driving me nuts. Though I did just realise they put 12s on so that could have something to do with it ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Babel2 Posted April 2, 2006 Author Members Share Posted April 2, 2006 Originally posted by knockwood I love my guitars too, man... but that's just sick. LOL :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members knockwood Posted April 2, 2006 Members Share Posted April 2, 2006 Originally posted by kwakatak One can only imagine what method he'd suggest for reaming out the endpin hole during a K&K PW installation!!! Well, THAT sure as hell reinforces my inclination to steer clear of electronics... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Babel2 Posted April 2, 2006 Author Members Share Posted April 2, 2006 Originally posted by Freeman Keller You don't think that will raise its voice an octave or two? :D tears So which hole do I use ?? sorry bout that one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Babel2 Posted April 2, 2006 Author Members Share Posted April 2, 2006 will the nanoweb coating offer me any protection? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members knockwood Posted April 2, 2006 Members Share Posted April 2, 2006 Oh dear... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Babel2 Posted April 2, 2006 Author Members Share Posted April 2, 2006 sorry On a more serious note would changing to a bone saddle give me any of the effect I'm after - I read a recent post where the bone saddle made things even more boomyhttp://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1194874&highlight=boom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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